guided or unguided tours

[bi11i]

anyone out here had any experience in using ibogaine either supervised or not? how about any interested in doing such a thing?

not that I'm offering, but would anyone be interested in taking this trip knowing that they'd be able to move on without opiates. (a great poll....)

[SomniGod]

Anything to fill this 'hollow-achey-hole' throughout my body!!!
Just call me: guinea pig #1a

~S~

[Opiyum]

For me its a bit of both the first and second option. I wouldn't like to use it to discontinue my use for some period of time but I don't like the thought of never using opiates again. The experience would be great too. The experience of the trip itself and the experience of not wanting opiates so much that it hurts. Going from thinking that opiates are my saving grace to thinking of opiates as a poison.
It's amazing stuff and I would not hesitate for even one second.

[Seedy]

^^ I'm with you on this one. It's good to know it exists that's for sure.

Check out this doco on ibogaine I just stumbled upon:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01zpMjU6pF8

Very encouraging - the first part that is, just about to watch the next...

Edit: just watced the rest. I think this is the best footage I've seen on the subject of ibogaine treatment. I'd definately try it.

[Duckfeet]

All I have is personal experience w/a couple guys who had taken it, and one guy who had been some counselor at a clinic in Mexico where a guy *died* on one of these trips...both guys were flakey, one seemed almost psychotic...both swore by ibogaine...not for me, tho; I'm curious, but like most things in life, we tend to get our prejudices from what we see...best of luck to people who want to try it out. But what I've seen and heard I find spooky...

[underide]

I really think that i'd be willing to give this a try.
I think the first time i heard about ibogaine was around 5-6 years ago. I didn't really think much of it i guess, but at that time i didn't even think that i would be still using opiates today.
I guess i was a little skeptical too and had my doubts, like most people.

About 6 months ago, i met a guy who i knew from my early using days and he was the kind of guy who was using more than most people i knew. He was using more than anyone i had ever seen (and probably longer too), and just by the looks of it, i thought that he would be the last person on this planet to ever quit using dope. So anyway, when i met him the last time, i found out that he was CLEAN! I couldn't believe it.
But it seems he really is completely clean. He did ibogaine therapy about a year ago over in England and now he's really getting his life together.

So, after seeing him, i started to look into ibogaine more thoroughly, reading up on it more, and now i think that it might be worth a try.
I don't think we have Ibogaine therapy here in Ireland, even though i don't think it's illegal here.
They do have ibogaine therapy in England, which isn't that far from here, so if i decide to do that, that's probably where i'm going to go. The good thing about it is, that it is done completely legally over there and under hospital setting, so it should be much safer that what the clandestine therapists seem to offer in places where it's illegal.

[nick]

Umm man,I'm pretty sure that ibo is a controlled drug in England and if you get bust with it;you will not pass go,you will not collect £200 and you will go to jail.

It is illegal,but like pods,the powers that be kinda turn a blind eye.

I'm pretty sure of this-unless the law has changed recently.

[Saint]

I'm scared shitless by any substance that makes me loose control over myself.
Heroine never did that, coke didn't and even benzo's and booze I can handle in moderation but ibogaine is not for me. I used psychotics when I was younger and didn't like it one bit..

[jdub]

I'm scared shitless by any substance that makes me loose control over myself.
Heroine never did that, coke didn't and even benzo's and booze I can handle in moderation but ibogaine is not for me. I used psychotics when I was younger and didn't like it one bit..

Psychotics. Lol...

I would do it, but what if it killed my love of Opi's? Then what wud I have left huh?

[Saint]

Psychotics. Lol...

I would do it, but what if it killed my love of Opi's? Then what wud I have left huh?

Your melon hat! At least better than nothing

[nick]

I'm scared shitless by any substance that makes me loose control over myself.
Heroine never did that, coke didn't and even benzo's and booze I can handle in moderation but ibogaine is not for me. I used psychotics when I was younger and didn't like it one bit..

Odd,I've used a lot of psycotics(psychedelics),but the only drug that made me lose control of myself was heroin..............Oh and coke...............umm and booze.

I'm not very good with this self control thing.

[Saint]

Odd,I've used a lot of psycotics(psychedelics),but the only drug that made me lose control of myself was heroin..............Oh and coke...............umm and booze.

I'm not very good with this self control thing.

I know, I know... psychedelics.. I find it rather funny in a stupid way reading it back if I may say so myself. Gave Meloncat a laugh anyway..

