Endo has a BUPE product in phase 3 development

[strikks]

http://www.endo.com/endopharma/innov...in-development




see link^^

[dankoni]

Looks like its a patch (interesting), but it's listed as being for chronic pain? Is this normal for Bupe in development?

[Bricks & Stacks]

^I think they already got bupe pain patches that release like .2mg doses so it ain't unusual

[strikks]

in the U.K. they prescribe bupe patches already i think....gotta ask nick or danny...but i know they do give it for chronic pain over there....IDK i thought it was interesting...like the time release hydrocodone and the morphine/oxycodone pill!!! that will be nice!!


what up bricks?? long time no see!!! my vehicle is fuckd up thats why i aint been down....but i am workin on a ride and fixin our van too...

[TheTalkingAsshole]

they are also developing the same system for a bupe/naloxone patch for dependence

"BDSI® believes that the BEMA drug delivery system has the potential to deliver a wide range of drugs and continues to explore additional opportunities for future development and commercialization."-http://www.bdsi.com/Other_BEMA_Products.aspx

[strikks]

yep^^^ they already have naletrexone implants...they do that at my girls sub clinic and i cant believe people do it...that shit is like poison to me anytime i take it i feel like death for 2 hours.....even if i am already very sick......and the headaches it gives me and my girl...i fuckin hate them


but yeah they are developing a kind of suboxone patch......which will suck cuz the naletrexone keeps releasing continuously urrrgh!!!....the pills at least that crap wheres off in 60 to 90 mins...fuck that!!

[jimmyfingers]

Doctors need to step up and start writing for the amps when detoxing off long term sub. I have witnessed 3 addicts make their own solution, all long term and high dose bupe dependecy make up their own solutions and jump off at .125 or .0625 either IM or IV with minimal w/d symptoms.

Try and get the tiny generic bupe pills made by hi tech
Filter through cotton first
Filter through Whatman PVDF .4u - should be pretty clear at this point.
Filter again through Whatman PVDF .20u -solution should be dead clear.
I use 10mg distilled water and 10mg bac water
Store in sterile vile.
A full rig or 100 units would be .4mg
.125 mg would be a little over 30 units
.0625 would be a little over 15 units
Obviously sterility is key
Other tools I used was a 20cc syringe and 25 gauge needle luer lock. The wheel filters are designed to be used with luer lock syringes.
All this can be had for about 40 dollars.
IM or IV is up to you. I never had much success with making the liquid and then oral dosing. Maybe someone can weigh in on that.

[Ryouge]

Amps to get off long term sub would be a godsend. I doubt they'd do that short of having people come in daily and administering it themselves.

[jimmyfingers]

The Whatman PVDF wheel filter .20u is the perfect device to create near identical amps you would get at a pharmacy granted you take every precaution necessary for the sample to remain sterile.

[Dr. McKay]

Doctors need to step up and start writing for the amps when detoxing off long term sub. I have witnessed 3 addicts make their own solution, all long term and high dose bupe dependecy make up their own solutions and jump off at .125 or .0625 either IM or IV with minimal w/d symptoms.

Try and get the tiny generic bupe pills made by hi tech
Filter through cotton first
Filter through Whatman PVDF .4u - should be pretty clear at this point.
Filter again through Whatman PVDF .20u -solution should be dead clear.
I use 10mg distilled water and 10mg bac water
Store in sterile vile.
A full rig or 100 units would be .4mg
.125 mg would be a little over 30 units
.0625 would be a little over 15 units
Obviously sterility is key
Other tools I used was a 20cc syringe and 25 gauge needle luer lock. The wheel filters are designed to be used with luer lock syringes.
All this can be had for about 40 dollars.
IM or IV is up to you. I never had much success with making the liquid and then oral dosing. Maybe someone can weigh in on that.

If you had access to bacteriostatic water why would you mix it with distilled water ?
Why no just use all sterile bacteriostatic water ?
They come in 30 ml bottles , so you could just get a nice big 60 ml syringe put a couple of 8 mg subutex pills in it, pull up 30 ml of bac water, then sit and shake it up until it disolves. Let sit for about an hour or so, then put a .22 u syringe filter on the end, attach a 18 gauge needle tip to the end of that, and then stick it into the empty 30ml bottle. before injecting the solution through the filter and into the bottle put another 18 gauge needle through the top of the 30ml bottle to equalize the pressure in the bottle, then push the solution into the bottle.

Then viola , you have 100% sterile and 100% clear injectable buprenorphine solution that is about .5 mg per ml.

[telin]

Doctors need to step up and start writing for the amps when detoxing off long term sub. I have witnessed 3 addicts make their own solution, all long term and high dose bupe dependecy make up their own solutions and jump off at .125 or .0625 either IM or IV with minimal w/d symptoms.

Try and get the tiny generic bupe pills made by hi tech
Filter through cotton first
Filter through Whatman PVDF .4u - should be pretty clear at this point.
Filter again through Whatman PVDF .20u -solution should be dead clear.
I use 10mg distilled water and 10mg bac water
Store in sterile vile.
A full rig or 100 units would be .4mg
.125 mg would be a little over 30 units
.0625 would be a little over 15 units
Obviously sterility is key
Other tools I used was a 20cc syringe and 25 gauge needle luer lock. The wheel filters are designed to be used with luer lock syringes.
All this can be had for about 40 dollars.
IM or IV is up to you. I never had much success with making the liquid and then oral dosing. Maybe someone can weigh in on that.

