Goddammit, I relapsed again! (redux)

[ZodiacKiller]

Well, it happened again--just when I've gotten myself down to 1mg of stinkin' Sub, I go and fuck it up by doing heroin. Out of the blue a good buddy calls and wants to hook large, in exchange for which I receive a free gram. So here I am, a few fat rails in, and feeling the come-up of the forbidden pleasure...

So, I'm hoping all our hard work ain't gonna be completely for naught---I was looking to get to .5 mg Sub by Monday and jump off by the end of the week. Might still be possible. It's only a one-night slip-up, and free at that---- I really hope so, cause this has not been an easy last month or so for us.

But jesus h christ does it feel good...

Sorry for this useless post, just had to share. :zhelp:



ZK

[slugbone]

Well, it happened again--just when I've gotten myself down to 1mg of stinkin' Sub, I go and fuck it up by doing heroin. Out of the blue a good buddy calls and wants to hook large, in exchange for which I receive a free gram. So here I am, a few fat rails in, and feeling the come-up of the forbidden pleasure...
So, I'm hoping all our hard work ain't gonna be completely for naught---I was looking to get to .5 mg Sub by Monday and jump off by the end of the week. Might still be possible. It's only a one-night slip-up, and free at that---- I really hope so, cause this has not been an easy last month or so for us.
But jesus h christ does it feel good...
Sorry for this useless post, just had to share. :zhelp:
ZK

ah dude you are still basically a chipper and every once in a while you gotta reward yourself glad to see you feeling good right now man

[repeek]

Maybe you can jump off the Sub because of it, you gotta be feeling pretty good about now. Put some distance between your Sub doses and count it as stepping point.

[Chemical_Boy]

Everyone has setbacks man. Enjoy it while it lasts and hop back on the wagon when it's over. As long as you don't re-up again you won't loose that much ground I don't think. Keep trying and good luck bro.

[Coddfish]

this doesn't change anything. the na fools say that you start your 'clean time' over when you slip up. barf. i wouldn't look at it as a 'slip up,' just a break.

you know what you want. you have the tools to get you there. you are committed. no worries.

how many o-philes could pass that situation up? that kinda stuff won't happen everyday. and if it does, then thank satan for his blessings.

dr. coddfish recommends you enjoy yourself with the idea that you're still gonna be off soon. good luck, champ.

[blueflutterfly]

Well, it happened again--just when I've gotten myself down to 1mg of stinkin' Sub, I go and fuck it up by doing heroin. Out of the blue a good buddy calls and wants to hook large, in exchange for which I receive a free gram. So here I am, a few fat rails in, and feeling the come-up of the forbidden pleasure...

So, I'm hoping all our hard work ain't gonna be completely for naught---I was looking to get to .5 mg Sub by Monday and jump off by the end of the week. Might still be possible. It's only a one-night slip-up, and free at that---- I really hope so, cause this has not been an easy last month or so for us.

But jesus h christ does it feel good...

Sorry for this useless post, just had to share. :zhelp:



ZK

through the reign of 12 step programs (which aren't actually medical in any whay what-so-ever) we've all become convinced a slip up = death. by believeing this, it becomes true. Fuck the thought...if your goal is a bit of clean time, let yerself enjoy the nite but that's it. don't let guilt and all the other terrible shite eat you up and away...it'll ensure you keep on using. enjoy the Hhead and pull yer boot straps back up tomorrow ;)

[youwonhundred]

Dude, as long as you dont make a habit out of it, you should be fine. Being straight sucks full time. Just don't go on a run and end up with a habit. You're a smart guy, you know your own limits. Just use a little restraint (I wish i had some of that).

[robojunkie]

Doubt it'll set ya back tolerance/habit wise, being as you're down to 1 or.5 mgs of the subs. If you'd been off for a couple a weeks, and still feeling shitty at 0, that would be a return of the sickness (don't know how th subs compare to done, but after being at 0 for like 3 or 4 weeks, a couple of cups of pods gave me mild wds after a couple of days). Wouldn't worry about it unless its a craving/again the next day, and so on kinda thing.