I meant selfcontrol in the sense that I'm still more or less aware of what I'm doing and I didn't know what the hell I was doing on psychedelics... I did some crazy stuff on those 'supermans', 'sugarcubes' or whatever the hell they were called back then. (God that sounds like I'm an old hippy or something).
Even pot freaks me out nowadays.
But about any strong opy will make me feel reborn.. too bad can't go down that road again.. Ofcourse I lack all selfcontrol as far as heroin is concerned, that's why I'm in this never ending merry-go-round of methadone (and even lame tramadol)-withdrawals nowadays.

(ain't too good with booze either..)

Fuck Melonhat, you have 1111 posts!

[underide]

Umm man,I'm pretty sure that ibo is a controlled drug in England and if you get bust with it;you will not pass go,you will not collect £200 and you will go to jail.

It is illegal,but like pods,the powers that be kinda turn a blind eye.

I'm pretty sure of this-unless the law has changed recently.


Well, Nick, here is just one of the sources which seems to be legitimate:

http://www.ibogainetherapy.co.uk/.

There are more.
I'm surprised you haven't come across any yourself, cause as far as i know they have been operating for years and years now.

I think there is a bit of a loophole in laws in the UK concerning Ibogaine.
While it is not actually legal, it is tolerated by the government.
Sort of like Cannabis in Holland, i presume, where cannabis is NOT actually legal, but it is tolerated by the government which even provides special licenses and regulations, etc., for certain coffee shops and so on.
Weird, huh.. Many people probably don't realize it - Marijuana is not actually legal in Holland. It is decriminalized/tolerated by the law. Why don't they just legalize it and get it over with, right? Probably still too big a step for any culture to take.

Anyway, yeah there seems to be number of providers of Ibogaine in he UK to my knowledge and some of the providers even set up proper hospital environment for their treatments with doctors and nurses right there on call.

[nick]

Well, Nick, here is just one of the sources which seems to be legitimate:

http://www.ibogainetherapy.co.uk/.

There are more.
I'm surprised you haven't come across any yourself, cause as far as i know they have been operating for years and years now.

I think there is a bit of a loophole in laws in the UK concerning Ibogaine.
While it is not actually legal, it is tolerated by the government.
Sort of like Cannabis in Holland, i presume, where cannabis is NOT actually legal, but it is tolerated by the government which even provides special licenses and regulations, etc., for certain coffee shops and so on.
Weird, huh.. Many people probably don't realize it - Marijuana is not actually legal in Holland. It is decriminalized/tolerated by the law. Why don't they just legalize it and get it over with, right? Probably still too big a step for any culture.

Anyway, yeah there seems to be number of providers of Ibogaine in he UK to my knowledge and some of the providers even set up proper hospital environment for their treatments with doctors and nurses right there on call.

Yeah,I've seen stuff like this before.I believe they're either operating in a loophole or a blind eye is being turned.
I know some folks who carry out ibo therapy in Canterbury and they do know what they're doing.I'm pretty sure they told me in early 2007 that ibo was still illegal in England.
Oddly,the price they quoted was more expensive than flying to New York and doing an ibo detox there.
Either way,if you give it a go,let me know how it goes.

[nick]

I was intrigued so I rang a friend who actually administers ibogaine in England and they tell me it's a loophole.The gig is ibogaine is NOT illegal in England,but you DO need a rx.

[underide]

Yeah,I've seen stuff like this before.I believe they're either operating in a loophole or a blind eye is being turned.
I know some folks who carry out ibo therapy in Canterbury and they do know what they're doing.I'm pretty sure they told me in early 2007 that ibo was still illegal in England.
Oddly,the price they quoted was more expensive than flying to New York and doing an ibo detox there.
Either way,if you give it a go,let me know how it goes.

Will do..
I wouldn't exactly say i'm in a hurry to go for it, but i have been thinking about it more and more.
I figure that first of all i would need to taper my 'done dose down to about 30 or 20 mgs before i actually go for the treatment.
I think some therapists actually insist that you do taper as much as you can and stabilize on a low dose before you begin your treatment.

[nick]

Will do..
I wouldn't exactly say i'm in a hurry to go for it, but i have been thinking about it more and more.
I figure that first of all i would need to taper my 'done dose down to about 30 or 20 mgs before i actually go for the treatment.
I think some therapists actually insist that you do taper as much as you can and stabilize on a low dose before you begin your treatment.


