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Thread: cold water extraction

  1. #1
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    Default cold water extraction

    anyone have any tips, I've never done it, but I'm worried about losing too much hydrocodone in the process.
    hydrocodone/apap 7.5/750
    fucking evil that they put that much tylenol in it
    "The magnitude of pleasure reaches its limit in the removal of all pain. When such pleasure is present, so long as it is uninterrupted, there is no pain either of body or of mind or of both together." -Epicurus
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  2. #2
    bi11i
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    Re: cold water extraction

    surely. here's the straight dope, courtesy of neonjoint.com:

    Below is an example of a codeine extraction. The idea behind the following extraction is that
    acetaminophen and aspirin (I'll use A/A from now on) are very
    _insoluble_ in cold water. Codeine phosphate (the most common
    salt of codeine) is very _soluble_ in water including cold water.
    The following table explains:

    Solubility (31C water) Solubility (21C water)

    Aspirin 1g / 100 ml 1g / 300ml

    Acetaminophen 1g / 70 ml 1g / 150 ml

    Codeine 1g / 2.3 ml 1g / 0.7 ml
    Phosphate

    So as you can see, both A/A aren't very soluble in 21C
    water, so if you cool the water to around 10C, the solubility will
    drop even further. That way you can dissolve 20 tablets in 50ml
    of hot water, cool the water down to 10C, filter the solution and
    end up with the same amount of codeine as the tablets contained
    but only a fraction of the original amount of A/A.

    [...]

    1. Obtain a quantity of tablets containing codeine, check to
    see if they contain anything other than codeine, caffeine,
    acetaminophen or aspirin. If they do, and you don't know whether
    or not it will be a problem, your best bet is not to use them.
    Measure out your desired amount of codeine (ex. 64 mg = 8 tablets
    * 8mg/tablet). You may want to add 2 extra tablets as it is quite
    likely you will lose some codeine in the procedure. As you get
    more experience with the procedure you will be able to get
    approx. 95% of the codeine extracted.

    2. Measure out some nice hot water, use approx. 40ml / 20 tablets
    or more if needed. I would suggest you don't go over 50ml for 20
    tablets. I don't know if the use of boiling water would destroy
    any of the codeine but your best bet is not to use it. Use hot
    water but not boiling. Make sure the tablets dissolve completely.
    Some dissolve on contact with water while others need some help
    dissolving by crushing them. Note : not all of the tablet will
    dissolve, there are water-insoluble fillers in the tablet and not
    all of the A/A will dissolve either(which is what we want).

    3. Place the solution in a cold bath, I just use some ice cubes
    in a container of water. Stir the mixture occasionally until the
    solution drops to about 15C or lower. You won't need a
    thermometer to measure the temperature, just make sure it's
    "cold". This will take about 30 min. If you wish to speed this
    up, you can use less water to dissolve the tablets, and add ice
    chips to cool the mixture faster. Just make sure you don't add
    so much ice that you drastically increase the volume of the mixture.

    4. Filter the solution using whatever you have. Coffee filters
    work well, but lab filters work the best. Just make sure you
    don't end up with obvious solids in the filtered solution. This
    will take about 1 hr. You may also want to rinse the solids left
    over in the filter with some ice-water to extract any remaining
    codeine.



    Side notes Pretty much anything that CAN be used IV is better if you shoot it. Snorting, on the other hand, in addition to being horrible for your sinuses, is wasteful, and just doesn't work as well. Why? Beats me. I'm only speaking from my own, and many others experience.

    Don't use alot of water, use as little as possible. Codeine,hydrocodone, Oxycodone and morphine are all sensitive to heat and light. (Some more than others).
    This method will work for oxycodone, but as a side note Percocet and most off-brands contain a relatively small amount of acetaminophen (about 350 mg or so) compared to the oxycodone (5 mg). Since oxycodone is very strong, 2 or 3 percs should have you feeling pretty darn good (as long as you don't have a huge tolerance). As a result, unless you are taking 10 or 15 percs per day, you needn't worry about acetaminophen ingestion.