[HistoryofMadness]

yo man there's a difference between a slip and a fall just climb back on if that's what you're trying to do... easier said than done

[Cybershark]

Hey ZK,

Enjoy yourself now and then buddy we all do. I just wish I had your hook up though LOL! I just did and OC 80 and a few Hydro 10's myself buddy and I am feeling great now. I wish I had your H hookup but after I have read your posts lately maybe I am thankful I do not have it LOL. Anyways enjoy yourself buddy and I hope things go really well for you and your wife. ;)

[Chipper]

Well, it happened again--just when I've gotten myself down to 1mg of stinkin' Sub, I go and fuck it up by doing heroin. But jesus h christ does it feel good...
ZK

Don't beat yourself up about it as you have only set yourself back a few days. Just try to remember that the longer you abstain, the better you will feel.

Stopping the dope entirely is very scary for people like us because we tend to lose our identity.

[betmylife]

you can't make a habit of staying sober either, sometimes what happens, happens..just dont rack your brain with it.

[AWOL]

You'd be crazy not to have taken it. You got high, it was free, your H guy loves you even more, fun was had all around and it didn't cost you a dime! I wouldn't call that a setback, I'd call it a lucky break.

[alowishus]

You'd be crazy not to have taken it. You got high, it was free, your H guy loves you even more, fun was had all around and it didn't cost you a dime! I wouldn't call that a setback, I'd call it a lucky break.



Would have to agree, but I know what your saying about the subs ZK it sounded like you had a good plan all set out and were almost at your goal...."the best laid plans".
Now it just seems like back to square one again.

But I think unless you are going to try and stay clean for a long time or clean forever, this is the way it will always go.:p

[nick]

It's only one night bro.Enjoy it and move on. It's up to you if this slip becomes a fall.Much respect for controling your use and trying to get clean.
As someone said to me when I was getting clean, "if you make it or not,it's all good".Which I think roughly translated means we're roooting for you whatever.

[ZodiacKiller]

Thanks guys, for all your kind words and support. There's something about the anonynous empathy that we all share that makes this place so special to me. I know I can come here no matter what physical or emotional state I'm in and find some comfort...

Now it's Sunday, just before noon (my 'fuck-up' happened Friday night), and I felt a wee bit crappy earlier this morn and took 2mg Sub and now feel right as rain, so I don't think it was too bad of a setback. I'm gonna try to get back down to 1mg in the next 2 days, and I'm sure it'll be no prob.

But holy fuck, did it feel good. There's nothing like that first warm come-up of dope after one has been clean for a while. It's like the physical entity of a beautiful memory, and your body is saying " hello! I remember you---welcome back!..." Heaven on earth, goddammit. :cool:



ZK

[kyuss]

Thanks guys, for all your kind words and support. There's something about the anonynous empathy that we all share that makes this place so special to me. I know I can come here no matter what physical or emotional state I'm in and find some comfort...
Now it's Sunday, just before noon (my 'fuck-up' happened Friday night), and I felt a wee bit crappy earlier this morn and took 2mg Sub and now feel right as rain, so I don't think it was too bad of a setback. I'm gonna try to get back down to 1mg in the next 2 days, and I'm sure it'll be no prob.
But holy fuck, did it feel good. There's nothing like that first warm come-up of dope after one has been clean for a while. It's like the physical entity of a beautiful memory, and your body is saying " hello! I remember you---welcome back!..." Heaven on earth, goddammit. :cool:
ZK

It is a glorious feeling.
I'm glad you grabbed
the reigns before the horse
decided it wanted to roam.

