Look for Kratom prices to go up...

[kratboy]

Just found this while surfing... Potential bad news for us Kratophiles.

<snip>Sale of 'ketum' leaves to be made a serious drug offence


JITRA (Malaysia) (Jan 12, 2007): The government has submitted a working paper to the Attorney-General's Office to have the "daun ketum" (leaves of the Mitragyna speciosa tree) to be listed as a dangerous drug, thus making thesale of the leaves a serious drug offence.
Deputy Internal Security Minister Datuk Mohd Johari Baharom said presently, offences related to ketum leaves were placed under the Poisons Act where punishment meted out are much lighter.
"The government is prepared to have offences linked to ketum leaves to come under the Dangerous Drugs Act," he said when launching a Belia Benci Dadah (Youth Hate Drugs) programme in Kampung Keda Wang Tepus near here today, reports Bernama.
He said public was alarmed that use of the leaves is becoming more widespread as the effect is the same as taking drugs.
Mohd Johari said the "mitraginin" in the leaves also caused users to become addicted.
The Ketum tree came into prominence in early 2003 after substance abusers found its leaves to be an alternative to get "high" when other narcotics were not so easily available.
The tree, also known as Pokok Biak, is mostly found in Africa, northand central parts of peninsular Malaysia and in south Thailand.<snip>

[HistoryofMadness]

hell its illegal in several countries where it grows, and australia I think, but whatever. i doubt prices will go up. seems like multiple sources and a growing market will drive prices down. supply and demand.

[I-Nod]

Man, that sucks. Anyone know where psychoactiveherbs gets their stuff? Hear they supply 95% of the online vendors w/ K. Well, the article said the trees are mostly found in Africa and parts of Malaysia and Thailand... and it's illegal in Thailand so I highly doubt they get it from Africa. Eh, thinking out loud again, sorry.

[kratboy]

The guys at PAH have their own farm in Bali. Is Bali part of Malaysia?.... I thought it was but I could have just (waking) dreamt it.

[Eacey]

First time Ive even heard of these leaves. <----so noob

[I-Nod]

A quick google says it's part of Malaysia. It's an island. Well, guess it's a waiting game to see how this will impact K's availability. Thanks for finding that article, good to know early as possible and get a jump on the game.

[HandMeSomeOpiates]

Man, I swear if they make Kratom illegal, I will be pissed because I'll be back doing hardcore drugs again....:mad: :rolleyes:

[jacky]

bali leaf is grown in bali, but I have reason to believe that some of this material is from other areas as well....also, strangely, the bali leaf is shipped out of tokyo sometimes.
malaysian leaf is sent via mail in 10 kilo and smaller packages. but now we will see, since the plant is going to be controlled there stricter....
thia leaf is sold the same way, through the mail...apparently in south thialand, the leaf is sold on the open market, and some factory owners supply workers with the product, the market being outdoor herb and fruit markets. north thialand is tougher on the stuff, and it is more underground up there.

I havnt heard of kratom growing in africa, but many other species of mitragyna grow in africa, and a good number are used medicinally.

a few kratom trees are now being grown in the dominican republic.....
some are grown in australia....
hawaii...

and I imagine alot of other countrys.

if I can get live cuttings into brazil, I myself can have 10% partnership in a kratom collective that is being planned down there.

in a few years kratom with be huge, or if not huge, pretty "big", at least in the codeine realm....., and the governments of the world are going to have to decide if they are going to hand over even more money to the cartels. if kratom does get illegalized in alot of places, who knows what analogs could be produced to compound the amount of money that can be made off of.....trees.

I am sure that there is some kratom being grown outdoors in warmer parts of the southern USA, in san diego the plant would winter fine.

I even have some kratom growing in my garage, and it is 10 degrees outside, and most of the healthy plants are doing fine in 43-60 degree growing chambers with only 1 grow light. I am going to move them outside this spring and start trying to make cuttings off of them. I have tried this winter, but it is too cool in the garage for any real growth. I would rather them go sorta dormant that over grow the garage.

kratom is growing everywhere there are enterprising people....

