Zenpunk's Bupe Detox Diary

[pharmboy]

Wow I thought you were in Building Controls. Process is neat as hell.
Your last post was . . well it brought back memories . . Be Careful
if you want to change your life, change it to what YOU want to change
it to not NA/AA. I think alot of people in those get a little co-dependent
and they like it that way a little too much. Be careful how much smoke
they are blowing up your ass, they will put alot of guilt on you and don't
fall for it. You know how guilty you Should feel, don't let them blow it
out of proportion. I know I'm a negative old fart, so sue me. good luck.

[zenpunk]

Yeah a lot of people have told me that about NA/AA. When I was at Phelps I brought that up and also the fact that I'm big time anti-religion doesn't help. The intake counselor told me to shop around for a meeting that was low key. I think because this one is held in a rehab and not a church it doesn't harp on the God stuff. I do have a lot of guilt sadly anyway, I was a really destructive person (ex. while my aunt is pouring her heart out to me I'm stealing her husbands pain meds from shattering his knee).

[Suboxstitute]

Just one comment, other than I hope it all works out for you - 36 is NOT pretty damn old! Hell, the way things are going with medical science.....you may have 60 or more years to hang around depending on what your next step is!

It makes us a REAL old people..... feel real old.

Take good care.

[zenpunk]

Just one comment, other than I hope it all works out for you - 36 is NOT pretty damn old! Hell, the way things are going with medical science.....you may have 60 or more years to hang around depending on what your next step is!

It makes us a REAL old people..... feel real old.

Take good care.

Sorry man, I'm just finding it hard to swallow that I've been careening out of control for 18 years. That's a damn long time. I just don't know what I'm going to do, I've never been sober for longer than 3 weeks at a stretch over that 18 years. I don't know quite how to cope with things right now. Did you ever notice how much drinking there is on tv?

[Nate]

stay strong girl....the paws will lift...give it time....its worth it.

[Inspektahdek]

Yeah a lot of people have told me that about NA/AA. When I was at Phelps I brought that up and also the fact that I'm big time anti-religion doesn't help. The intake counselor told me to shop around for a meeting that was low key. I think because this one is held in a rehab and not a church it doesn't harp on the God stuff. I do have a lot of guilt sadly anyway, I was a really destructive person (ex. while my aunt is pouring her heart out to me I'm stealing her husbands pain meds from shattering his knee).

I totally feel you on the religion thing, how they try to fill a "VOID" for you. That's why if we had NA or any type of group therapy, I decline, it just doesn't work for me. Maybe one on one psychiatry and meds work, that's it, no group, no fucking worthless program! Well for me atleast, some people get help by the programs and group therapy, more power to you, wish I were that easy :/

[Inspektahdek]

Sorry man, I'm just finding it hard to swallow that I've been careening out of control for 18 years. That's a damn long time. I just don't know what I'm going to do, I've never been sober for longer than 3 weeks at a stretch over that 18 years. I don't know quite how to cope with things right now. Did you ever notice how much drinking there is on tv?

hey some of these problems can't be helped, I think most opiate users have some type of atleast mild instability that draws them to opiates. Everyone likes to get high, but only people with atleast minuscule problems stay high all the time, that's maybe what therapy can help you with, I sure as hell prob need it so I completely understand much like many other opiophiles and I find this site sort of therapy within itself because we all share a common interest and downfall at the same time.

you prob notice all the drinking on TV because you're more sober now and wanting to be in a diff state of mind, you'll be more perceptive with a clear head right? well I thought so...

also, it might be a massive advertisement to entice people to drink because drinking which causes so many deaths in this world is nothing in comparison to harmless pot or even yet ecstasy or heroin which cause significantly less deaths each year? hmmmmmmm *scratches head* "but then again, it's a nice taxable drug anyhow right?" (quote from UK movie "Human Traffic")

[zenpunk]

DIARY SUNDAY:

Went to my second NA meeting. Really I'm there for the people's comments more than the 12 steps lecture. I really hear something in what all these other addicts say. Tomorrow Phelps may be making their decision to make me inpatient or outpatient. If I go inpatient, I'll post again as soon as I can.