[oxymoron]

sounds fine. I friend ansd I relapsed last night. The stuff made me feel better, but no nodding rushing, or tmuch itchin. It was eaither really poor dope or my tollerance is still kind of high

[Ragdoll]

I'm in total agreement with everyone else, ZK. I think you know what's-what and it's all cool, bro. Sometimes I think the biggest trap of all is being too hard on ourselves.

[geanine.aurora]

In terms of physically getting off the Sub, I really think doing the H will have not much if any impact on you. Do you have to end your detox at a set time or can you stretch it out more? I really like the idea of waiting longer and longer between doses. It's probably a good way to go. On the other hand the whole process is so crummy it can seem like hell to prolong it!
Emotionally is another issue. Were you planning to quit H? If so maybe you need more time on sub to come up with a plan.
Maybe you don't exactly know what you want to do. I think that's how I am right now!
Good luck to you and whatever you are trying to do.

[blackdog]

hey zk just don't open open your mouth at any n.a./a.a.
meetings. cause oh man you'll never hear the end of it. oh man....you can't do that! you don't want to get clean.you'll never stop using drugs. you're a weakling. you have no self control.The drugs control you.You have to do 30 meetings in 30 days or else!! hah hah what a bunch of malarchy! them bastards!! hah ha.
whatever floats your boat cuz.them bastard don't know what to believe.all i can say is that shite works for some folks and for others like myself it just gets me sick.
dawgg,:p

[flipside]

After our visit the other day, I have no doubt in my mind that you have the resolve and determination to do what you said you were going to. Now that you are back at work and things seem to be getting somewhat back to normal, before you know it you'll be back to being a weekend warriorr if you choose. if not you''ll be okay in that respect too. You know where to find me if you oir the Mrs. needs anything.. Talk with you soon. I may have found a place so if you guys are still gonna come up and help me move I'll let ya know when, but it looks like it could be pretty quick.

[OxyContinuously]

"All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy." ------> played out and cliche, i know, but true nonetheless.

Relax, you had a night of fun. You didn't fuck up in the sense that you flushed everything down the toilet. It was one night. You should be cool. get back on track with the Subs and take it in stride.

:-)

Oxy

[ZodiacKiller]

Yeah, the occasional relapse ain't gonna hurt, I don't think, but there is a certain amount of guilt and self-betrayal that accompanies each time. I have a tendency to beat myself up when I don't realize the goals I've set for myself. Ahh, shit, I guess I'm gonna be a goddamm junky and that's all there is to it. No more illusions....:(


ZK

[flipside]

Aw ZK, lighten up on yourself brother. We just had a long talk about guilt and shame regarding my son, mabey you should take some of your own sage advice my friend. I'll call you in a bit. Hang in there.

[alowishus]

Yeah, what she said.

Are you gonna be one OR were you born one? :D

[nick]

Hell bro,there are worst things to be than a junky,like a christian.

Take care and don't beat yourself up Zed.

Keep giving it your best shot-you can do no more and if you want to talk to another fool struggling with sobriety my pm amd e mail are always open to you.

[alowishus]

Hell bro,there are worst things to be than a junky,like a christian.


Or a Bush voter/supporter.:D :D :p :p


& btw nick, wtf is a vicker? :rolleyes:

[nick]

Sorry bro,it's a mix of my poor,very poor spelling and a powerful hatred of organised religion.
What can I say,but sorry-I'm an idiot.

[alowishus]

Sorry bro,it's a mix of my poor,very poor spelling and a powerful hatred of organised religion.
What can I say,but sorry-I'm an idiot.

?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ???????????????????

I just wanted to know what a vicker was mate? :D

[flipside]

LMAO guys, thanks. hang in there ZK.

[nick]

?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ???????????????????

I just wanted to know what a vicker was mate? :D
It's actually german for wicker of it could be a vicar with a head full of k.Sorry,but you've got to admire my trying-haven't you?