  3. #3
    Occasionally Opiated Nuke is an unknown quantity at this point Nuke's Avatar
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Yah thats the infamous Cold water extraction. I initially use the cold water extraction before washing with DCM (to get rid of the caffeine) and again before I basify and extract the codeine into DCM. The thing is though that the colder it is the less apap or aspirin is dissolved in the solution so getting it down to like 1° or so is more preferable before decanting and filtering. The colder it is the less shit is absorbed, so once you get it down to just above freezing and you pour it in your filter put the filtering solution into the refridgerator. Even siphoning, after the sediment has settled is satisfactory. And yes the exact same procedure should work with most narcotic/apap pils ie vicodin, percocet etc. The ones that wont work is Oxycontin or MS contin, Dilaudid. Alot of the have a bunch of shit that trys to make any would be mainliner ruin his dope. if some of the inactives on the monograph say " ion-exchange resin, silicon dioxide, cellulose wax" and junk like that the chances are youre gonna ruin it if you try to extract them.

  4. #4
    jacky
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    what is DCM? dichloromethane? I dont really mind the caffeine myself, but then only consume 80-150 milligrams of codeine daily, with the caffeine content being twice that I barely notice. of course no caffeine would probaly allow some skilled in the art of chmestry to convert said chemical into morphine more easily I imagine.

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    Occasionally Opiated Nuke is an unknown quantity at this point Nuke's Avatar
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Ya, DCM = dichloromethane. Its more for people who either want to take their codeine and play with it or have really dilute pills like the 8mg cod with 15 mg of caff, 100 pills you get around 1 1/2 grams of caffeine which is a shit load! And yah if you tried to synth your codeine with alot of caffeine you would get some really funky primordial soup.

  6. #6
    New Opiophile bdubya13 is an unknown quantity at this point
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    does this work for vicaprophen?.....cold water extraction that is

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    New Opiophile tylerdurden is an unknown quantity at this point
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    how would you go about extracting codeine from codeine apap elixer?

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    Occasionally Opiated Nuke is an unknown quantity at this point Nuke's Avatar
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    does this work for vicaprophen?.....cold water extraction that is
    Yes it does.

    how would you go about extracting codeine from codeine apap elixir?
    Elixir? as in like cough syrup ? If so I'd say forget about it, usually it's really dilute and not even worth it, plus it's allot more complicated because of glycerin and other junk.
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    New Opiophile shercakes is an unknown quantity at this point shercakes's Avatar
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    instead of putting in a cold bath for 1/2 hr you can put it in a freezer for a couple of minutes-i'm refering to cwe of pills-,

  10. #10
    Occasionally Opiated Nuke is an unknown quantity at this point Nuke's Avatar
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    instead of putting in a cold bath for 1/2 hr you can put it in a freezer for a couple of minutes-i'm refering to cwe of pills-,
    Thats usually the way people go about doing it, a couple minutes however won't drop the temerature much at all, 20 minutes or so is closer, or when you see tiny pieces of ice starting to form on the surface around the wall of the container.
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Quote Originally Posted by bi11i
    Side notes Pretty much anything that CAN be used IV is better if you shoot it. Snorting, on the other hand, in addition to being horrible for your sinuses, is wasteful, and just doesn't work as well. Why? Beats me. I'm only speaking from my own, and many others experience.

    Don't use alot of water, use as little as possible. Codeine,hydrocodone, Oxycodone and morphine are all sensitive to heat and light. (Some more than others).
    This method will work for oxycodone, but as a side note Percocet and most off-brands contain a relatively small amount of acetaminophen (about 350 mg or so) compared to the oxycodone (5 mg). Since oxycodone is very strong, 2 or 3 percs should have you feeling pretty darn good (as long as you don't have a huge tolerance). As a result, unless you are taking 10 or 15 percs per day, you needn't worry about acetaminophen ingestion.


    Please correct me if I am wrong, but everything that I have been told is that codeine is poisonous if IV'd. There are a plethora of threads on P.org re: the toxicity of IV'ing C. Input please....


    ~S~
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  12. #12
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    IV codeine is harmful, it can cause pulmonary edema, facial swelling, and all kinds of other nasty things. it's also very pointless because codeine needs to be metabolized in the liver first before it can do anything good.
    "The magnitude of pleasure reaches its limit in the removal of all pain. When such pleasure is present, so long as it is uninterrupted, there is no pain either of body or of mind or of both together." -Epicurus
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    PLEASE listen to Paregoric Kid.... that is TRUE! No bangy bangy the codiene!