[upstate_007]

DIARY SUNDAY:

Went to my second NA meeting. Really I'm there for the people's comments more than the 12 steps lecture. I really hear something in what all these other addicts say. Tomorrow Phelps may be making their decision to make me inpatient or outpatient. If I go inpatient, I'll post again as soon as I can.

Good luck at Phelps Zen. I hope that whatever they choose for a program works out well for you.

[Nate]

We are always here to support you, no matter what you choose! Put a smile on....your getting so close to freedom.

[pharmboy]

I may be wrong but I bet they make you inpatient. I've never seen

a rehab pass by a big tasty chunk of insurence like you probably

have. Keep on keepin on Zen, you get closer with every day. .:xmas-smil

[zenpunk]

I may be wrong but I bet they make you inpatient. I've never seen

a rehab pass by a big tasty chunk of insurence like you probably

have. Keep on keepin on Zen, you get closer with every day. .:xmas-smil

Oh yeah, I think they will too and I don't think that such a bad idea at this point. I crunched the numbers and the world would not end if I disappeared for 28 days. And, yeah having good insurance makes them much more inclined to do it.

[Duckfeet]

I don't talk a lot about it, and probably give Mikell too much shit about it, but for candor's sake, I should say, that I like AA--not NA--and I'm an atheist, but u can find meetings where there's laughter and where they don't take themselves too seriously...

I go most days to a noon AA meeting here, and I think it's good for me, and when I worked the steps, best I could back in March of 1999, I haven't had a drink since, so it *can* help, some people...it's never worked *forever* on opiates, for me, but it has worked for years, and I think it's good--for me--to have a place to go, where people care about me, and know my struggle, and shit...

But I'm a real stickler for AA's traditions, which are--more or less-their rules, and they believe strongly that we should *never* promote this shit, it should only be "attraction..." ...and that's it *only* about alcoholism..anything else I struggle with, I should keep to myself...

The trick is, as they say, for those of us "in the program" is *not* to take yourself too damn seriously, and not to start babbling AAspeak outside of meetings, where it comes off as phony and just way too superior sounding...giving us a veneer of undeserved humility, when it's just our cutesie vocabulary: there is *no* accepted "proof" that AA or NA or religion, or *anything* works any better than anything else....and once there became a buck to be made in the "recovery" field, the whole thing changed, and I personally believe, that AA, and all 12step programs will go the way of goofy religions and cults, but anyway, u might want to find a meeting u like, and talk to somebody *not* consumed with the lingo, as it might help you....I like going, and it helps me...

Sorry man, I'm just finding it hard to swallow that I've been careening out of control for 18 years. That's a damn long time. I just don't know what I'm going to do, I've never been sober for longer than 3 weeks at a stretch over that 18 years. I don't know quite how to cope with things right now. Did you ever notice how much drinking there is on tv?

[zenpunk]

DIARY MONDAY:

Still waiting for Phelps to call. If they don't I'll go back to NA tonight. I like the people at this meeting, in fact, I even recognized a guy that I got trashed with at a local bar once. Haven't slept in weeks, legs thrashing all night. I know the RLS may last for another week or so.

[tptptp]

DIARY MONDAY:

Still waiting for Phelps to call. If they don't I'll go back to NA tonight. I like the people at this meeting, in fact, I even recognized a guy that I got trashed with at a local bar once. Haven't slept in weeks, legs thrashing all night. I know the RLS may last for another week or so.

Bupe withdrawals can be torturously long, but hang in there you weren't on bupe that long so it shouldn't be that bad. RLS tends to linger from detox anyways, that shit sucks big time. Benzo might take the edge off....but, ya know. Maybe if you didnt have access to anymore but could grab one or two, but that doesn't happen often that way.

