How many of you are gona vote today?

[flipside]

Interested to see how many of us are planning on voting. Not asking who, but if. Remember there is a lot of pending legislation that could effect all of us in terms of pain management and prescribing laws, funding for drug Tx and the like, not to mention public health vs law enforcement .

[aj11]

Wish I could, FELON
that sucks cause there is alot to vote for in Missouri today
so if you are able to vote you definatly should

[repeek]

I will be there, and vote.

[Duckfeet]

Wish I could, FELON
that sucks cause there is alot to vote for in Missouri today
so if you are able to vote you definatly should

Me too, (being a felon, that is) and one of those felonies was here in my home state: California. But here in Cali, unlike state I just left, felons *can* vote as long as they aren't locked up, or still on parole, and so, even though I've got pretty radical political views, I got down there and did my bit, now on the computer, which just confirms my grim view of the direction we're going in.

But in most ways, your state is more free than mine....letting us vote is--to me--just throwing coins at us from the rich man's limo....I liked *old* California a lot better: I miss the bear on the flag, and the: "Don't Tread on Me" logo.

Duckfeet
All civilized, law-abiding,
and exercizing me old constitutional right!

[Levity]

I never vote.

I, however, firmly believe in the violent overthrow of the US government.

[southernbelle]

I'll be going as soon as I get off work. I'm sure all of you have seen the "ads" on youtube about Harold Ford, Jr., and Mr. Corker....TN is my state. I'll have to try the old "lesser of 2 evils" thing with those two..

[Narkotikon]

^^^^^ Yeah, I only usually only vote for presidential elections. Besides, my car still isn't fixed and I have no way to get to the polls. Also, I don't believe in voting for bastards who spend all of their money, time, and energy doing commercials attacking the flaws of their opponents rather than focusing on the changes they could do. It's all a bunch of bullshit to me. I wish, just for once, no one in America would vote, that way no one would be re/elected. It would be a great message to send.

[southernbelle]

Hah! If you were here, Harold Jr would give you a lift to the polls........in exchange for your vote...

[Narkotikon]

Hah! If you were here, Harold Jr would give you a lift to the polls........in exchange for your vote...


You gotta love Tamenny Hall style politics. :)

[jacky]

I am voting in a few....not that it counts for much, but I get guilty feeling when I dont vote. I bitch too much not too vote!!

but when I was junked up on heroin, I didnt vote for at least 5-6 years.

lucky I am not a felon, many misdeamoners, but I was pretty careful, and when I wasnt, I got lucky. sometimes telling the cops what you have on you works out better than you would imagine.

I live in a state without methadone treatment for junkies, I was given a two week outpatient treatment by one small low income clinic consisting of klonipin and other downers/muscle relaxants/anti siezure medication. they said to come back in a year if I relapsed and they would treat me again. well I did, and a year later I went back for detox, and in the time since they got in trouble for treating me. seems my freinds did the program, and stole all their drugs and quit the program early...well the state pharm board heard about it, reviewed my records, and barred me or anyone else in the state from getting outpatient opiate detox treatment!! thing is, the rich people in sun valley idaho can get methadone for detox through their personal drs, and the state pharm board wont fuck with them. what I need to do, is get active on that front, getting people to consider methadone finally in this back ass state.

[HistoryofMadness]

I vote and even though it may do fuck-all I am with jacky i feel better after voting because I can bitch...

If everyone who doesn't vote because they think it doesn't matter, voted, and they all picked one guy, he would fucking win in a heartbeat... learned helplessness is what I call it...

And finally, this wouldn't be a bad place to promote officially the re-enfranchisement of felons...



p.s. even though technically I'm part of the system (we are all in a social contract like it or not) I too advocate violent overthrow... when a government breaches its end of the contract, and breaks the law, the only real adjudication the public can establish (given the law is part of the problem) is a coup...

if our parents/grandparents/greatgrandparents were to pop up out of the grave today, compare to 100 years ago, or hell even 50, they would riot and revolt in a second.

we have given too much... we can take it back... its like non-voters... maybe a slogan for such a group could be "you vote, i'll revolt" and maybe that group would plan something like that on an election day? while the non-voters voted in a revolution candidate?

those guys would be nuts.