Make sure they do a proper physical.I believe they have to carry out specific tests on your liver because some folks lack an enzyme that breaks ibogaine down without it becoming toxic.I doubt this applies to many people,but better safe than sorry.

Actually,please check this because I'm going on very distant memories.

[Ludakris]

There is a clinic not far from where I live...of course there is a LOT of prescreening, application process, and only a few get in, etc, etc et...if you can get in, the detox program is 5-7 days and is about $4500. I've often wondered what it would be like to go through this...now, I am currently a chronic pain patient, but I've been dicked around by doctors for several years now. At the moment, I'm being fairly well treated, but you never know with doctors, and when a good doc is going to drop you, or drop dead, or get arrested, or whatever...so I am wondering that if I beat the psychological aspect of being an addict if I could handle being untreated, or under-treated for pain...or if I do the detox, and the pain gets worse, if I'll be totally screwed?

It seems like Ibogaine, eliminates WD symptoms and removes the "addict thinking pattern" or whatever, but doesn't actually block the function of opi's.

idk, I very much feel like my addictive nature is from my father...maybe it's just me placing blame...but he's a terrible alcoholic, has been "drunk" for about 30 years straight and is just not a very good person, but...I guess, he's the only one in the family that is an addict (besides me, but I'm a closet addict). I really want that part of me removed, I don't want to have this addictive personality...and it seems like this treatment could really help with that.

Ah fuck, who knows...the place also offers and "experience" option that is 3 days...maybe I'll just do that.

[Duckfeet]

Me too, Saint: absolutely, and me and this old friend I have in Louisiana and me were talkiing about this very thing yesterday, how we learned to dislike intensely drugs where we felt we didn't have control: my first acid trip was frightening for an hour or so, because I could feel my "ego" or something going by the wayside, and until I found my old copy of Workingman's Dead, and started laying out some ER Grateful Dead, I was really spooked...

Also why, over the years, I got to dislike shooting up coke, and any psychodelics, and all time worst most hated is PCP, since at one time these bikers I knew thought it was cool/funny to lace pot w/that shit....


I'm scared shitless by any substance that makes me loose control over myself.
Heroine never did that, coke didn't and even benzo's and booze I can handle in moderation but ibogaine is not for me. I used psychotics when I was younger and didn't like it one bit..

[Saint]

Me too, Saint: absolutely, and me and this old friend I have in Louisiana and me were talkiing about this very thing yesterday, how we learned to dislike intensely drugs where we felt we didn't have control: my first acid trip was frightening for an hour or so, because I could feel my "ego" or something going by the wayside, and until I found my old copy of Workingman's Dead, and started laying out some ER Grateful Dead, I was really spooked...

Also why, over the years, I got to dislike shooting up coke, and any psychodelics, and all time worst most hated is PCP, since at one time these bikers I knew thought it was cool/funny to lace pot w/that shit....

I don't even smoke pot anymore. Last time I smoked some (laced?) pot I couldn't walk or handle my bike, scared the hell out of me.
I remember my first acid trip with a friend when I was 15. We were listening to the Virgin Prunes (yes, a band ;-) and the song was called 'If I die I die' and next thing I know my friend turns black and goes up in smoke. I only saw two feverish green eyes floating in my room.
Later, I experienced whole rooms closing in on me, ceilings pushing me down, crushing me, all that sort of shit.
Psychedelics obviously aren't my thing. Guess there's just too many horrorshows hidden in my subconsciousness.

No coke for me either, maybe I'm getting old. Opiates are my only cure to life.

[jonny-5]

ive always liked psychadelics like LSD and mushies in moderate doses, not high ones tho. fuck, once i accidentally ate 7 grams of gold caps and i couldnt get off the ground, and the carpet was growing around me, and then nothing was recognizable as anything. its hard to explain. the first 4 hours of the trip were just horrible, and if anyone here knows anything about bad trips, they know that 4 hours was actually 16 to me.

but then all of a sudden this kid nick showed up and my trip mellowed out. everyone still had 6+ eyes and elongated snouts but from then on i had a good trip. then i drove to my meeting at the mall i worked at with the regional manager and i was still tripping. that sucked balls.


anyways sorry for going off topic there. if taking this shit for a few days not only made my withdrawls go away, but gave me a euphoric trip as well, and made me never wanna do heroin again, then i would definnitely try it.

im so fucking sick of building my life up and tearing it down over and over and over its driving me nuts.

