Piper betel / Piper sarmentosum OPIOID activity

[jacky]

wow, VERY interesting.

do a search on either of these two piper species, and the word opioid, and you will find at least two reports, one recently outlined in an issue of the Journal of Ethnopharmacology, that detail the naloxone reversing opioid activity that is purported to be behind at least part of these plants leaves analgesic activity.

I am most happy to hear of yet another semi common, commercially avialable plant species testing positive for opioid activity.
I dont know if the specific activity has been specified as of yet, I read nothing of mu, delta, or kappa opioid agonist/antagonist activity.

at the moment, I am typing under a bookcase that has a jar of piper betel leaves extracting away in organic pure ethanol.....I have dried piper betel leaves a go go in my ethnobotanical collection, and I have several sources locally in Idaho of all places where I can buy fresh piper betel leaves for Puja use or for betel nuts...I use them for both. as a masticant, and for religious use.

the piper sarmentosum species I am not familiar with...but its possible as well that this particular species is available, even internationally, and possibly in extract/powder form.

I love the taste of the piper betel leaf....its my favorite part of the betel nut quid experience besides the edgy but subtle high of the betel nut itself.
but now I am going to experiment with chewing just the piper betel leaf.

I have heard for some time that the piper betel leaf carried the more narcotic type of effect of the betel quid....I assumed that was just an assumption, a rumor, a fanciful, wishful idea.
but now I must redouble my research into this plant.

if we are talking even mild but enjoyable opioid effect here, then that will be fucking amazing.

is it possible one of the more well known components of the piper leaf is an opioid, but hasnt been discovered yet, or are we talking a novel type of opioid substance?
could it be an indirect effect?

I will be checking up on this plants info avialable.

see folks....since opiophile has started...there hasnt nearly been a month that we dont find out about a new opioid active plant known to nature....many of them, exist right beneath our noses....plants that have been beneficial to mankind, or at least a luxury, some even staples of diet.

if you consider the numbers, and know your research, you should find that the opioid active species far outnumber the OPIATE active species known....which is just a few species of papaver of course. namely papaver somniferum.
it seems the opioid active species, are by far, mostly and mainly positive, subtle, or moderately potent, and with many medicinal qualities that are wholey BENEFICIAL.

with most of the opioid active species, as far as we know in the infancy of this type of research, are relatively non addicting. with maybe the sole exception at this point, mitragyna speciosa....one of the more impressive and active species of opioid active plants.

this is a big part of my drive, and a project of mine for some time...to publish a book devoted to the subject, the opioid plants in nature.....

opioid and opiate shouldnt be dirty words anymore....there are more benign, "mundane" opioid active plants than there are plants that pack a punch.
with the modern knowledge of endorphins,
and use of kappa opioid agonists as topical analgesics, or antitussives, such as the case of the common chemical compound MENTHOL,
the continued hush hush that I hear sometimes when I speak the word OPIOPHILE, or OPIATE too loud , really makes me cringe.

anyway, enough rant.

these piper species make great pole/houseplants, and work great in greenhouses. the leaves can be sold in bulk to chinese markets...where the people are buying them 24/7 in some areas. not to mention they are used by hindu's for religious purposes.

the leaves are avialable in dry form, extract form etc etc.

and for the most part, the plant seems relatively non toxic.

I am going to be chewing a good amount of these leaves later this week....without the betel nut or lime paste.
and enjoying a bit of tinctured piper betel.

[bindegal]

It is very exciting, a real find! As you may know, I love Paan, which are difficult to do up here in Scandinavia! But is a very interesting drug with an incredibly broad and long cultural history so I read a lot about it. I have recently seen allegations of opioid in Piper Betel, but did not believed it, viewing it as a rumor, as you did. And there a lot of rumors about Piber betel as it use as a folk remedy all over southeast Asia.
Now we talks about rumors have you ever could verify that Piper have something called arakene in it, has properties resembling cocaine? That one I have view it as a rumor to. Buy maybe you know for sure?
The first Piber I tasted (besides pepper) was from Piper sarmentosum, when I found miang kham, a tasty thai snack in a Thai store and I thought it was paan..
But Piper is a big ass genus, wiki say "It contains about 1,000-2,000 species of shrubs, herbs, and lianas" !
Even our Piper betel shows different compounds all after where it have been grown and how.
With a Chinese accent "Very interesting Mr.Jacky, very very interesting...."
And the leaves so beautiful, this is from the last batch I got home.