[SpecialGuy69]

Well, gay marriage is on the ballot in my state (Virginia) and it's really brought out some ignorant attitudes in people. I'm straight, but personally, I don't give a shit if gay dudes/chicks marry each other or not, and I will vote for gay marriage. But you should hear some of the arguments these DUMMIES are making against gay marriage-

I actually heard this one twice in the same day:
"well first it's two gay guys getting married, then next they'll be marrying horses and dogs, before you know it, they'll be letting people marry their diswashers!"
I mean what the fuck, people! Who actually thinks this dumb shit? BTW no offense if you think this dumb shit.

[Chemical_Boy]

In Colorado there is an initiative on the ballot to legalize possesion of under 28 grams of weed if over 21 years of age. Already passed in the city of Denver, but they are trying for it state wide. Then it will only be the feds to watch out for.

[geanine.aurora]

Yeah, I voted today. Always do. Even when on probation for felony charges! In this state there was one issue regarding no probation for methamphetamine use charges. I'm not into that, but it does seem more than harsh to lock up first/ secord offenders. -I really don't think they should be locking up any drug offense charges unless they are breaking some other law.

[Narkotikon]

Well, gay marriage is on the ballot in my state (Virginia) and it's really brought out some ignorant attitudes in people. I'm straight, but personally, I don't give a shit if gay dudes/chicks marry each other or not, and I will vote for gay marriage. But you should hear some of the arguments these DUMMIES are making against gay marriage-

I actually heard this one twice in the same day:
"well first it's two gay guys getting married, then next they'll be marrying horses and dogs, before you know it, they'll be letting people marry their diswashers!"
I mean what the fuck, people! Who actually thinks this dumb shit? BTW no offense if you think this dumb shit.

You know, as a gay male, I find people's ignorance offensive. I'm not a stereotypical gay male. I don't flame, I don't scream it from the rooftops, I don't march in gay pride parades (well, I did go in 2003 in Cincinnati, but I didn't march. Basically I was just drunk and high at 11:00 in the morning at a bar--good times), and I have no plans to molest children, or have sex with animals, or fuck a crucifix. Honestly, people's ignorance just astounds me. I say ignorance because I really do believe that the majority of the people in this country are asleep in a warm fantasy world. Most people don't think: they just beLIEve whatever their stupid elected hypocritical politicians tell them to belive. And, the worst part of it is, that they could learn and could change, but it's easier to remain intellectually numb and ignorant. Honestly, I don't even see why gay marriage or the other "moral" issues are on the ballots. Moral issues are best left to those with doctor's of divinity, not an uneducated public. I mean, whatever happened to having a seperation between church and state? I just baffles me. Who cares if gay men and women want to marry? It's not like the straight world is so great at advocating marriage. I mean, isn't the divorce rate above 50% now? WTF!!!! It just baffles me that hypocritical politicians and ignorant people think they have the right to tell me what I can and can't do regarding whom I choose to spend the rest of my life with. Also, I don't mean to offend those gay members of opiophile who do choose to flame. I have nothing against it. It's just not me, and I figure the world is hard enough, why give people any more firepower against me. I mean, the thing I have against flamers is that they seem to make it their entire identity. Being gay is a part of who I am, it isn't entirely who I am. I hope everyone understands what I'm trying to say.

[greenfox]

hey nar: ur online... how does someone pm/private chat? I can't seem to figure it.

[greenfox]

Being gay is a part of who I am, it isn't entirely who I am. I hope everyone understands what I'm trying to say.

actually, I do understand. I'm not gay... maybe bi would be a good word. I'll put it this way: I got so high on H, I sucked off my ex-best friend (and he was/is straight!) ;)

that was the only gay experience I had. Didn't mind it much, (found out that I have a faily big schlong tho cuz I'm not in the habbit of looking but... either that, or he's small)

either way I'm very open minded. I don't care what people think.. and when I get high, I'll take a slap in the face, smile, and piss on your mom's good china. ;) (I love that quote!)

[Narkotikon]

hey nar: ur online... how does someone pm/private chat? I can't seem to figure it.

Unless you're a donating member, I don't think you are allowed to use the PM system until after 30 days of membership or something like that. How new are you? I mean, how many days have you been a member? As to the chat, you just enter the chat room, but I've never used it and it seems like not many other people do either.

[greenfox]

Unless you're a donating member, I don't think you are allowed to use the PM system until after 30 days of membership or something like that. How new are you? I mean, how many days have you been a member? As to the chat, you just enter the chat room, but I've never used it and it seems like not many other people do either.

pretty new. Joined this week. I'll donate to THIS place! :) I just wanted to chat privately, but it's ok.. life is good.