[Dolophine]

The Malaysian government is filled with Baboons. I swear to god that Malaysia and Singapore and Indonesia have the toughest drug laws in the world. They are morons and should all be shot in the face. If you go there and get caught with like a gram of heroin or something they put you in jail for your entire life. It's insane. Totally insane. These people are monkeys and the citizens their aint much better. Some are cool but most of them are monkeys who think it's cool to lock up tourists for possessing one joint and letting them rott in jail for 20 years it's fuckign ridiculous. Singapore and Indonesia are especially bad. Malaysia is just as bad too i guess but Singapore has a hard core drug policy. You can't even get ADDERALL or DEXEDRINE in Malaysia, they only have 1 treatment for ADHD, which is RITALIN. even though RITALIN is like the same fucking thing as Amphetamines in my opinion. The effects are so similar. Except I find ritalin has a ceiling effect and you dont get higher after a certain amount. But it still gives you a respectable buzz. It's not weak shit.

Singapore Gov= Apes Malaysian Gov= Baboons Indonesian Gov= Monkeys Chinese Gov= some inbred cross between monkeys and panda bears.

I hate asian gov's they are fucking ridiculous and totally crooked. Down with asia !!!!! No offense to asians but if you believe in that shit and harsh laws like that fuck you too your a dumb chimpanzee you fucking apes! Props to all the cool asian people though. But i DOUBT there is many asians on this site. They usually don't do drugs because they are so afraid of dishonoring their family name or something. Asians dont do the drugs cuz it dishonors their family, so they sell them! lmao which is no different in my opinion.

[Dolophine]

The guys at PAH have their own farm in Bali. Is Bali part of Malaysia?.... I thought it was but I could have just (waking) dreamt it.

I believe Bali is in Indonesia, not Malaysia. But I may be wrong but i'm pretty sure it's in Indonesia.

[youwonhundred]

I believe Bali is in Indonesia, not Malaysia. But I may be wrong but i'm pretty sure it's in Indonesia.

Ya, its indonesia... gotta love google. just another example of UTMFSE in action, right? lol

[I-Nod]

bali leaf is grown in bali, but I have reason to believe that some of this material is from other areas as well....also, strangely, the bali leaf is shipped out of tokyo sometimes.
malaysian leaf is sent via mail in 10 kilo and smaller packages. but now we will see, since the plant is going to be controlled there stricter....
thia leaf is sold the same way, through the mail...apparently in south thialand, the leaf is sold on the open market, and some factory owners supply workers with the product, the market being outdoor herb and fruit markets. north thialand is tougher on the stuff, and it is more underground up there.

I havnt heard of kratom growing in africa, but many other species of mitragyna grow in africa, and a good number are used medicinally.

a few kratom trees are now being grown in the dominican republic.....
some are grown in australia....
hawaii...

and I imagine alot of other countrys.

if I can get live cuttings into brazil, I myself can have 10% partnership in a kratom collective that is being planned down there.

in a few years kratom with be huge, or if not huge, pretty "big", at least in the codeine realm....., and the governments of the world are going to have to decide if they are going to hand over even more money to the cartels. if kratom does get illegalized in alot of places, who knows what analogs could be produced to compound the amount of money that can be made off of.....trees.

I am sure that there is some kratom being grown outdoors in warmer parts of the southern USA, in san diego the plant would winter fine.

I even have some kratom growing in my garage, and it is 10 degrees outside, and most of the healthy plants are doing fine in 43-60 degree growing chambers with only 1 grow light. I am going to move them outside this spring and start trying to make cuttings off of them. I have tried this winter, but it is too cool in the garage for any real growth. I would rather them go sorta dormant that over grow the garage.

kratom is growing everywhere there are enterprising people....

Thanks Jacky, that soothes the mind to know. And wish you the best w/ the Brazil project.

[I-Nod]

Ya, its indonesia... gotta love google. just another example of UTMFSE in action, right? lol

Huh, google had it in Malaysia when I searched. It's my fault tho... I just looked at whatever fit on the page when it came up... didn't scroll down any. Hell, that would entail me moving my finger!

[djnarkotik]

ya well, thailand is going to legalize it.