[Heroine]

Well, it happened again--just when I've gotten myself down to 1mg of stinkin' Sub, I go and fuck it up by doing heroin. Out of the blue a good buddy calls and wants to hook large, in exchange for which I receive a free gram. So here I am, a few fat rails in, and feeling the come-up of the forbidden pleasure...

So, I'm hoping all our hard work ain't gonna be completely for naught---I was looking to get to .5 mg Sub by Monday and jump off by the end of the week. Might still be possible. It's only a one-night slip-up, and free at that---- I really hope so, cause this has not been an easy last month or so for us.

But jesus h christ does it feel good...

Sorry for this useless post, just had to share. :zhelp:



ZK

Hell, I agree with DV on this one-it was free, probably felt it hardcore since it's been awhile. Just enjoy it and take it for what it is. It was only one time, so don't dwell on it or feel bad about it. As long as you try to get back on track you should be cool. Just do what you were doin as if it never happened. Everyone deserves a little extra pleasure every now and then.

[scikid]

Don't beat yourself up over it man, everyone has setbacks. Just make sure you stand back up on your feet.

[ZodiacKiller]

Yeah, shit, I'm/we're ok---we even relapsed AGAIN since I first posted this---WTF? once a junky always a junky, eh?---but to tell the truth , there have been NO WDs....how the fuck is that? We were down to minimal amount of Sub, we fall off the wagon, then expect the worst, and no fucking withdrawals??? Did we beat the shit finally? I'm sure if we went on a week long bender there would be WD, but these were 2 isolated instances, about a week apart, and I swear to fucking satan, no withdrawal!! WTF? Oh, well I'm not one to look a gift horse in the mouth: I'll take it, but it flies in the face of every opiate experience I've ever had, and there's been a lot. Weird shit, man, I tell ya---I expected the worst, and here it is two days later and not a single WD symptom. Plus we did a couple benzos today just for the loopy buzz of it, and still no opiate WD....

All I can say is Koool! Oh, and the smack was some of THE BEST I've ever had, too, so there!



ZK

[nick]

Always hope for the best while expecting the worst bro.Glad you're OK after it all.

[candyshop]

do i get to call it a relapse if it happens daily?

[L0VE]

Well, it happened again--just when I've gotten myself down to 1mg of stinkin' Sub, I go and fuck it up by doing heroin. Out of the blue a good buddy calls and wants to hook large, in exchange for which I receive a free gram. So here I am, a few fat rails in, and feeling the come-up of the forbidden pleasure...

So, I'm hoping all our hard work ain't gonna be completely for naught---I was looking to get to .5 mg Sub by Monday and jump off by the end of the week. Might still be possible. It's only a one-night slip-up, and free at that---- I really hope so, cause this has not been an easy last month or so for us.

But jesus h christ does it feel good...

Sorry for this useless post, just had to share. :zhelp:



ZK

Hey join the club. I made it to the 7th day and then today, did a line of oc, it felt amazing and I'm still high. But I wasn't trying to stay clean, so that sucks about your situation. I was off of ocs in the summer of 05' for one whole month and then by the end of the month, I did one and then went straight into 07'.

[Curio]

do i get to call it a relapse if it happens daily?
:D

[ZodiacKiller]

Ok, sorry to bump my thread, but something weird is going on:

Last relapse was six days ago, right? So I did a 2mg Sub one day after that (and wasn't even feeling much WD, just figured it had to be there, right?)....and haven't done ANY since. None. No WDs at all. WTF is going on here?

I've been doing some benzos, and saw my reg doc (not my opiate doc) mid-week who gave me some samples of Cymbalta, which I've been wanting to try, and I like, BTW....they have a weird little buzz when you first take 'em, too. And she said it was ok to combine the Cymbalta with my regular dose of Welbutrin, so I've been doing that.