NOSPAMNOSPAMdeadheadlooser@hotmail.comNOSPAMNOSPAM

email me if u get bored. :P :)

[greenfox]

Welp, I gave $10.00 to *the cause*. Hmm... hopefully it does some good. :)

[kyuss]

After bush
stole the first election
and the people re-elected him
the second time;
I decided fuck it.
No more voting for awhile.
I'll still bitch tho-
it's my constitutional right.

[SpecialGuy69]

Narko- well put. I agree with you 99%. It's such bullshit that these asshole congressmen are regulating morality. And the same motherfuckers who stand on their soapbox and deride gay marriage are the ones instant messaging 17 year old boys for sex (Mark Foley) or smoking meth and fucking gay prostitutes (Ted Haggerd).

This shit really pisses me off. They are such fuckin hippocrites! I can't believe that these are the best people we have to represent ourselves in this country. Why?

Legalize drugs.
Stop legislating morality. (equal rights for homosexuals, etc.)
Respect people's privacy (no more wiretaps, etc.)
Lower my taxes.
Cut non-violent criminals some slack.
Do something about health care.
Fix social security (why should I have to pay in if I'm not going to get it back?)
It's not that hard to make this country better. This shit is fucking blowing my mind. Mark Foley is a piece of shit. Ted Haggerd is a fuckin liar. Yeah right he threw the meth away and only got a massage. And that dope I bought yesterday, it was to show kids what to avoid. Since then I've flushed it down the toilet because it's illegal. What the fuck is wrong with this county? I love America, and wouldn't want to live anywhere else in the world, and that's why I voted today, but I am fed up.

[earthenone]

Fixin to head to the polls myself, no hope of turning this state Blue, although our gov is. Yep the right to bitch for 2 more years.

[Narkotikon]

Narko- well put. I agree with you 99%. It's such bullshit that these asshole congressmen are regulating morality. And the same motherfuckers who stand on their soapbox and deride gay marriage are the ones instant messaging 17 year old boys for sex (Mark Foley) or smoking meth and fucking gay prostitutes (Ted Haggerd).

This shit really pisses me off. They are such fuckin hippocrites! I can't believe that these are the best people we have to represent ourselves in this country. Why?

Legalize drugs.
Stop legislating morality. (equal rights for homosexuals, etc.)
Respect people's privacy (no more wiretaps, etc.)
Lower my taxes.
Cut non-violent criminals some slack.
Do something about health care.
Fix social security (why should I have to pay in if I'm not going to get it back?)
It's not that hard to make this country better. This shit is fucking blowing my mind. Mark Foley is a piece of shit. Ted Haggerd is a fuckin liar. Yeah right he threw the meth away and only got a massage. And that dope I bought yesterday, it was to show kids what to avoid. Since then I've flushed it down the toilet because it's illegal. What the fuck is wrong with this county? I love America, and wouldn't want to live anywhere else in the world, and that's why I voted today, but I am fed up.

Oh, I agree with you too. The Ted Haggerd thing is quite simple. I threw the meth away and only got a massage. Translation: I bought the meth because the prostitute would only do it with me if I got them high, because I'm a fat ugly bastard; and the massage was really oral, but he didn't get off because the meth gave him a limp dick.

Also, don't forget to add a living wage to that list. I think it's horrendous how government can justify raising taxes and making people pay out the ass, yet they hesitate to raise the minimum wage.

[Narkotikon]

Welp, I gave $10.00 to *the cause*. Hmm... hopefully it does some good. :)

If you don't see it added to your profile in the next day or so, just e-mail Bi11i and he'll set it up for you. Also, I forgot this, but even new people can click on someone's profile, and although they can't PM them, they can click "send ____ an e-mail, and your message will be forwarded to whatever e-mail address they have on file with opiophile.

[SpecialGuy69]

Narko- you're right. I'll go edit in a minute. How cool are the people on this site- you say are gay, and nobody even bats an eye (as it should be). I have to admit I was suprised, but then again, I thought jacky was a chicklike a month (no offense, Jacky). I'm oblivious. Anyways, imagine if you said that on bl or alt.drugs or pretty much any other boards- the ignorant rednecks would flame the hell out of you! We have a very open-minded, intelligent, intellectual crowd here. I'm proud to be a member.