    ~S~
    "Ribs soooo good...make you wanna slap yo momma!":angry-smi

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    Occasionally Opiated shoxy is an unknown quantity at this point shoxy's Avatar
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    my sinuses are shot to hell and all that extraction business seems like a pain in the ass....any of you have a sore in your nose or does your nose feel sore really bad to the touch? just wondering....shit town shit drugs...
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    Opiophorum Member paesan will become famous soon enough paesan will become famous soon enough paesan will become famous soon enough paesan will become famous soon enough paesan will become famous soon enough paesan's Avatar
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Is your nose really sore when you touch it and slightly red??? Check the side of your face on the side that your nose is soar, near your ear and your jaw joint and see if there is a swollen lymph node. If yes, you got yourself an infection girl. Give it about a week, if it doesn't go away see a doc cuz you'll need antibiotics.

    I know cuz it happens to me now after almost every coke binge I go on, especially if it's shit coke. It feels like an ingrown hair inside your nose but I assure you it's not. I've got some close enough to the front of my nose that I could look inside and see it, it looks like a giant pussy blister. I've also popped it and it fucking HURTS. I've had them so bad that my nose was noticably red and swollen for weeks and it hurt to even touch anywhere near that part of my face.

    I am currently recovering from two right now (though they seem to never really go away). If you continue to blow coke or anything else for that matter than it will not go away. I think that it has happend so many times to me that even if I do just a little coke, I'll get one regardless of the quality.

    So take it from me, do not put anything up your nose for a while. Let that shit heal or you'll be stuck like me and have them permanantly...
    Last edited by paesan; 10-11-2005 at 12:36 PM.
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    Occasionally Opiated satlelitejive is an unknown quantity at this point satlelitejive's Avatar
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    I've read alot about codiene and how it reacts to heat, but I can't seem to find anything about photosensitivity! My question is if I'm extracting small quantities of codiene, is it possible that I may be losing some of the codiene to direct contact with light? May seem like a silly question but I am curious......... and I wanted to add that coffee filters seem to allow some of the unwanted byproducts through; so for the benefit of those of us that are new to CWE get a funnel and plug the end with cotton; doing this usually leaves the wash clear which is what you want!!!!! I'm stuck on this site! if this was here a long time ago my liver would be in alot better shape.....thanks to all!

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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Quote Originally Posted by satlelitejive
    I've read alot about codiene and how it reacts to heat, but I can't seem to find anything about photosensitivity! My question is if I'm extracting small quantities of codiene, is it possible that I may be losing some of the codiene to direct contact with light?
    Yes, both heat and light will degrade Codiene, heat much more so than light. The only way I would see light deminishing the quality of your Codiene though is if you had your CWE water in an open air container (say a pyrex baking dish) and was fanning the air in an attempt to evaporate the water off slowly in a lit room. It sounds to me like you are doing a CWE and using the water portion, so for the limited amount of time that the Codiene is exposed to light you shouldn't notice any change in potency.

    If you are in fact trying to evaporate the water portion off your Codiene, the best way to do so is to get the biggest (most bottom surface area) pan, aquarium, whatever you have, and let it sit in your closet, or equally dark room with a fan gently blowing at your solution.

    --The Sock Puppet Pervert--


  18. #18
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    I learned a lot from this website: http://www.geocities.com/sowildabout...xtraction.html
    An addiction is merely having a passion for something. As a kid I was always told to find something I was passionate about....


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    Occasionally Opiated satlelitejive is an unknown quantity at this point satlelitejive's Avatar
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Well done Goa! but have any of you heard about taking loperimide(imodium) as a potentiator for the effects of codiene? Is there anything deterimental to taking the afore mentioned over along period of time?

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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Quote Originally Posted by satlelitejive
    Well done Goa! but have any of you heard about taking loperimide(imodium) as a potentiator for the effects of codiene? Is there anything deterimental to taking the afore mentioned over along period of time?

    --The Sock Puppet Pervert--


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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    As for Immodium, I know that it contains whatever they put into opiates like oc's that tends to make people constipated. I have never heard of it as a potentiator for any of the nice euphoric effetcs. Let me know what happens if you try it!
    An addiction is merely having a passion for something. As a kid I was always told to find something I was passionate about....


