Is Doctor Hopping Illegal???

[Papa Verine]

Hey Everyone, I really am asking a question here for a good friend of mine. (no SWIM)

My friend is a female prostitute. She does her thing to make money and uses the money to take care of her two children. She has a 2 year old girl and a 6 year old boy. I baby-sit for her A lot and her kids play with my 4 year old daughter. She doesn't do what she does to support a crack habit or anything like that. She does enjoy opiates but won't do heroin or anything hard-core. She uses the money she earns to provide for her kids and she's probably the best "Friend" I've ever known. We all have friends but there are different degrees of friendship. Some (your closest) will do anything to help you. Others will help you if they can. Others are merely acquaintances and you can't count on them when the going gets tough. We all know how it is!

Well, this girl is a GREAT friend. I post this thread because I'm truly worried about her and I truly don't know the answer to the question I'm about to ask. Any replies are GREATLY appreciated.

My friend has found that she can get regular prescriptions of Tramadol, Vicodin, Percocet, Fioricet etc...etc... by visiting different doctors in the area and complaining of pains. She really, truly has shoulder pain but in all reality she just enjoys opiates. Doctor visits and scripts are covered by public aid because she's a single parent and qualifies for medical care. She sees several different doctors and they don't all nessicarily know she's seeing different docs. for pain meds.

My question is... "Is this illegal"? Is this considered "Doctor hopping"? Is she at risk of being prosecuted for this???

If anybody understands the legalities of this better than I do please let me know!!!!!!!!!!

[slugbone]

well, i do it all the time with op's, but never with public aid. i know medical information is private and restricted but not sure since public aid is involved if she is doing somehting wrong.

chances are she will never get caught, i mean if it has to do with the govt who is gonna notice?

[candyshop]

i think with state medical (i have this as well) they can link all scripts paid for by state insurance through the computer system -i think if the scripts overlap she could get smacked down-she could risk losing her benefits as well as face legal action --perhaps even risk losing her kids--i do not want to be alarmist but in my state EVERYTHING paid for by state health care is linked and if she is getting multiple scripts for the same thing in the same time period it is asking for trouble

[SpecialGuy69]

By using state aid, she's leaving a big time paper trail. It would be really easy for them to catch on (someone at the aid agency), especially if she's getting expensive drugs covered by insurance. If it's cheap generics, they probably won't raise any red flags, but if the agency is outlaying big money on prescriptions, they'll take a closer look. It's a bad idea.

There's nothing wrong with doctor Shopping, where you go check out different doctors until you find one who understands you and treats you properly. In fact, I'd recommend everyone talk to a few different docs until they find a like-minded doc. But when you are doing it so you can get extra meds, you are voilating the law.

I think the best thing to do is get one steady doc and use state aid w/that one, pay cash to all the others. If you get caught, like candy said, the consequences can be dire. She might be risking her kid's healthcare to get high, im sure if she knew she was risking that she'd stop.

[kyuss]

It's only
illegal
if you
get caught.

[flipside]

Hi Papa ver, yes dcotor shopping for prescription opites is illegal. if you PM me the state you are referring to I will give you the links to the law specific to your area. both from the LEO and the state funded insurance agencies.

[red26]

I was just talking to my lawyer about his yesterday. Yes it is illegal to doctor shop. Its a really bad thing to get nabbed for these days too with all the publicity and whatnot. He was telling me about someone that got caught with eleven doctors in 4 different counties. Not only is she spending time in the clink for this but she will be forced to take U.A.'s and go for councelling as well as the possability of having to go to N.A. meetings, community service, fines, and some extra time in jail.

Granted if you friend does get caught they're not about to takeher kids away, but maybe because she is showing a pattern of addiction and could be endangering the children. This is how the judge will look at these things, and it doesnt get any better. Show her how to order Pods, use NROP's, and only have 1 or 2 doctors, whoever gives the best treatment. Its only a matter of time till she gets picked up by the computers at the pharmacy and is red flagged. It happened to me a few years back and I had to lay REAL low till the worst of it was over. The shit storm that is.

[Chemical_Boy]

If she is not telling the doctors about each other, yes it is illegal. If she is getting treament for the same "condition" from more than one doctor, yes it is illegal. If she is getting narcotics from more than one doctor with out informing them about each other, yes it is illegal.
Doing this with state aid is going to wind up getting her busted. The only way that you could do this for the long term is if you go to different doctors in different areas- be sure that they do not have EMRs (electronic medical records) and share a system. A lot of times in one area (town or small city) the doctors offices may be affiliated with one another (owned by the same corporation) or affiliated with a hospital. If this is the case, they often use a common system and can see the patients records from other, affiliate offices in the area. It is legal if they are affiliated with one another. Compare it to a large clinic under one roof. If you go to one doctor there once and see a different doctor there again in the future, the new doctor will have your old chart because they all work for the same clinic. It's a little more complicated than that, but it does happen. I know that two ways- it has happened to me, and I know a person who runs the EMR program for a hospital and 99% of the doctors' offices in the area use that EMR system and all have access to each others records.
Also, to do this long term you would need to use cash.

The state is slow, but this will eventually catch up to her and there is a pretty good number of charges that they could bring against her when they do. It will most likely mean prison time.

The records are already made, so the only hope that she really has would be to stop now (or do it differenly- i.e. different areas, fake names, etc) and hope that she makes it to the statute of limitations before they catch up with her.