[jacky]

yeah, I hope thialand goes beyond legalization for junkies, they need to legalize the stuff all over for everyone....then we will see kratom prices DROP.

when I first started buying kratom around 6 years ago it would cost 190$ for 250 grams, and I would have to pay and wait like 2-4 weeks. it also wasnt that strong. so when I look at the prices today, I see alot of positive and little negative.

now, figuring I take around 30-50 grams of kratom a day when I am maintaining on just kratom, and prices can be as low as a few hundred dollers, I can effectively manage a habit for a little under what it would cost to use poppy pods. not bad for a tree leaf.

when I first ordered a live plant, and watched its growth pattern, I was really stoked, as I realized this plant grows fast, and if put outdoors in the right conditions, you will have a huge bush within a few years from just one little plant.

now I just need to get my ass down south.
maybe a cheap peice of land could be bought right on the Mexican border, where most people dont want to live anymore. throw up a kratom forest.....or maybe the conditions are too dry there...that and kratom likes some shade early on I have heard.

I had read that the plant does not become active until 4-5 years. I was suprised then to get sick from chewing just 1-2 fresh leaves on my way to work one day. I was on some opiates of course, but there was something in that kratom doing some work. I have since done this a few more times, and each time seem to get that kratom lift. more stimulant than anything.

[Curio]

I was trying to get my mom to sample some when she was also doing a taper off opiates post surgery...she lives near the southern border AZ/Mexico and has some acreage...plus she has an incredible green thumb...but if she doesn't understand how great it is she won't see the potential....found out she's never taken the capsules I've mailed her like twice over the past 6-8 months...

[AWOL]

If the government makes kratom a scheduled substance then they are really stupid, and just shooting themselves in the foot. I know a few people who use kratom just for the fact that it is legal. Not particularily strong, but legal. These are people who used to have serrious dope problems. Now, make it illegal and what do you think is going to happen? If kratom is illegal, and dope is also illegal but easy to find ..... it's deffinetly in the governments best interest not to schedule this substance. You can get a lot more messed up, for a lot less money on alcohol for christs sake.

[tptptp]

I was trying to get my mom to sample some when she was also doing a taper off opiates post surgery...she lives near the southern border AZ/Mexico and has some acreage...plus she has an incredible green thumb...but if she doesn't understand how great it is she won't see the potential....found out she's never taken the capsules I've mailed her like twice over the past 6-8 months...

Thats not necessarily a bad thing, nothing wrong with opiates but if someone can not get addicted to them more power to them. the legalities make it a rough lifestyle.

[tptptp]

If the government makes kratom a scheduled substance then they are really stupid, and just shooting themselves in the foot. I know a few people who use kratom just for the fact that it is legal. Not particularily strong, but legal. These are people who used to have serrious dope problems. Now, make it illegal and what do you think is going to happen? If kratom is illegal, and dope is also illegal but easy to find ..... it's deffinetly in the governments best interest not to schedule this substance. You can get a lot more messed up, for a lot less money on alcohol for christs sake.

Having alcohol legal and everythng else illegal is the biggest BS ever....they'll never change it with what it does for the economy(just like all the other drugs would do), but its BS we all know. Shit, I wish I enjoyed alcohol, cant stand the stuff and I come a family of several hardcore alcoholics on both sides.....at least my liver is happy with it I guess.....

In the DEA article on kratom they did at least say something about having potential for treating opiate addiction but "need more studies" or some BS. AKA make it illegal pretend to be doing some studies and never hear about those studies again....

I'm all for legalizing just about everything (aside from drugs that can make people aggressive/dangerous to themselves & others like PCP)

All they need to do is....make some kind of test that could test for how long ago certain drugs were ingested for like driving and shit (I'm sure it wouldnt be that hard if they used just a tiny bit of their war on drugs money to come up with it)

The one downside I see with legalizing everything is everybody will be driving on some pretty fucked up shit and thats never cool. But if they had some way to overcome that (maybe like an alcohol test thing in all cars that you blow inbto but worked for other drugs all hypothetical here I dunno science behind how it would work, thats would be cool)

Kratoms got me flappin cant help it...

[I-Nod]

The one downside I see with legalizing everything is everybody will be driving on some pretty fucked up shit and thats never cool. But if they had some way to overcome that (maybe like an alcohol test thing in all cars that you blow inbto but worked for other drugs all hypothetical here I dunno science behind how it would work, thats would be cool)

Kratoms got me flappin cant help it...

I'm with you here man. I would be more than willing to give up a lot of freedoms, as far as driving goes, if we were legally allowed certain "drugs". The cost would have to go down in direct ratio of the risk for the dealers... this would offset the price to take taxi's and use the bus except you dont have to worry about doing time behind bars for posession and intent. Freedom is priceless.