[Narkotikon]

Narko- you're right. I'll go edit in a minute. How cool are the people on this site- you say are gay, and nobody even bats an eye (as it should be). I have to admit I was suprised, but then again, I thought jacky was a chicklike a month (no offense, Jacky). I'm oblivious. Anyways, imagine if you said that on bl or alt.drugs or pretty much any other boards- the ignorant rednecks would flame the hell out of you! We have a very open-minded, intelligent, intellectual crowd here. I'm proud to be a member.

LOL. You know, I did the same thing recently. I've been talking to Bi11i about something, and I asked him in general conversation if Jacky was his wife / girlfriend / or just a business partner. I had no idea that Jacky was a guy. I felt so embarrased, that I apologized several times. I just assumed that it would be a female because of the name. No offence to Jacky at all. Sorry for my confusion.

[SpecialGuy69]

I was thinking about creating a new, more anonymous myspace profile (like without my work information and cell phone number) to link to my opiophile login. That way, you guys could click through and see my age, pictures, more information about me.

I always wonder what you guys look like. Especially the ladies.

What do you guys think? Good idea or not?

[remybur12]

I am a little to high to vote right now. Even if i did vote nothing would happen because the government won't legalize anything

[flipside]

Well I just got back from voting. I always vote. it's my opinion that you can't bitch ( well u can bitch but I dont wanna here it, if your gonna be apathetic, be apathetic) if you don't vote, and certainly cannot expect anything to change. Unless of course an overthrow were possible..

We have a chance of turning our state red, and there were some propositions that were important to me. We also had the marraige ban on our poll, as the mother of a gay daughter not only did i vote, but worked to enroll voters.

we also had the death penalty on the table for convicted 1st degree murder with DNA evidence as well as a smoking ban.

Not to mention that my daughter just tuned 18 in Oct. and this was her first election. First I've got to lead by example.

[remybur12]

I guess your right. I am just not a fan of politics.

[remybur12]

hey I hope you did'nt vote for the smoking ban LOL

[flipside]

I guess your right. I am just not a fan of politics.
Me either, but it does help give me a sense that I did what I could to work within the only system we have at the moment.

[flipside]

hey I hope you did'nt vote for the smoking ban LOL


No I voted to repeal it in the bars and restaraunts. And yes for the death penalty.

[greenfox]

No I voted to repeal it in the bars and restaraunts. And yes for the death penalty.

YES for the death penalty? You need to read a book called "Death WorK" (can't remember the author) not trying to flame, but you should have the facts./ I guess I *might* be for it if I knew that it was being administered fairly.. .but it's been PROVEN that at LEAST 2.5-3% of ALL people on death row are innocent of at least HALF of the charges filed.

true stuff... the stats are in that book (and the book really isn't biased...it's written by a lib (non-dem non repub)

and by the way I love the dumpublican standpoint of "Don't abort save a life so we can give the kid the death penalty when we charge him as an adult at age 13"

heh

whutevah.

[remybur12]

I am with flipside on the death penalty some people deserve to die like people who hurt children and women. I think there should be better trials.

[Narkotikon]

YES for the death penalty? You need to read a book called "Death WorK" (can't remember the author) not trying to flame, but you should have the facts./ I guess I *might* be for it if I knew that it was being administered fairly.. .but it's been PROVEN that at LEAST 2.5-3% of ALL people on death row are innocent of at least HALF of the charges filed.

true stuff... the stats are in that book (and the book really isn't biased...it's written by a lib (non-dem non repub)

and by the way I love the dumpublican standpoint of "Don't abort save a life so we can give the kid the death penalty when we charge him as an adult at age 13"

heh

whutevah.


I think pro-life fans should use Madonna's Pappa Don't Preach as a campaign song. That just popped into my head because it's playing right now.

And as far as the death penalty is concerned, whatever happened to a good hanging? Or, how about putting people back in the stocks? God, what has society come to with all of this lethal injection / gas chamber bullshit. j/k

[exitwound]

Voted about an hour ago.....now I'm waiting for my (MJ) dealer to get out of classes so I can drive a damn hour round trip to get a sack. Unfortunately, I can't possibly get adequate pain/nausea relief without the stuff! And growing my own, while successful in the past, has been really difficult this year as my condition has gotten worse.
Too bad that Maine doesn't have a legit MMJ program (our MMJ law is toothless and useless, no doc will write a recommendation because they aren't protected by the law); I could get a "Caregiver" to grow for me, or with some basic help on my part. Damn that would be nice.....all the advantages of growing my own without the frustration of killing plants every time I get a bad flare-up and can't make it down the cellar stairs or lift water bottles! :-(*

[slugbone]

I think pro-life fans should use Madonna's Pappa Don't Preach as a campaign song. That just popped into my head because it's playing right now.