[Thanat0s]

...the prevalence of opiod-ish compounds we are finding in nature,
considered with the abundance of receptors we have developed
AND the varied function of those receptors
seems to point to the co-evolution of life,

the plants influencing animals' development and the animals influencing plants.

the prevalent western attitudes concerning opiods is bound to be overturned,
once the abundance of these compounds is realized.

when the 40,000th natural opiod source is found,
and we consider also that our bodies(and the bodies of other animals) produce such substances...
how long can common knowledge of the 'evil drug menace' continue without paradigm shift?

prior to frequenting this site i had no idea how commonplace and seemingly fundamental opiod systems are naturally.

read a novel in jail, 'the ganja coast,'
it was mainly focused on the rise of the Goa coast in india as a tourist hotspot
and the struggle between commercial interest, traditional values, and the influx of western drug culture.

betel use was portrayed very objectively, very widespread.
the first i had ever heard of the practice.
been intrigued since.

--of all the substances that creatures willingly and repeatedly ingest i wonder what exactly is their underlying motivation? certainly must be influenced by evolution or what is 'good for' that creature in some way.

the presence of useful analgesics (as one example) points to these 'evil drugs' as being essential for a species/individuals fittness for survival.

--ps: is betel leaf readily available to us in the states?

[More Feen]

Remember that usually plants have developed these chemicals through natural selection, as insecticides.

The bug nervous system is not too different from our own, so many of the same chemicals have similar effects. The difference being scale. Small dose= Buzz, Larger dose=death.

M F

[jacky]

J Ott once stated that the FDA has done literally no research on the approx. half gram of reported NATURAL insecticides that occur in the modern diet.....insecticides produced by plants, not humans.
the FDA allows mere few milligrams...maybe 12-14 milligrams of synthetic insecticides in our daily diet....but really hasnt tossed much money into researching the substances inherent in our natural food selection.

some people claim that piper betel and related species actually help protect from some of the damage that tobacco and betel nut quids cause....
and in general, the piper species abound with medicinal applications. ethnobotanicals that have been traded and consumed for thousands of years.

kava kava is a piper species, as are a number of spice plants.

I would proceed cautiously of course.....
personally I have chewed up to 3-4 of these leaves in a few hour period. sometimes just the piper leaf.

an indian product sold just uses the piper betel leaf, and various flavorings, and forgo's using the betel nut at all.

[sweetpoppygrrl]

and the effect...?

[30_Units]

:facepalm:

in the final stages of an areca nut (pan parag) iso extraction.....I knew the leaves had a lot to do with the combined effects of the experience....but this much?

Damnit damnit limited resources damnit.

G'luck jacky. Every tried any extractions of areca nut?

[Papa Verine]

I wouldn't do that 30 units. The Betel nuts effects felt more like nicotine to me than any of the enjoyable stimulants out there. Too much can be quite nauseating.

This is very, very interesting. I didn't know the Piper Betel leaf had any psychoactivity at all. I thought it was just a common way to make the quid. I have access to as many betel leaves as I want around here. I'm going to do an extraction on the leaves myself and see what I can come up with.

[bindegal]

This is very, very interesting. I didn't know the Piper Betel leaf had any psychoactivity at all. I thought it was just a common way to make the quid. I have access to as many betel leaves as I want around here. I'm going to do an extraction on the leaves myself and see what I can come up with.

Betel leaf contains some real interesting compounds, if I may draw your attention to the Shulgin's book PiHKAL, where he writes about, what he calls the essential oil amphetamine. It is under TMA # 157 in the open source part of the book. Then check what Wiki writes about the content of Piper betel.
I think is a good bet that there is some kind of synergy between leaf and nut. Erowid has betel chewing as the oldest drug use-leaf and nut- with archaeological traces, in the Spirit Cave, Thailand. Ppl don't use two plants in concert for min. 7000 years because they look nice together.

[Paregoric Kid]

yeah there are a lot of interesting psychoactive plants in the pepper family. there are supposed to be a bunch of plants similar to kava that are used in Asia and the pacific islands. I was researching into them but last time I was I had some trouble at finding the names of those species. I wouldn't doubt that a lot more species in the Piper family have opioid properties.
I've read that Piper sarmentosum contains naringenin which effects the mu, kappa, and sigma opioid receptors. there is also the related flavone 7,4′-dihydroxyflavone which is even stronger. I've been taking hesperedin lately which is similar and has opioid properties too, pretty interesting how a lot of citrus and pepper plants have all of these flavones and flavonoids that have opioid activity. betel contains methyleugenol which a couple papers I saw suggested its effects may be mediated through the opioid system. this paper talks about naringenin and 7,4'-dihydroxyflavone and its opioid properties: Flavonoids as Opioid Receptor Ligands: Identification and Preliminary Structure–Activity Relationships both naringenin and 7,4'-dihydroxyflavone are also found in st johns wort.