[SpecialGuy69]

It's just not worth the risk for Tramadol, Vicodin, Percocet, Fioricet etc. It would have to be something bangin' to make it worth the risk- dilaudid, instant release morphine, OC, fent, etc. I have a friend who was getting subutex from one doctor and oxycontin from another. Paying cash for the subutex visits and prescriptions, insurance for the oc's. He made the mistake of going to CVS for both drugs. It was different locations, but the computers are linked, of coure.When he went in for his OC refill, he got denied. The doc was actually cool enough to give him a taper dose, down 20% every week for a month. But the point of the story is that there are just so many different ways to get nailed for this, it's really hard to cover every single angle.

Eventually your friend will get found out. Sooner rather than later if she's using state aid for all of it.

[Badly Drawn Girl]

Yes it's illegal and using state aid is what will get her caught. It will eventually be noticed and she will be in trouble. She can still doctor hop but she needs to pay cash in order to avoid a paper trail. That's my opinion.

[Papa Verine]

Shit! Thank you everybody for filling me in. Now I am worried about her. I'm going to talk to her right away. I've done this myself in the past but not to the extent that she does it and I wasn't on public aid.

Thanks All!

[OxyContinuously]

Hey Everyone, I really am asking a question here for a good friend of mine. (no SWIM)

My friend is a female prostitute. She does her thing to make money and uses the money to take care of her two children. She has a 2 year old girl and a 6 year old boy. I baby-sit for her A lot and her kids play with my 4 year old daughter. She doesn't do what she does to support a crack habit or anything like that. She does enjoy opiates but won't do heroin or anything hard-core. She uses the money she earns to provide for her kids and she's probably the best "Friend" I've ever known. We all have friends but there are different degrees of friendship. Some (your closest) will do anything to help you. Others will help you if they can. Others are merely acquaintances and you can't count on them when the going gets tough. We all know how it is!

Well, this girl is a GREAT friend. I post this thread because I'm truly worried about her and I truly don't know the answer to the question I'm about to ask. Any replies are GREATLY appreciated.

My friend has found that she can get regular prescriptions of Tramadol, Vicodin, Percocet, Fioricet etc...etc... by visiting different doctors in the area and complaining of pains. She really, truly has shoulder pain but in all reality she just enjoys opiates. Doctor visits and scripts are covered by public aid because she's a single parent and qualifies for medical care. She sees several different doctors and they don't all nessicarily know she's seeing different docs. for pain meds.

My question is... "Is this illegal"? Is this considered "Doctor hopping"? Is she at risk of being prosecuted for this???

If anybody understands the legalities of this better than I do please let me know!!!!!!!!!!


You know what, Papa Ver? The scrips themselves are not illegal. but what is the problem is this. First of all by using a lot of different docs, she is leaving a record of her exploits regarding pain meds. Also, if someone like a officer of some bullshit law enforcement agency caught wind of the paper trail, she could indeed get in trouble and be prosecuted for pharmaceutical fraud. it's becoming more and more prevalent. On top of that, her doctor (s) could also get into serious trouble, especially if the meds are Schedule II, for example. I am glad she's having luck at this, but tel her to be prudent.

[Narkotikon]

Short answer, just like everyone else has said, Yes, it's illegal. Now, I'd say if you were only seeing two or three docs in the same time period, it wouldn't be as bad. But if you're doing it hardcore, like seeing five docs a day for 4 days, then yes, your friend will probably get caught sooner or later.

I know in KY, that a doctor can check your prescription history via a state government website. It lists all narcotic and scheduled scripts you've been given. So, say you've been given hydro by several doctors in the same time period, they can check to see that and where you filled the scripts and who wrote for you and stuff, then they can report you. It's a fairly new thing though. I think it started 2-3 years ago. I remember hearing it on the news when it started then.

It could be kinda cool though. You might get a t-shirt made like Winonna Ryder did. Just joking :-)

[greenfox]

Hey Everyone, I really am asking a question here for a good friend of mine. (no SWIM)




1.) Good, cuz' I recently KILLED SWIM. That's right! Drove h/er off a pier...so cops, I just"copped" to MURDER!! COME GET ME!!!

2.) To answer your question um... lessee... I dunno....I don't think u can get in THAT much trouble... I mean, RUSH did it, got away with it.... so.. poo....

[HistoryofMadness]

yes, it is fraud, because if you were totally honest with all of them, none of them would give you any 'good' drugs... and I'm sure fraud associated with scheduled narcotics carries a pretty heavy burden of clink

[Papa Verine]

I hate to beat a dead horse here everyone but things are getting worse and nothing's happening.

My friend has been to every Urgent Care facility within 50 miles of here and has filled scripts (with public aid) numbering in the hundreds by now.

I tried to tell her a couple months ago when I brought this up in the first place but she has completely disregarded my warnings and continues to doctor hop for opiates.

Does anyone here have real experience with this? I'm just waiting for the shit to hit the fan and so far nothing's happened. She's making this look too easy. I'm going to start doing it myself if they don't break her door down soon. j/k, but how long can you get away with it???

[HeidiW]

IF she goes to Urgent Care and Emergency Rooms, as long as she hasn't signed a pain mgmt. contract, she should be ok.

Don't quote me tho, I'm no atty, just a jailhouse lawyer:D