And as far as the death penalty is concerned, whatever happened to a good hanging? Or, how about putting people back in the stocks? God, what has society come to with all of this lethal injection / gas chamber bullshit. j/k


i always liked the ol' dunk em in water till they almost drown and repeatedly until they confess routine.

i have never voted, but if i did i would vote libertarian. the ones that run are always crazy fucks with a platform like "Fuck Iraq, legalize everythning and repeal the income tax"

[Narkotikon]

i always liked the ol' dunk em in water till they almost drown and repeatedly until they confess routine.

i have never voted, but if i did i would vote libertarian. the ones that run are always crazy fucks with a platform like "Fuck Iraq, legalize everythning and repeal the income tax"


Yeah, that's a good one. you know, during the witch scare in Europe, they used to throw suspected witches into a river / pool of water or something like that, and if they sank, they were presummed innocent, and if they floated, they were guilty. The thought was that only magic could make them float. So, as you can imagine, since the body floats in water, that was a good way of declaring people guilty. I still think they should go back to hangings. It was a nice way of gathering the community together for positive moral values. Taught the kiddies a good lesson, you know?

I've heard that in India, income taxes are kind of a joke. I mean, they have them, but absolutely almost no one pays them. Why can't we get away with that here?

[SpecialGuy69]

Someone posted a while ago about witnessing public hangings in Indonesia or somewhere in that part of the world. I'll try to find the post, but what the fuck! Can you imagine being sentenced to die? And the day of, knowing you're not going to live to see the next hour? The sheer terror? Fuck that. It's horrible, but then again, most of the people sentenced to die did horrible things themselves.

I've heard that in China, if you're sentenced to die, they just walk up behind you one day and shoot you in the head, no warning, totally random. That's probably an urban legend, but it sounds like something the Chinese govt. would do. I don't know if that's better or worse.

[greenfox]

Someone posted a while ago about witnessing public hangings in Indonesia or somewhere in that part of the world. I'll try to find the post, but what the fuck! Can you imagine being sentenced to die? And the day of, knowing you're not going to live to see the next hour? The sheer terror? Fuck that. It's horrible, but then again, most of the people sentenced to die did horrible things themselves.

I've heard that in China, if you're sentenced to die, they just walk up behind you one day and shoot you in the head, no warning, totally random. That's probably an urban legend, but it sounds like something the Chinese govt. would do. I don't know if that's better or worse.

I heard that, too. I also heard they bill the family for the cost of the bullet.

::shrugs:: that's almost as stupid as spiking your arm...

"Shit, we'd shoot Vitiman C if only they made it illegal" -Renton, commenting on Mthr. Superior

[Paregoric Kid]

I voted today, too bad there wasn't anyone really worth voting for on the ballot. just votes against other people.
at least the government will be divided now, with congress split nothing will get done and having the government do nothing at all is a thousand times better than a congress that "gets things done."
I agree with the "crazy" people who say fuck Iraq, legalize everything, and repeal all taxes!

[Duckfeet]

i always liked the ol' dunk em in water till they almost drown and repeatedly until they confess routine.
i have never voted, but if i did i would vote libertarian. the ones that run are always crazy fucks with a platform like "Fuck Iraq, legalize everythning and repeal the income tax"

That's me, libertarian right down the line. Everybody says its a wasted vote, but it's my vote, I can waste it if I want to...and hey, the fuckers might win one of these days. I think the day is coming, when people finally realize both major parties are owned, either by big business or by big union...and libertarians will get rid of everything, legalize drugs and guns, and let the rest of the world stew it's own juices...we don't care: Legalize everything, open the borders, and load yer fucking shotgun.

"Don't Tread on Me!"

[Opiyum]

I never vote.

I, however, firmly believe in the violent overthrow of the US government.

Me too on both accounts. Ontop of that I enjoy bitching at those who don't vote. "Don't you know how irresponsible it is. It's your duty!"
It seems, to me, that this makes up for me not voting.
"Twisted, the logic may be, but twisted is the soul that bears it."
-Opi

[madnesscult]

I was going to vote, but I couldn't. I was supposed to get an absentee ballot, but for some reason it didn't come (nor did my mother's), and since I'm not currently living in the city I'm registered in, I wasn't able to do a provisional ballot. Which sucks, because there's actually several things on the ballot this time that I genuinely care about.