[jdub]

ive always liked psychadelics like LSD and mushies in moderate doses, not high ones tho. fuck, once i accidentally ate 7 grams of gold caps and i couldnt get off the ground, and the carpet was growing around me, and then nothing was recognizable as anything. its hard to explain. the first 4 hours of the trip were just horrible, and if anyone here knows anything about bad trips, they know that 4 hours was actually 16 to me.

but then all of a sudden this kid nick showed up and my trip mellowed out. everyone still had 6+ eyes and elongated snouts but from then on i had a good trip. then i drove to my meeting at the mall i worked at with the regional manager and i was still tripping. that sucked balls.


anyways sorry for going off topic there. if taking this shit for a few days not only made my withdrawls go away, but gave me a euphoric trip as well, and made me never wanna do heroin again, then i would definnitely try it.

im so fucking sick of building my life up and tearing it down over and over and over its driving me nuts.

How did you "accidentally eat 7 grams"?

[jonny-5]

How did you "accidentally eat 7 grams"?

its kinda a long story, but ill try to shorten it. i worked at this mall as customer service. my friends and i had pitched in on 2 ounces of mushies, and i was at work telling them to wait to eat them till i got there. so finally i got off work, and get to my friends place in eagle rock, and hes nowhere to be found, but his girl is there with her friend and they are trippin already. so i knew that it was his girls first time, so she was gonna eat half an 8th. thats how much i wanted to start out with too. there were all these styrofoam bowls on the table with what looked like they had same amount of mushies in each one.


so i asked her, did you eat one bowls worth, or two, or what? she said she ate one bowl. so i ate all the mushies in one of the bowls thinking its half an 8th, cuz she ate half an 8th and thats what i wanted to start with. so my friend tristan gets back with these other people, and theyre all trippin, im not yet, so hes like "lets eat some more mushrooms and go walk around the park at occidental college." so i ate 2 more grams. we all did. so we go on this walk and i told him i ate one of the bowls worth and he said that there was an 8th in each one. i was like, ok, thats cool, ive eaten over an 8th before. so at this point ive eaten 5.5 grams


so we go on this long ass walk through the trees and shit, and im not really trippen, but im starten to feel something (mushrooms and acid always take really long to kick in for me) so im trying to spit game at this girl, but shes trippen so hard that my game is working one minute and the next its not at all. so by the time we get back to the house, im seeing colors and shit. tristan has the bright idea of eating a couple more mushrooms. it had been like 2 hours since i ate the original 8th, and i was not really trippin that hard so i ate a few more mushrooms which i estimate to be at the very least a gram and a half. so were sitting on the couch and im still spitting game to this girl and shes cool and digging it but then goes to the bathroom and has a bad trip and decides to go home. from then on my trip got stronger and stronger and worse and worse till i was on his back balcony just rocking back and forth on the ground, i couldnt really see anything except random shapes and colors and shit so i couldnt walk anywhere. it was really fucked up. but then like i said earlier that kid nick came back and everything was cool. it was like i needed that extra person there or something i dont know.

i had some really crazy times at that house.

[Nate]

^^oh buddy that sounds so much like a trip of mine. Most times I have lots of energy, but I was so fucked I couldn't even move I just laid down and held on for dear life. Most fucked up thing I didn't know if my eyes were open or closed because I would see the same thing. Ah good times, sorry for going off topic.

[Saint]

^^oh buddy that sounds so much like a trip of mine. Most times I have lots of energy, but I was so fucked I couldn't even move I just laid down and held on for dear life. Most fucked up thing I didn't know if my eyes were open or closed because I would see the same thing. Ah good times, sorry for going off topic.

I can relate a 100% to your quote underneath :(
Past 2 am here and still wide awake despite benzo's
back to topic, I liked your elongated-snouts-story Jonny, hope you're on to building your life up from now on, maybe you should write short stories about bad trips..

[jonny-5]

I can relate a 100% to your quote underneath :(
Past 2 am here and still wide awake despite benzo's
back to topic, I liked your elongated-snouts-story Jonny, hope you're on to building your life up from now on, maybe you should write short stories about bad trips..


are you serious? i have tons of em. we all do im sure. if ud like ill tell you about the first time i accidentally smoked PCP in the 8th grade....

