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Thread: cold water extraction

  1. #31
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    I thought it would be a good idea to have this in the hydrocodone forum, and a permanent redirect in the chemistry / hydrocodone forum where it was originally posted. That way it can be found in both places as this is a question that gets brought up a lot, and a thread that gets viewed a whole lot.

    Unless there are any objections of course.

  2. #32
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    I've got a couple questions regarding this extraction method:

    I'm working with hydrocodone, usually 5 (quantity) 5/500mg tablets at a time. I'm looking to get around 20mg, and figuring that something will be lost, I use 5 tablets. I powder the tabs to the finest consistency possibly, then add 2-3ml of warm water per tab, then stir for about one minute.

    I put the mix in the freezer because frankly, I'm impatient. I wait about 30 minutes and pour through a coffee filter into a container. After 30 minutes, the temp according to the thermometer is usually between 35-40 degrees farenheit. Note that no real 'crystals' have formed, but I see a lot of 'gunk' at the bottom of the vessel.

    Now, the questions:

    -Is that cold enough to really separate the acetaminophen from the narcotic?
    -Does rinsing twice make a difference?

    One more thing...I am not too confident in the accuracy of this method, because it seems that compared to the volume of the original pile of powder before adding water in the first place, the amount of acetaminophen that ends up as filtrate is comparatively small.

    Also, the end result for me is *mostly* clear water, depending on the angle it is viewed at. It appears to have a small amount of powder remaining (acetaminophen), but is pretty clear.

    Does this sound right?

  3. #33
    Occasionally Opiated bluide*devil is an unknown quantity at this point bluide*devil's Avatar
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Quote Originally Posted by cactus31 View Post
    I put the mix in the freezer because frankly, I'm impatient.

    Now, the questions:

    -Is that cold enough to really separate the acetaminophen from the narcotic?
    -Does rinsing twice make a difference?

    One more thing...I am not too confident in the accuracy of this method, because it seems that compared to the volume of the original pile of powder before adding water in the first place, the amount of acetaminophen that ends up as filtrate is comparatively small.

    Does this sound right?
    1. yes. acetaminophen/APAP gets less soluble the lower the water temp. so, even at 35-40F, the APAP is more soluble than it would be at a higher temperature. as you noticed, there is APAP left over from your extraction, however small (in your experience). but a lower temp will allow even more APAP to be removed. and make sure your solution is fluid, not a runny paste. for 5 pills, SWIM would use about 1/8th cup of water, maybe a little more.

    2. maybe. SWIM's never noticed an appreciable difference, but it couldn't hurt.

    as far as the freezer method, when SWIM is really impatient he just puts ice cubes in the glass and stirs until the water is freezing cold/or puts it back in the freezer, stirring occasionally. then he removes the ice cubes (and sucks on them briefly) and filters the solution. it takes about 5 minutes for the water to get really cold. i don't think that more water will hurt the extraction. it hasn't for SWIM, anyway.

    sounds like your method is 'sound'.

    i think that the volume of APAP left in the filter looks like less than what was in the pill because it is wet (and squeezed into a new shape), and has more surface area than the original pill.

    now give me your soul. :sandm:
    Last edited by bluide*devil; 07-11-2007 at 01:49 AM.

  4. #34
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Here is the simplest CWE I can think of. It is easy and it takes less than 1 minute:

    All you need is: 2 glasses (or anything that can hold water); Tissue paper; Spoon (or your finger, anything to stir with); Water.

    STEP 1. Put pills in the first container. Pour enough COLD water to completely submerge pills (from the sink, no need to cool it in fridge). No need for excessive water. Stir untill all pills are completely dissolved.

    STEP 2. Take 2 pieces of tissue on top of each other, hold them on top of the second container like a filter; gently pour contents of container 1 through filter into container 2.

    THAT'S IT! drink the water, discard the stuff caught in the filter.

    It is THAT easy. Of course, this is the bearbones of it, just to show how easy it is so that you have no excuse not to do it! For a more refined process, do a search. But this as-is WORKS. Not only will your liver thank me for reminding you of this and saving its life, but also you will when you find your drugs are hitting you faster and harder!
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  5. #35
    OpioNoMo Jocko is an unknown quantity at this point
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Inspek - I've been curious about this for a while now; I think I'll try your "one minute special" - if it's not effective, I guess I can always try the more time consuming method. By the way, I'm thinking of just using 3-4 Norcos (10/325) for my first run - I'm assuming this would be sufficient, no?