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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Quote Originally Posted by goagirl23
    As for Immodium, I know that it contains whatever they put into opiates like oc's that tends to make people constipated. I have never heard of it as a potentiator for any of the nice euphoric effetcs. Let me know what happens if you try it!
    Actually, they don't put anything special in the Immodium to constipate you other than the active ingredient, Loperamide. Loperamide is an Opaite and thus constipates you... as do all Opaites. As to the question about using it to potentiate the effects of Opaites, as I tried to convey in my previous post and messed up, I believe that Loperamide blocks your opoid receptors like Naltrexone or Bup. making it counterproductive.

    --The Sock Puppet Pervert--


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    Never Looked Back red26 has disabled reputation
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Lopermide having a agonist/antagonistic property? I dunno. I recall a long time ago, I think it was Paragoric Kid talking about test being done with lopermide and at a cirtain level producing a slight euphoric effect while keeping the withdrawl symptoms away. Shit I use it being I seem to be d-toxing every other week these days. For some of us its a miricle, some not so. I believe it is a straight up alkoloid derived from P.S. but then again I dont put anything past the pharmacutical companies these days either.
    too old to lose it , too young to choose it Ziggy Stardust

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    Occasionally Opiated satlelitejive is an unknown quantity at this point satlelitejive's Avatar
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    I looked into it and this is what I got! When administering codiene rectally it is ideal to take a dose of loperimide because it causes the vili in the descending colon to suck(for lack of a better term) the liquid; which is primarily water(which lubricates the feces: providing movement, I can see how the loperamide would stop diarhia) allowing more of the codiene to pass into the cells. It was explained to me like this, but it was in passing so you may want to look into it before trying. Interesting though!

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    Never Looked Back exitwound is an unknown quantity at this point exitwound's Avatar
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Quote Originally Posted by satlelitejive
    I looked into it and this is what I got! When administering codiene rectally it is ideal to take a dose of loperimide because it causes the vili in the descending colon to suck(for lack of a better term) the liquid; which is primarily water(which lubricates the feces: providing movement, I can see how the loperamide would stop diarhia) allowing more of the codiene to pass into the cells. It was explained to me like this, but it was in passing so you may want to look into it before trying. Interesting though!
    The problem is that adminstering Codeine rectally means you bypass the first-pass metabolism in the liver....and that is precisely what converts codeine to morphine! So you're basically giving yourself a very toxic pro-drug and preventing the process that converts it into a useful drug. D'oh!
    "I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me." - The Good Doctor, Hunter S. Thompson

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    Occasionally Opiated satlelitejive is an unknown quantity at this point satlelitejive's Avatar
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Ah there in lyes the problem! Well does it pass through the liver at all?

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    New Opiophile narconaut is an unknown quantity at this point
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    I've tried to do CWE on hydr. several times, and I believe I'm doing something wrong, or using the wrong pills. I'll try to describe what I'm doing.

    First I start with around 10 tabs, the watson 540's (blue, 10mg). I grind them up into fine powder, dissolve in 50 mL of cool water, and stick it in the freezer in a bowl. I stir every 15 mins. When the solution is very cold, and ice is just starting to form around the edges, I take it out, and squeeze the mixture through a piece of a bedsheet, wring it out, and keep the solids. I take the liquid and let it drip through a coffee filter & funnel in the fridge for about an hour. I re-dissolve the solids in another 50 mL, put in the freezer, and filter it the same way. Sometimes I may filter a third time.

    The coffee filter usually gets plugged and I'll speed the process by swirling it around the sides. The material that clogs it is a very fine, white powder. I'm assuming this is APAP?

    I take the blue liquid that has passed thru the coffee filter and usually let it air-evaporate away from light and over a low heat source (cable receiver). As it evaporates, the solution drops crystals - I can't tell what color they are but they have a gritty, sandy feel to them. At some point I draw most of the liquid into a nose spray bottle for use at the office - this liquid seems to give the best effect. I also finished drying the crystally sludge. It has a bitter taste. If I grind it up and snort it, I get maybe half the effect I would from the liquid. Would there be much APAP in that stuff - if so, whats the best way to filter it? Also, I can sometimes get an effect from the solids leftover from the freezing part, if it still has alot of blue color and bitter taste; but sometimes it will be mostly white and tasteless, then I just throw it away.

    Has anyone else worked with these particular tabs? Are they more difficult to extract than others? Anyone got any tips for improving my yield in the liquid?
    Last edited by narconaut; 07-30-2006 at 11:35 PM.