[djnarkotik]

In the DEA article on kratom they did at least say something about having potential for treating opiate addiction but "need more studies" or some BS. AKA make it illegal pretend to be doing some studies and never hear about those studies again....


Ya i dont know How in a democracy we let the DEA do shit like that.

before the DEA began the process to schedule MDMA (ecstasy) it was used by hundreds of Therapists for psychotherapy. People testified even that it can be used to help people- but do they care? fuck no

Its seems thier philosophy is if it can be a recreational drug nope sorry not allowed.

I think this will be changing in the future. They are letting some studies finally be done on MDMA to see if it helps ptsd. It doesnt make sense to ban drugs which can be potentially used as tools to help people in many different ways.

[RR1203]

I'm all for legalizing just about everything (aside from drugs that can make people aggressive/dangerous to themselves & others like PCP)


I also used to be a believer of legalizing everything, bc I feel supply and demand. If someone wants to do a drug they will and manufacturers are only supplying their need. Then when I was looking at renting an apartment I did research just on basic rental concerns to watch out for in my state and found that many rentals are health traps from the state's massive Meth problem. Wannabe cooks and hardcore manufacturers are renting property, cooking, and leaving them a sewer filled with poison.

I have a 16 mo. old child w/ severe allergies (been hospitalized twice already & 2 surgeries) and she reacts to just about anything. It's bad enough that our place had a smoker in it before and she is allergic to nicotine, but I was terrified our place could've had a Meth user too. I don't necessarily care that people use these drugs, bc it's their bodies. HOWEVER, it is the cooks that are killing our kids with the poison and many people don't understand the true issues involved with cooking Meth. If there was a centralized place for it to be cooked then I wouldn't care, but it's unsafe for it to be cooked in rentals that families may move into afterward and end up with severe health problems as a result of the Meth. Not too mention the possible effects of just the remnants left form smoking it! I don't think testing has ever been done just on the use of Meth use in a dwelling...one would think the chemicals would infest in the walls and flooring and little kids that crawl on the floor and lick everything could be negatively effected!

SCARY SHITE!

[tptptp]

I also used to be a believer of legalizing everything, bc I feel supply and demand. If someone wants to do a drug they will and manufacturers are only supplying their need. Then when I was looking at renting an apartment I did research just on basic rental concerns to watch out for in my state and found that many rentals are health traps from the state's massive Meth problem. Wannabe cooks and hardcore manufacturers are renting property, cooking, and leaving them a sewer filled with poison.

I have a 16 mo. old child w/ severe allergies (been hospitalized twice already & 2 surgeries) and she reacts to just about anything. It's bad enough that our place had a smoker in it before and she is allergic to nicotine, but I was terrified our place could've had a Meth user too. I don't necessarily care that people use these drugs, bc it's their bodies. HOWEVER, it is the cooks that are killing our kids with the poison and many people don't understand the true issues involved with cooking Meth. If there was a centralized place for it to be cooked then I wouldn't care, but it's unsafe for it to be cooked in rentals that families may move into afterward and end up with severe health problems as a result of the Meth. Not too mention the possible effects of just the remnants left form smoking it! I don't think testing has ever been done just on the use of Meth use in a dwelling...one would think the chemicals would infest in the walls and flooring and little kids that crawl on the floor and lick everything could be negatively effected!

SCARY SHITE!

Yeah, well meth is a touchy subject that could very well go into the dangerous category if nothing else for long term when they start to lose touch with reality.

But even if it were legalized the gov could step in and manufacture just about anything a bazilion times cheaper than these meth labs...and should solve that problem. They only exist now because its illegal and illegalization makes things expensive/profitable.

[RR1203]

I should also mention that when Meth labs get busted here many have families living in them with very young children! One was just busted and they found a 9 month old baby crawling around inside the room the Meth was cooked in with the chemicals laying on the floor! This is sad and we could just say 'well the parents should be more responsible', but as a society it is our problem (I feel) to care for these children that don't have parents responsible enough to do it! If we legalize everything, to include Meth, we would be opening the door to so many unnecessary health problems, not too mention possible deadly explosions from the volitile chemicals used to mix it!