  6. #36
    Opiophorum Member jwalm is an unknown quantity at this point jwalm's Avatar
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    why are you guys doing CWE on 3-4 pills with 325mg of APAP in each pill?-just swallow the pills

    even with 5 pills of 500mg APAP i would just swallow the five pills, unless i have been taking pills that contain APAP consistently

    like many people here, i have taken ungodly amounts of acetaminophen in the past (amounts I am embarrassed to divulge)

    and using Kleenex to filter? wouldn't those tear super easy? use Melitta natural brown filters.

    a normal CWE for me consists of 30-40 10mg/500mg hydrocodone/APAP pills-unfortunately i don't have access to shit loads of free opiates like i used to

  7. #37
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    coffee filters work best or a cotton tee shirt, yet I was explaining a bare none essential use with and if u had nothing to use but still reliable


    oh and if u have 4 norcos, just eating them isnt bad for your liver at all
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  8. #38
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Quote Originally Posted by jwalm View Post
    why are you guys doing CWE on 3-4 pills with 325mg of APAP in each pill?-just swallow the pills

    I don't know what to tell you, man - I just thought I'd try it. Perhaps you're right - maybe I should use a bit more, but since I've never done it before, I figured I'd try it on just a few pills to check it out. That's the best answer I can give you, my friend.

  9. #39
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    I don't usually bother unless it's over 2 grams of APAP that you're looking at or you're going to be drinking with the pills. It is really easy to do though, maybe do a practice run on 6-7 pills just so you know the routine. Tissue does work fine but it will tear if you're not careful. Make sure that whatever you use for filtering, you get it wet first.
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  10. #40
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    And there is also the option of buying pure hydrocodone. Knoll/Abbott's DICODID 10mg is the best brand, if you can find it, being manufactured in Germany. Warning though; it is NOT an analgesic in Europe but an antitussive, and any mention of needing hydrocodone for pain will result in no script and no delivery. Dry, hacking, painful cough is the indication. Only in the USA is hydrocodone used as a painkiller, which is probably why it must be adulterated with a non-narcotic analgesic by law.
    Gaucho

  11. #41
    Occasionally Opiated somadude is an unknown quantity at this point
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Quote Originally Posted by chemboy7 View Post
    Actually, they don't put anything special in the Immodium to constipate you other than the active ingredient, Loperamide. Loperamide is an Opaite and thus constipates you... as do all Opaites. As to the question about using it to potentiate the effects of Opaites, as I tried to convey in my previous post and messed up, I believe that Loperamide blocks your opoid receptors like Naltrexone or Bup. making it counterproductive.
    Loperasmide is one of the strongest opiates that there is. Only one problem, It does not cros the blood brain barrier. SO you only get the srrects on the gut-constipation. I have read if you take a lot more than the therapeutic dose (I dont remember how much, thats what the internet is for) you wil get a weak darvon like buzz.
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  12. #42
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    One quick question.. I am doing a CWE on some hydro 5/500 and I added the water and stuck it in the freezer.. like a dumb ass, I forgot about it... and the top of it froze.. is this a problem? I mean, it was only about 1/8th of an inch on the top that froze... will it still be okay or does extreme cold degrade the hydrocodone in it? Thanks!

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  13. #43
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    I had that happen to me once also. I just let the ice thaw out and everything was fine. No worries man.
    it's up or out and the ladder's on fire

  14. #44
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    i'll put this here

    Regarding CWE with propoxyphene(darvocet,darvon):

    I think darvocets suck and aren't worth it. If you have any kind of opiate tolerance they serve
    a better use as earplugs

    Propoxyphene Napsylate (Darvocet-N) is "very slightly soluble in water"

    Propoxyphene Hydrochloride (Darvon) is "freely soluble in water" but needs no CWE
    because there is no APAP in it. i think there is a darvon aspirin combo though.

    Propoxyphene Napsylate was put on the market so it cannot be easily soluble in water. They did this on purpose to prevent abuse. It is soluble in Ethanol (EtOH).

    Approximate quantity of solvent by volume for one part of soluble by weight. For example, 1g of a very soluble substance dissolves in less than 1ml of solvent.


    Very soluble less than 1 part

    Freely soluble from 1 to 10 parts

    Soluble from 10 to 30 parts

    Sparingly soluble from 30 to 100 parts

    Slightly soluble from 100 to 1000 parts

    Very slightly soluble from 1000 to 10,000 parts

    Practically insoluble more than 10,000 parts


    Acetominophen solubility:

    cold water: ? (rather insolube) i couldn't find the ratio
    water 1:70
    boiling water 1:20
    alcohol 1:10
    chloroform 1:50
    glycerin 1:40
    ether slightly soluble

    i would never condone the use of any method to alter or manipulate a controlled substance in any way.I also do not recommend the transfer of any controlled substance from the person who it is
    prescribed to any other person. that is illegal and i would never break any law whatsoever.
    all of the above is purely for artistic interpretation and is fictional as far as i know.
    Last edited by WarmCyanide; 09-15-2008 at 09:12 PM.
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  15. #45
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Does the liquid in question for CWE have to be water? Wondering if one could use ice tea, fruit punch, juice, etc?

  16. #46
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    The previous post should serve as a full explanation as to why I'm closing this thread. There's a lot of good info in here. If any new, earth-shattering news happens in the field of CWE either start a new thread or ask one of us mods to re-open this one.
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  17. #47
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Also since its closed, one of our awesome members made a video on doing a CWEl

    You can find it here.

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