Even though only semi-related wanted to share this...i like that idea...i stumbled n the hi-tech 2mgs when riteaid finally got a generic 'tex in stock recently. I just take them SL as directed but i LOVE these because they dissolve a lot faster than orange SUBs AND roxanne generic subutex. so, i've been happy about that. ALWAYS have been too terrified of needles (on the street and in facilities) which is a blessing, now; so, just something to keep in mind.

ANYWAY, my bone to pick (with my Dr.) is that he has his patients jump off from 2 mg. I've mentioned that i want to go lower first but i've been trying to really do things the way i'm prescribed lately...just trying to be an addict who actually LISTENS for once instead of repeating my history of relapsing while on subs. I've been on them since last october and don't want to draw it out forever but also don't want to rush it....didn't have to go above 6 mg from the start, but im really really worried about jumping from 2 mg...kind of a dilemma on whether or not to to do that when it gets to that point, or to at least down to at least a half milligram which is what i'd like to do...trying to keep in mind that he does have experience with patients doing this and does a clonidine, b12, phenergan etc. regimen for the acute withdrawals but still kind of worried. we'll see though....im still at 4mg (again, after a relapse) so it's not like this is my last month,but still concerned.

being back in the program lately it's going to be tough....honesty or ego? oh well, i know it will work out...hell, and i never thought I'd EVER consider it but now im considering vivitrol(sp?) if necessary, but hopefully it won't come to that...i think it's pretty expensive even with my insurance.

any POSITIVE jumping experiences? from those serious about keeping clean afterwards..

btw, wondering if i should've made this a whole post....

[Princess Kitty]

^I think they already got bupe pain patches that release like .2mg doses so it ain't unusual

They do their called butrans. My pm doc has been trying to get me to try them. I told him I sweat so bad that patches fall off (which is 100% true)

[borohydride]

Sorry, buprenorphine + naloxone? The former has greater μ affinity than the latter, so either it's included to stop people taking other agonists OR it's an attempt to get the stuff into a lower legal schedule to make them more $.

We have 2 buprenorphine patches in the UK:

BuTrans 5,10 or 20 µg/h for 7 days
Transtec 35,52.5 or 70μ g/h for 7 days.

[jimmyfingers]

I hear the patches are pretty good for some people. There are several people on the butran patch where I go and they all have good things to say

It is amazing how good bupe works for pain at the super low doses. You can get 40 doses out of a pill if you take it at .2mg

[Tea Time]

Sorry, buprenorphine + naloxone? The former has greater μ affinity than the latter, so either it's included to stop people taking other agonists OR it's an attempt to get the stuff into a lower legal schedule to make them more $

They said when suboxone came out that the addition of naloxone was intended to prevent/deter IV misuse of suboxone, but I am skeptical. I am more apt to agree with you that it was probably a concession on their part to obtain more favorable scheduling of the drug.

The scary thing is how little some bupe docs know about the specifics. A few years ago, my doctor told me that the naloxone in suboxone would cause precipitated WD's if injected, but wouldn't if taken sublingually. When I tried to correct him and tell him that even subutex taken sublingually would cause precipitated WD's if the patient had other opiate agonists bound to mu receptors in their system, he pointed at the wall where his diplomas were and asked if I was also a medical doctor. Needless to say I got up and left. I was very polite and thanked him for opening his mouth and preventing me from making a very big mistake by entering into his care. I then told him that I wished him luck because with the misinformation he was passing off as fact, he was definitely going to need it.

Bupe docs may be better and more experienced now, but at that point they were only required to go through a 5 hour training course ON A COMPUTER before being certified to treat opiate addicts with suboxone or subutex. Apparently the training "webinar" is now 8 hours, but still not sufficient in my opinion.

[borohydride]

http://www.cpdd.vcu.edu/Media/Index/...._Eddy1998.pdf

The above is a lecture entitled "In Pursuit of the Holy Grail” given by one of the Bentley Boys (not the racing cars, the guys behind etorphine & buprenorphine) so you can soak in the flavour of 1960s pharmaceutical research. How to test it? Shoot it up!!!

[Fat Pie]

The scary thing is how little some bupe docs know about the specifics. A few years ago, my doctor told me that the naloxone in suboxone would cause precipitated WD's if injected, but wouldn't if taken sublingually. When I tried to correct him and tell him that even subutex taken sublingually would cause precipitated WD's if the patient had other opaiate agonists bound to mu receptors in their system, he pointed at the wall where his diplomas were and asked if I was also a medical doctor. Needless to say I got up and left. I was very polite and thanked him for opening his mouth and preventing me from making a very big mistake by entering into his care. I then told him that I wished him luck because with the misinformation he was passing off as fact, he was definitely going to need it.

Yeah, it's the bupe itself that does that (due to a higher binding affinity or w/e), so it'll still cause precip w/d's when taken sublingually. That's even in the leaflets.

[jimmyfingers]

These reps from RB were running a racket with these docs when it first came out. I don't think any doctor besides a few knew what was really going on. Almost everyone was on 32mg in the beginning. RB had one hell of a marketing team.

The internet is where sub users organized and said low doses worked.

[borohydride]

32mg must have quite nasty side-effects for some. To quote from the excellent lecture I linked 'I felt dizzy and over the next several hours felt very nauseated and vomited several times.... we had had the first glimpse of buprenorphine’s Achilles heel as an analgesic - the rather high incidence of nausea and vomiting'.

[jimmyfingers]

32mg must have quite nasty side-effects for some. To quote from the excellent lecture I linked 'I felt dizzy and over the next several hours felt very nauseated and vomited several times.... we had had the first glimpse of buprenorphine’s Achilles heel as an analgesic - the rather high incidence of nausea and vomiting'.

I read that whole thing and it was one hell of a good read.