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    New Opiophile narconaut is an unknown quantity at this point
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    OOps, I meant to add, this is by prescription of course, but I don't take APAP if I can avoid it.



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    New Opiophile lea is an unknown quantity at this point
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    Default Re: cold water extraction

    Quote Originally Posted by bi11i
    surely. here's the straight dope, courtesy of neonjoint.com:

    Below is an example of a codeine extraction. The idea behind the following extraction is that
    acetaminophen and aspirin (I'll use A/A from now on) are very
    _insoluble_ in cold water. Codeine phosphate (the most common
    salt of codeine) is very _soluble_ in water including cold water.
    The following table explains:

    Solubility (31C water) Solubility (21C water)

    Aspirin 1g / 100 ml 1g / 300ml

    Acetaminophen 1g / 70 ml 1g / 150 ml

    Codeine 1g / 2.3 ml 1g / 0.7 ml
    Phosphate

    So as you can see, both A/A aren't very soluble in 21C
    water, so if you cool the water to around 10C, the solubility will
    drop even further. That way you can dissolve 20 tablets in 50ml
    of hot water, cool the water down to 10C, filter the solution and
    end up with the same amount of codeine as the tablets contained
    but only a fraction of the original amount of A/A.

    [...]

    1. Obtain a quantity of tablets containing codeine, check to
    see if they contain anything other than codeine, caffeine,
    acetaminophen or aspirin. If they do, and you don't know whether
    or not it will be a problem, your best bet is not to use them.
    Measure out your desired amount of codeine (ex. 64 mg = 8 tablets
    * 8mg/tablet). You may want to add 2 extra tablets as it is quite
    likely you will lose some codeine in the procedure. As you get
    more experience with the procedure you will be able to get
    approx. 95% of the codeine extracted.

    2. Measure out some nice hot water, use approx. 40ml / 20 tablets
    or more if needed. I would suggest you don't go over 50ml for 20
    tablets. I don't know if the use of boiling water would destroy
    any of the codeine but your best bet is not to use it. Use hot
    water but not boiling. Make sure the tablets dissolve completely.
    Some dissolve on contact with water while others need some help
    dissolving by crushing them. Note : not all of the tablet will
    dissolve, there are water-insoluble fillers in the tablet and not
    all of the A/A will dissolve either(which is what we want).

    3. Place the solution in a cold bath, I just use some ice cubes
    in a container of water. Stir the mixture occasionally until the
    solution drops to about 15C or lower. You won't need a
    thermometer to measure the temperature, just make sure it's
    "cold". This will take about 30 min. If you wish to speed this
    up, you can use less water to dissolve the tablets, and add ice
    chips to cool the mixture faster. Just make sure you don't add
    so much ice that you drastically increase the volume of the mixture.

    4. Filter the solution using whatever you have. Coffee filters
    work well, but lab filters work the best. Just make sure you
    don't end up with obvious solids in the filtered solution. This
    will take about 1 hr. You may also want to rinse the solids left
    over in the filter with some ice-water to extract any remaining
    codeine.



    Side notes Pretty much anything that CAN be used IV is better if you shoot it. Snorting, on the other hand, in addition to being horrible for your sinuses, is wasteful, and just doesn't work as well. Why? Beats me. I'm only speaking from my own, and many others experience.

    Don't use alot of water, use as little as possible. Codeine,hydrocodone, Oxycodone and morphine are all sensitive to heat and light. (Some more than others).
    This method will work for oxycodone, but as a side note Percocet and most off-brands contain a relatively small amount of acetaminophen (about 350 mg or so) compared to the oxycodone (5 mg). Since oxycodone is very strong, 2 or 3 percs should have you feeling pretty darn good (as long as you don't have a huge tolerance). As a result, unless you are taking 10 or 15 percs per day, you needn't worry about acetaminophen ingestion.
    What type of filter do you use.

  30. #30
    AWOL
    Guest

    Re: cold water extraction

    I think it would be cool if this post could be a sticky.



    Might just be me, but the forum sure gets a lot of CWE questions and this info has been out here on the forum since 12/2004. Just my opinion on that though. Also, if anyone wanted to read more of the original document that bi11i posted. http://www.erowid.org/pharms/codeine...tml#extraction

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