[bindegal]

I just remember that I sometimes smoke some of the betel leafs I don't get used when they are fresh. I hand roll my cigs and drop 15-30% leaves in, it gives a nice flavor and maybe a small buzz. I got the idea from some pics form Burma where they use Piber betel leaf to roll tobacco in Cheroot.
I think it have to taste something like clove cigarettes, which I must admit I don't think I ever tasted.

And now we talks about betel. I will bore you, with that, I, after long and hard tries, got hold on some Catechu! I have been looking for it for months, bothered every asian store in Copenhagen, some of them more than one time, to get hold of it to my Paan's. Now one of them, a Pakistani, got so tired of me that got some for me! It to have so interesting compounds in it, and it works great in paan's to take the edge of the lime paste.
Here some pics of the blocks the stuff come in. You put em in water and they dissolve to something like mud. For size comparison the white squares are 1x1 cm.

[jacky]

interesting about the catechu!

and nice post PK!

I have to get my hands on some of that catechu products......is it an acacia extract?

[bindegal]

Yes, is a it should be a Acaciacatechu extract, I know there are extracts made of other wood varieties, but it is for use in color and tannin. I was somewhat confused at the start and actually thought that they made it out of the same palm nuts came from, since there are mess around the names, Acacia catechu is also mimosa catechu, and if you read books from the pre 60' no one really knows for certain.
Maybe Jacky, you will find my next quest for exciting to, I am out for some Gambir from the leaf of Uncaria gambir. I remember something about you was interested in this ones South American cousin, Cat's claw, Uncaria tomentosa.
Gambir was use in Indonesia with betel in paan's like forever, but its use began to disappear with the use of betel declining, but it got a sort of comeback the last years, as an aphrodisiac. I think, that it have a kind of warm feeling when rub in the skin, like chamfer or menthol, but I really don’t know. There is a Malaysian town or state at the island of Borneo that is famous for is Gambir, is call Sarawak.
Yes, I know that confusing, Indonesia, Malaysia and Borneo. But I myself am only at the beginning of my search and am about to find where I can get it from and what kind there is. But that's half the fun

[bindegal]

First, I must apologize for spelling and other kind of violence against your language in my last post! GABA was on a joy ride in my brain when I wrote, and my English is miserable in advance, so sorry ...
Will just say that fresh Piper sarmentosum is relatively easy to get hold on in Thai stores, as I wrote above, it is used in a snack called "Miang Kham"
I just had a conversation with the Boss Mama in one of the Thai shops I get a lot of my stuff from. She sells most Miang Kham in packages with everything, to the young and many of the Danes who have been in Thailand.
But she imports 500g. fresh Piper sarmentosum per week to those who make their own. I can not imagine that it is very different from the rest of the West, Europe, U.S. or Down Under. Asian shops dealing in vegetables is a miracle workers in logistics when it comes to getting fresh product in a hurry, so they are almost as fresh as they would in a market in Bangkok.

[DCBA]

Remember that usually plants have developed these chemicals through natural selection, as insecticides.

The bug nervous system is not too different from our own, so many of the same chemicals have similar effects. The difference being scale. Small dose= Buzz, Larger dose=death.

M F

True and not so true..
And just look at cannabis, it totally don't kill us but it has anti-insects effect too.
The bugs nervous system is indeed different from ours, much different in fact.
And the plants didn't produce insecticides by evolution, they produced and PREVAILED THRU GENERATIONS the charecteristics that allowed them to live and reproduce more.
It doesn't matter if that chareteristics were of anti-insects like or whatever, they could be many different things.

[Paregoric Kid]

yeah cannabis does have some chemicals that repel certain insects but it is theorized that some of the chemicals, like THC, may be produced to help protect the plants DNA from UV radiation. another thing is that with plants like cannabis and opium, while their wild ancestors did produce psychoactive chemicals, their levels were lower than todays plants. this is because people began selectively breeding the plants so that they would have a higher content of psychoactive constituents. it is also said that plants coevolved with humans to produce more of these chemicals because the more psychoactive plants had a higher chance of carrying on their genes, people tend to spread and plant seeds of plants they like.