Well, good luck if it's what you want or what you feel you have to do then just hang in there & it'll get better. It really will.

[zenpunk]

Well I'm going outpatient: surprise, surprise. I'll keep everyone posted, my first meeting is tonight.

[pharmboy]

Well, I'm shocked.
I thought greed ruled more than that.
Maybe thier full cuz of Christmas and all or
was this your decision?

[zenpunk]

Nope - I was willing to go wherever they said. I was surprised myself they made me outpatient.

The first meeting at Phelps was kind of disappointing. It was more like a class about drugs. Jeeze I could practically teach that class.

And PAWS are a bitch - my left leg has really been bothering me and keeping me awake at night.

DIARY TUESDAY:

Talked to my boss about not traveling for 9 months - told him I have a medical issue and need outpatient treatment twice a week and can't travel. It was good timing because we just had someone who doesn't travel give notice. So they will hold off on hiring someone new and have me do her job, then in a few months train her replacement. No pay cut, no nothing! At last something good has come my way.

[pharmboy]

Do you have to stay in the office all day ?

That would bug the crap out of me, couldn't stand the office
or the people in it.

How about consulting ? Any chance of that ? .:xmas-smil

[zenpunk]

Right now I feel like hell so it really doesn't matter. I think once I feel better I'll take some trips on the weekend and stuff like that. The problem for me is that the extensive travel helps me not to face life. I cleaned up before like 4 years ago and without addressing why I run away all the time and try to make my life one big adventure, slowly drinking crept back in and then came the opiates and here I am again. I need to break the cycle. I need to be happy enough with myself that when I'm a road warrior again in a few months, I don't start partying.

Hey does anyone know how long Suboxone actually stays in your system? I still feel like hell.

[Inspektahdek]

wow 14 pages, very popular! nice thread zen, I just gave it 5 stars

you're one brave frau!

[Duckfeet]

That's why I don't *totally* believe in the "we've all got EDS" stuff...I've been very happy, and adventurous, after long periods on opys, and being totally abstinent...it just takes a while, but happiness comes back...but it's the inbetween times--or PAWS, another cutesy treatment center invent--so happiness off drugs just takes a while....Subs--to me--when it comes to detox, are identical to methadone: take longer to kick in, take longer to go thru, aren't quite as horrible as heroin/oxys...but again, longer u've been on subs, longer it takes...no free lunch...but some of yer questions are hard to answer: u might notice that those of us who have been around longer, are less inclined to give graphs and quotes, as we *know* without a shawdow of a doubt, that this is *hugely* subjective, depending on *pages* of factors, like length of usage, general health, age....etc etc...


And as always, wish u the best

Right now I feel like hell so it really doesn't matter. I think once I feel better I'll take some trips on the weekend and stuff like that. The problem for me is that the extensive travel helps me not to face life. I cleaned up before like 4 years ago and without addressing why I run away all the time and try to make my life one big adventure, slowly drinking crept back in and then came the opiates and here I am again. I need to break the cycle. I need to be happy enough with myself that when I'm a road warrior again in a few months, I don't start partying.

Hey does anyone know how long Suboxone actually stays in your system? I still feel like hell.

[pharmboy]

Yup I think Mr. Duckfeet is right. At this point it's not what IS in your

system makeing you feel like shit, It's whats NOT in your system

makeing you feel like shit. Keep on Keepin on.

[zenpunk]

DIARY THURSDAY:

Went to Phelps again last night. The Wednesday session is much, much better. We all talked about taking personal inventory of our lives etc., which is kind of what I'm doing now. Alot of people in there have lost everything because of coke or booze, I'm the only Heroin person in there. Everyone else runs the gamut from booze to PCP to Coke to Weed. But the guy that teaches on Wednesday, unlike almost everyone else, seems to know Heroin addiction really well. He told me to go to my dr. and get a B12 shot and get prescribed a sleep aid because I am still in PAWS and its time to get this show on the road and recover. So I had to call the ignorant doctor that refuses to prescribe anything for fear I'm gonna snort it or shoot it (even when logic says thats impossible) and let her secretary know that I need this and that they can call Phelps if they want and talk to the guy.