There's several things that I wanted to reply to, but I don't feel like going through the trouble of quoting multiple people right now...

First, on the subject of taxes: some people have mentioned lowering taxes/abolishing the income tax. I believe that we should get rid of all the tax cuts that have been given to the wealthy and big business, and lower taxes for people of lower income (seems reasonable, although you can't convince many politicians on that). That would probably give the government more money from taxes than what they're getting right now. And I don't think we should get rid of income taxes all together.

As for the "moral" issues: like others, I believe that the government has no business dictating who can and cannot marry. Marriage is about love and commitment, and whether it is between individuals of the opposite or of the same sex, it doesn't matter. Allowing homosexuals to marry will not "tarnish the great institution of marriage," and really, it's a rididculous issue. Fringe issues like gay marriage are just a tool to distract people from more important things. If people are up in arms about whether or not gays can marry, they're not paying as much attention to things like the war, corruption, the social security collapse, our failed healthcare system, etc.
Also, gay marriage is also about rights. Couples in a civil union are not afforded the same rights as a married couple - for instance, while a straight man's wife is eligible to be covered under his employer's health insurance, a gay man's spouse is not.

This year there are 13 propositions on the California ballot! Most of them I'm not terribly concerned with, but there are a few that I feel are quite important. The measure that I feel is of greatest concern is the parental notification law...

This same exact proposition was on last year's special election ballot and was struck down, and it's back again this year. It so stupid...it doesn't matter how many times it's defeated, the proponents are just going to keep getting it on the ballot until it eventually passes, which I do hope never happens.
Here's what this proposition is about: This law would require doctors to notify the parents of an underage girl seeking an abortion 48 hours before the procedure. There is one exception, and that is the judicial bypass - where if a girl feels that it would be detrimental to tell her parents about an abortion (ie threat of abuse, cases of incest, etc), she can go before a judge and request that she may be exempted.
Parental notification and consent laws are terrible, and all arguments made by their supporters are unfounded...

Proponents' claims:

1. Notification and consent laws lower rates of abortion in underage girls.
This is not true. While the abortion rates in states with such laws do in fact decrease, the rates in the surrounding states without such restrictions increase porportionally.

2. These laws are about "protecting our daughters" and not about the overall abortion debate.
If so, these laws would be endorsed and supported by parents' leagues, not anti-abortion groups.

3. The judicial bypass is a sufficient means of exemption.
There are many reasons why the judicial bypass system does not work. First of all, judges were never meant to decide upon moral issues, and may be biased - pro-life judges may not grant any waivers, even in the most dire of circumstances. Secondly, an underage girl would find it incredibly difficult to even go through the process of requesting a waiver. What teenager has the money and knowledge to hire a lawyer if needed and deal with the court system? Pregnant girls may also be intimidated or afraid of dealing with the courts - they may be afraid that by requesting a waiver, the information could get to their parents anyway, or they may be illegal immigrants and fear deportation if they willingly entered into the judicial system. Finally, the California courts are already incredibly overloaded as it is. It is possible that by the time a girl's case is heard and a waiver is granted, it may be too late for the procedure to be performed (and by that time her parents will most likely already know of the pregnancy anyway).

Notification and consent laws are harmful and unnecessary. These laws cause girls to obtain out-of-state, illegal, or self-induced abortions, and are especially dangerous in border states like California, because girls there may seek illegal abortions in Mexico.
The majority of girls seeking abortions already inform their parents or other relatives of their intentions without being required by law to do so. The government cannot force families to have good communication or be save and loving environments. Young women who do not wish to inform their parents of their pregnancy and intent to have an abortion have real concerns: fear of abuse, being kicked out of their houses, and other negative consequences. Such laws would only cause undue stress and possible harm to pregnant teens.
Doctors are also targeted, as they can be fined and sued (by parents) if they do not inform the parents or guardian of a pregnant minor as the law states.

Oh, and there's an absolutely ridiculous abortion consent law in Texas, although I believe it is not officially in effect right now (because it's being challenged)...it requires that a married woman must obtain the consent of her husband before she has an abortion. Married women even more than underage girls must have good reasons for not wanting to tell ther husband (or parents, respectively).