My wife is suffering the WDs as usual after a relapse (down to 2mg daily, but she still feels like crap without 'em). Why am I not WDing? I mean, I ain't complaining---if this continues and I can avoid a relapse I will be motherfucking CLEAN, in fact I am right now, but I can't understand why? I've been doing the Heroin/Bupe thing for ages now, and we all know what toll it takes---on your tolerance, and your level of withdrawal, so WTF is going on?

But the bottom line is I am CLEAN---no sub or any other opiate for FIVE days. Something is up here. Maybe it's the Cymbalta.....any thoughts?


ZK

[nick]

Way to go Zed.I'm really pleased for you and I figure fate owed you a break.Now the gig is staying clean,welcome to the club.

[Duckfeet]

Ok, sorry to bump my thread, but something weird is going on:

Last relapse was six days ago, right? So I did a 2mg Sub one day after that (and wasn't even feeling much WD, just figured it had to be there, right?)....and haven't done ANY since. None. No WDs at all. WTF is going on here?

I've been doing some benzos, and saw my reg doc (not my opiate doc) mid-week who gave me some samples of Cymbalta, which I've been wanting to try, and I like, BTW....they have a weird little buzz when you first take 'em, too. And she said it was ok to combine the Cymbalta with my regular dose of Welbutrin, so I've been doing that.

My wife is suffering the WDs as usual after a relapse (down to 2mg daily, but she still feels like crap without 'em). Why am I not WDing? I mean, I ain't complaining---if this continues and I can avoid a relapse I will be motherfucking CLEAN, in fact I am right now, but I can't understand why? I've been doing the Heroin/Bupe thing for ages now, and we all know what toll it takes---on your tolerance, and your level of withdrawal, so WTF is going on?

But the bottom line is I am CLEAN---no sub or any other opiate for FIVE days. Something is up here. Maybe it's the Cymbalta.....any thoughts?


ZK

Hey ZK: Good deal. I'm on day five without'em, too, but I just did a CWE on 10 5mg hydros, so... Don't feel much, but I'm sure that's why I'm not sick ;-) But with me it's more cuz I just can't seem to connect down here in SD...all my old tricks so far have failed me. I talk a good game, but shit, I think it's a lot luck, and so far even needle xchanges and mdone clinics, no dice, but soon enough, eventually, something comes thru. Part of paying tired old junky dues, nothing changes...

I know we've talked before about bup. It seems to have really *varying* effects, with different people. I mean I've read some of the most credible horror stories, by long term users, and also people who love it. I *didn't* like it for maintenance, but definitely think it serves a good purpose when trying to kick H or mdone. but it's weird stuff. I think it kind of rejects *itself* at times, but certainly makes other drugs have less kick...but weird how u can have no withdrawal symptoms at all, even after quitting it, but I've heard of that happening. Maybe a little depression for a month or two, but even that varies...

Anyway, best of luck to you, wherever u aim....

[slugbone]

But the bottom line is I am CLEAN---no sub or any other opiate for FIVE days. Something is up here. Maybe it's the Cymbalta.....any thoughts?
ZK


if cymbalta is the only variable, then it is worth investigating further. you may have inadvertently discovered something good ZK.

either that or your junkie gene code has mutated into something new and strange, a sort of Uber-Junkie that does not even let w/d get to him.

[alowishus]

You musta done some good somewhere and got a little karma.......how the HELL did that happen?


Don't knock it, same here.

After about 10 days, some w/ lope and the last w/o, save for a friend w/ some weed for those 3 days, help w/ the boredom - get a little boast in energy.

A little ache, some other stuff but feel fine and had no reall wd........ Have I just not hit the wall? But it's got to be over/out by now.

I don't know where this good luck comes from, but I'm taking it anyway. :D


Enjoy ZK.

[Curio]

just be careful, sounds like the new combo of meds is working, but I also started cymbalta recently, so wanted to share what I found on epocrates:

[Cymbalta/bupropion]

caution advised: combo may incr. duloxetine levels; incr. risk of seizures, other adverse effects (hepatic metab. inhibited; additive effects)