[Nate]

Oh man I am sure we all have some crazy stories.

Would make for a good thread.

[jdub]

I have honestly never had a bad trip. I like to think it is because I am part Mescalero.

[Nate]

I have honestly never had a bad trip. I like to think it is because I am part Mescalero.

Ive had a couple..but once I realized a very low benzo dose pre tripping stops bad trips. Then its nothing but awsome trips. Works for me anyways.

[jonny-5]

Ive had a couple..but once I realized a very low benzo dose pre tripping stops bad trips. Then its nothing but awsome trips. Works for me anyways.

this is true, but its only recently that ive had constant access to benzos again. back in my tripping days (from age 15-19) i really didnt. then i did for a while, i sold them among other things, but was not taking hallucinogenics any more. just a lot of ketamine and weed. ive never had benzos around while acid or mushies or mescaline or 2CT were there.

but logically it makes a lot of sense that benzos would prevent a bad trip.

[Nate]

this is true, but its only recently that ive had constant access to benzos again. back in my tripping days (from age 15-19) i really didnt. then i did for a while, i sold them among other things, but was not taking hallucinogenics any more. just a lot of ketamine and weed. ive never had benzos around while acid or mushies or mescaline or 2CT were there.

but logically it makes a lot of sense that benzos would prevent a bad trip.

I want to try acid at least once...but I think the odds of trying are not in my favor. K is fun, haven't seen any in time though.

[jdub]

Ive had a couple..but once I realized a very low benzo dose pre tripping stops bad trips. Then its nothing but awsome trips. Works for me anyways.

Benzos kill my trip, they don't make it good. I don't get the mindfuck I am looking for.

[jonny-5]

I want to try acid at least once...but I think the odds of trying are not in my favor. K is fun, haven't seen any in time though.

i used to drive down to tijuana every week and pick up 6-10 vials for 15 bux each. then drive home, cook it into powder, and sell half and do the other half with my friends. one vial yields 11 20 bags, so you sell one bag and youve already made 5 bux. that was during my "rave" days, selling K paid for many E-d out sex nites and crazy parties, dropping 600 bux a weekend on parties. that was the hight of my drug days, cause after the K days were over i started selling pills, and got addicted to them. now its 5 years later and im a junkie with nothing.



but acid is fun as fuck. i love that stuff. when i lived in seattle i managed to score a tab. good acid hasnt been around LA since the mid-late 90s, so when i was only able to get one tab i was dissapointed. and then on top of that, my roomate convinced me to split the tab with him. but that was some good shit, cause even off half a tab we both had a great trip. seattle has some good acid. damn fine acid.

[jdub]

i used to drive down to tijuana every week and pick up 6-10 vials for 15 bux each. then drive home, cook it into powder, and sell half and do the other half with my friends. one vial yields 11 20 bags, so you sell one bag and youve already made 5 bux. that was during my "rave" days, selling K paid for many E-d out sex nites and crazy parties, dropping 600 bux a weekend on parties. that was the hight of my drug days, cause after the K days were over i started selling pills, and got addicted to them. now its 5 years later and im a junkie with nothing.

Yeah buddy. We used to fill gallon water bottles with K and bring em back to the USA.

[Saint]

are you serious? i have tons of em. we all do im sure. if ud like ill tell you about the first time i accidentally smoked PCP in the 8th grade....

hehe, do tell

[clinton]

can anyone tell me what part of the body ibogaine affects to cause death?

[underide]

can anyone tell me what part of the body ibogaine affects to cause death?

Ibogaine affects the heart in some people with pre-existing heart problems, sometimes with lethal outcomes, unfortunately.
Most people are not affected by that to my knowledge. A lot of therapists (even ones that operate illegaly) ask for an EKG to be done by the patient specifically for that reason.

Ibogaine also causes temporary muscle paralysis, which in some cases can cause breathing problems but such cases are also pretty rare.
Nonetheless, it really helps if you have a doctor or two on call at all times during your therapy.
In countries where this is done under hospital settings, like in the UK, death from Ibogaine is almost unheard of, for that very reason.

[Ludakris]

can anyone tell me what part of the body ibogaine affects to cause death?


I do believe that it can be potentially toxic to the liver if you do not have certain natural occurring enzymes that breakdown the toxins in Ibogaine, which could then lead to death.

[devilsdrug]

last nite usa channel csi or some such shit ibo was like the star of the show