The abortion debate in general is something that I feel very strongly about. I think a lot of people either don't realize or forget what the underlying issue of this debate is - whose life is more important. Whether "life" begins at conception or not is a moot point. What is really being debated is whether the life of an unborn fetus is more important than that of a living, conscious woman. Women do not get abortions because of cruelty or murderous intent; they get abortions because it would be detrimental to their lives, and the life of their child, should they go through with the pregnancy.

Someone mentioned many inmates on death row being at least partially innocent...although I'm not quoting directly, I've heard somewhere that "it's better to let 100 guilty men go free than to convict one innocent man".

Sorry to rant.

[vaxn8]

imagine if you said that on bl or alt.drugs or pretty much any other boards- the ignorant rednecks would flame the hell out of you!

Actually, on BL it is extremely fashionable to be male and bi. I have never seen so many bi-males in my life. Very strange- they're big into drama and "life problems" though, so that's a post that is always good for a little drama and excitement.... "i'm in love with my best friend and he doesn't know it, how can I tell him I'm gay and want to be with him"- seriously lots of that. I have no problem with who they sleep with, I just don't care- I just dont like that much drama- there is enough in life without adding to it.

Well I just got back from voting. I always vote. it's my opinion that you can't bitch ( well u can bitch but I dont wanna here it, if your gonna be apathetic, be apathetic) if you don't vote, and certainly cannot expect anything to change. Unless of course an overthrow were possible..

we also had the death penalty on the table for convicted 1st degree murder with DNA evidence as well quote]

Are you serious, was that today? I totally missed it, oh well. I don't usually bitch anyway, it's rare that i know who is even in which office and which party is in control! Hope the death penalty wins, I wish your state to the west would get it going there as well, especialy if they could go retroactive with it!

[quote=greenfox;51933]YES for the death penalty? You need to read a book called "Death WorK" (can't remember the author) not trying to flame, but you should have the facts./ I guess I *might* be for it if I knew that it was being administered fairly.. .but it's been PROVEN that at LEAST 2.5-3% of ALL people on death row are innocent of at least HALF of the charges filed.

true stuff... the stats are in that book (and the book really isn't biased...it's written by a lib (non-dem non repub)

Stats are a bunch of bs, you can manipulate them to support whatever argument you're trying to prove. Ever been the victim of a violent crime? Would make you rethink this. While I do feel bad for the extremely rare cases of innocence, they can be proven innocent in the time they're waiting for their execution. And, yes I've heard every argument and statistic against it my little sister is a public defender and works in that area. I'd rather kill one innocent man than let 99 guilty live.

[alowishus]

John Birch society baby, every year, ch-ching. I've voted for C. Manson, myself a couple times. I just don't give a shit.

Any of you think you're really making a difference, I've got some land in FL I'll sell you, no really I have.:D

We will never be able to change what needs to be changed, although the founders of our country said WE THE PEOPLE should. We have given over, had them taken, all our rights to change what we see needs changing, instead the sheep que up and hope things will improve. Until we can take it back, which will never happen because of all the money involved (just try taking a rich mans money from him) we will be living in fear for what we do behind closed doors in our own homes, hurting no one at all.


I'm moving to france.
http://img473.imageshack.us/img473/8988/hitlolqj7.gif

[remybur12]

In virginia they legalized gay marriage. And i also heard about the public hangings.

[remybur12]

My fault they bannd same sex union

[flipside]

GF you have every right to your opinion. As the sister of a murder victim and as previously stated I have worked in vicitm advocacy with survivors of violent crime. And if you had read the post carefully you would have seen that the death penalty was only for those convicted of first degree murder with DNA evidence thus eliminating the chance of putting an innocent to death.

And yes i know it happens and it's horrible and tragic. If it had been worded differently I may have voted differently but doubt it. So where the death penalty is not legal I believe violent repeat offenders should get consecutive life sentances so they will never see the light of day agin, or re-offend. Believe me I have the facts both from personal and professional experience. My position as an advocate was in the SA's office.

As for the comment about knowing you are going to die and how awful that must be, yes I do imagine it, evrytime I awake from another nightmare where I see my little brother fighting for his life to the point where every bone in his body was broken from defensive posturing, shot 8 times and then burried alive, an hour later they went back to move the grave and found him crawling out of it, a head shot finished him, Imagine that horror. Sorry but my sympathy lies with the victims and thier fmilies. ( of all violent crimes) The majority of those on death row belong there, hell at least their families can visit them for 10 years while we appeal on their behalf even when they don't want it. Their families get time to prepare and say goodbye, somehthng me and my parents never had.