I think many people forget this aspect of drug use. The drugs themselves may not be the problem, it's the manner in which people make and distribute them that harm our society and especially our children who don't have a choice, like adults do!

[RR1203]

Yeah, well meth is a touchy subject that could very well go into the dangerous category if nothing else for long term when they start to lose touch with reality.

But even if it were legalized the gov could step in and manufacture just about anything a bazilion times cheaper than these meth labs...and should solve that problem. They only exist now because its illegal and illegalization makes things expensive/profitable.

I agree with the govt. controlling manufacturing, but we are dreaming about that one since our Country is ruled by right-wing Christians (no offense to any Christians). These powerful people that 'own' our Country would never permit drugs to be legalized, especially the so called 'hard-core' drugs. This is bc our body is the temple of Christ and using drugs poisons that temple in most minds.

I wish this was different, but since religion rules the entire World (Wars, Politiciams, etc.) I don't see the Athiest' getting things to change anytime soon! And even though we pride ourselves on being a free Country it is only free to those that uphold the word of God and our laws even prove this...all based on God or Christ...oh, wait though...we supposedly have the freedom to our religion, I almost forgot!

Sad, but true.

[tptptp]

I agree with the govt. controlling manufacturing, but we are dreaming about that one since our Country is ruled by right-wing Christians (no offense to any Christians). These powerful people that 'own' our Country would never permit drugs to be legalized, especially the so called 'hard-core' drugs. This is bc our body is the temple of Christ and using drugs poisons that temple in most minds.

I wish this was different, but since religion rules the entire World (Wars, Politiciams, etc.) I don't see the Athiest' getting things to change anytime soon! And even though we pride ourselves on being a free Country it is only free to those that uphold the word of God and our laws even prove this...all based on God or Christ...oh, wait though...we supposedly have the freedom to our religion, I almost forgot!

Sad, but true.

Yup, I agree. Christianity is probably the biggest obstacle the drug war faces in reversing its policies and because of it will probably never change.....

[RR1203]

Yup, I agree. Christianity is probably the biggest obstacle the drug war faces in reversing its policies and because of it will probably never change.....

What I personally find funny is that many 'Christians' smoke pot, drink or pop pills, but the idea of legalization is ridiculous to them. Mostly because drug use is closeted! Nobody wants to admit they do it, bc it's a no-no in society. However, in ancient times it was accepted as the norm and that's how we have it in today's world to begin with. I think even recreational users are afraid to admit it, not just because it's illegal, but because other's may view them as 'drug addicts' and that is just unacceptable!

HOWEVER, our entire world is dependent on so many other drugs, but because they aren't necessarily mind altering (I disagree) it isn't a problem taking them often. Take Paxil for instance. I've been physically dependent on that crap for 8 years! I was scripted it while going through a hard time in College and the shrink gave me the magic pink pill and never told me it would take an act of God to get off the crap! I've unsuccessfully attempted to WD from it 8 times with medical guidance now (even put out on 8 wks short term disability once)...even tapering slowly with the liquid and I failed. I spent 3 mo. WD'ing and finally gave up, bc I couldn't take it anymore. Granted, GSK paid but not even close to what I've lost over the years. It's debilitating and most medical professionals have no clue! Most consumers don't know what kind of poison it is either and that 10% go on it cannot get off of it! At least opiate WD only last a week or so, but Paxil is poison...oh, but the answer they've given me is to get on another SSRI. Yeah, somehow I doubt that will be any easier to WD from folks! Trade one pill for another is their advice. And GSK there answer is to go back to my regular Paxil dose...that really only benefits them I think!

I'm still really bitter and I don't know if I will ever have the physical and mental strength to stop it again and I'm scared, bc if it's ever abruptly pulled off the market I'm so screwed!

BEWARE!

[lstar7]

I just recently discovered kratom after years of opiate and antidepressant struggles... I NEED for it to stay legal and will do all I can to keep it that way. I have no idea however to work against a system that is so corrupt, in that people have lost the right to choose how to care for themselves medically. I have NO health insurance, and kratom is offering me a new lease on life as I battle a debilitating condition.
Thank God for Kratom and may it forever be legal!

[munkeemunkee]

Definitely interested in growing kratom in the southern U.S.
Florida seems nice :) too many freezes in North Tejas.