My SO is going to al-anon and came home last night with the realization that he has been co-dependent ever since his parents divorce. Us getting together was the wrong combination of people and I don't think we are going to make it.

[soulninja]

Hey Zen,Been a while. I'm glad to hear you're on the road to getting yourself together,good for you. Wish you the best of luck and stay strong.

[Duckfeet]

Yep: that stuff really helped me, I quit the clowing barfly/junky "oh, I'm so cool..." and finally began to see myself, what I really was: I didn't like it much, and try to avoid the "I'm so humble" lingo, but it still helped, meet a few nice people, get honest, get some support, can do wonders....and if even u feel this site is not helping, I 'd leave here too: yer life's at stake, and u do what u think is best...

Again, good luck to u....tuff place to be, but can work out in good ways...

DIARY THURSDAY:

Went to Phelps again last night. The Wednesday session is much, much better. We all talked about taking personal inventory of our lives etc., which is kind of what I'm doing now. Alot of people in there have lost everything because of coke or booze, I'm the only Heroin person in there. Everyone else runs the gamut from booze to PCP to Coke to Weed. But the guy that teaches on Wednesday, unlike almost everyone else, seems to know Heroin addiction really well. He told me to go to my dr. and get a B12 shot and get prescribed a sleep aid because I am still in PAWS and its time to get this show on the road and recover. So I had to call the ignorant doctor that refuses to prescribe anything for fear I'm gonna snort it or shoot it (even when logic says thats impossible) and let her secretary know that I need this and that they can call Phelps if they want and talk to the guy.

My SO is going to al-anon and came home last night with the realization that he has been co-dependent ever since his parents divorce. Us getting together was the wrong combination of people and I don't think we are going to make it.

[GoddessofRATs]

Can you go to another doctor and get a sleep aid? Maybe a walk in clinic that doesn't know you. But your probably trying not to do things like that, so i understand. That is the addict in me talking "Just go to another doctor" LOL. I try not to do that these days as well.

So your totally off the subs now?

GOR

[Cobain]

Zen,

Im so happy that you have the will to make it this far. major kudos and I wish you the best of luck, and try to have a Happy Holiday

[kyuss]

DIARY THURSDAY:

Went to Phelps again last night. The Wednesday session is much, much better. We all talked about taking personal inventory of our lives etc., which is kind of what I'm doing now. Alot of people in there have lost everything because of coke or booze, I'm the only Heroin person in there. Everyone else runs the gamut from booze to PCP to Coke to Weed. But the guy that teaches on Wednesday, unlike almost everyone else, seems to know Heroin addiction really well. He told me to go to my dr. and get a B12 shot and get prescribed a sleep aid because I am still in PAWS and its time to get this show on the road and recover. So I had to call the ignorant doctor that refuses to prescribe anything for fear I'm gonna snort it or shoot it (even when logic says thats impossible) and let her secretary know that I need this and that they can call Phelps if they want and talk to the guy.

My SO is going to al-anon and came home last night with the realization that he has been co-dependent ever since his parents divorce. Us getting together was the wrong combination of people and I don't think we are going to make it.

I didn't even think
you were in a relationship,
hang in there
you're doing great.

[zenpunk]

Can you go to another doctor and get a sleep aid? Maybe a walk in clinic that doesn't know you. But your probably trying not to do things like that, so i understand. That is the addict in me talking "Just go to another doctor" LOL. I try not to do that these days as well.

So your totally off the subs now?

GOR

Yup totally off subs took the last little chip on 12/1. I'm going back to this doctor I guess because she's so ignorant I want her to learn from this. And, if she refuses I can just put her on the phone with Phelps and she will find out better. Plus, she can't refuse the B12 shot and I really need that now I think. I'm sick and tired of feeling sick and tired, especially with it snowing like a bitch up here.