As for charging juvies as adults at the age of 13, I agree it's wrong. Our CJ ( and the don't call it CRMINAL justice for nothing) system is in bad need of reform. I do not advocate adult prison for juviniles. By all means flame away if you feel the need. Freedom of speech and all that. Heh indeed.


YES for the death penalty? You need to read a book called "Death WorK" (can't remember the author) not trying to flame, but you should have the facts./ I guess I *might* be for it if I knew that it was being administered fairly.. .but it's been PROVEN that at LEAST 2.5-3% of ALL people on death row are innocent of at least HALF of the charges filed.

true stuff... the stats are in that book (and the book really isn't biased...it's written by a lib (non-dem non repub)

and by the way I love the dumpublican standpoint of "Don't abort save a life so we can give the kid the death penalty when we charge him as an adult at age 13"

heh

whutevah.

[aj11]

South Park had the best comment on the voting issue. You have to choose between a giant douche or a turd sandwitch. that is basically what it boiles down to. Not to step on toes, but the dumb fucks in MO voted down stem cell research!!! guess they never be able to grow me a new liver for my hep c:D
so if I could have voted it would have been for-------------- turd sandwich

[SpecialGuy69]

I'm really glad to see some of you guys are really passionate about political issues. Me, too. Madnesscult, Vaxn8, Flipside, and Greenfox- your posts are all very well thought-out and thorough. I'd spread some rep points if I could, but I have to wait 24 hrs.

I think if everyone who has libretarian beliefs actually voted for a libretarian, we'd win. It's just that the repubs/dems make it seem like the libs are soo fringe that nobody will vote for them, and if you want your vote to count, you must vote for one or the other major party. Well fuck 'em- let's all vote libretarian and get 'em elected.


I apologise on behalf of Virginia for being an ignorant asshole state and for banning gay marriage. Virginia is a dick. Virginia is sorry, and won't do it again, we promise.

[flipside]

I thought the ban failed in Va. and gay unions were legal,. mabey it was W. VA. Anyway the ban went through in WI also:mad:

[greenfox]

I'm really glad to see some of you guys are really passionate about political issues. Me, too. Madnesscult, Vaxn8, Flipside, and Greenfox- your posts are all very well thought-out and thorough. I'd spread some rep points if I could, but I have to wait 24 hrs.

I think if everyone who has libretarian beliefs actually voted for a libretarian, we'd win. It's just that the repubs/dems make it seem like the libs are soo fringe that nobody will vote for them, and if you want your vote to count, you must vote for one or the other major party. Well fuck 'em- let's all vote libretarian and get 'em elected.


I apologise on behalf of Virginia for being an ignorant asshole state and for banning gay marriage. Virginia is a dick. Virginia is sorry, and won't do it again, we promise.


Yeah for people with DNA against `em, maybe. But think of this: Instead of eye for an eye... I mean...a life sentence without the POSSIBILITY of parole... I dunno.. that would scare me shitless.... I think death would be kinder than knowing that you are going to be in a box forever and ever... just my humble opinion. :)

[remybur12]

my fault I read the T.V wrong. same sex unions are legal and gay marriage is still banned

[greenfox]

Not that anyone cares, but I changed my avitar.... this is the one that I was using on the other board for those of you who know me from there. Confusion? Always. Intentionally? Usually never. :)

[remybur12]

what do you mean by saying final hits

[greenfox]

what do you mean by saying final hits

It's a quote from trainspotting... towards the end of the movie.. hard to explain you'd have to see it.

[aj11]

"with god's help I will conquer this terrible affliction"

[flipside]

Yeah for people with DNA against `em, maybe. But think of this: Instead of eye for an eye... I mean...a life sentence without the POSSIBILITY of parole... I dunno.. that would scare me shitless.... I think death would be kinder than knowing that you are going to be in a box forever and ever... just my humble opinion. :)


KINDER?? I do not have the inclination to be kind to any of these violent offenders. I agree death may be an easy way out, but until we stop letting murderer's and rapists, child molester's free,
time and time again,
it's the only gaurantee we have to keep them locked up, usualy to die a natural death or if karma comes a , violent death at the hands of another inmate, the majority will never see the chair or get the needle, but they will indeed never be paroled, or given time off for good behaivoir, or see the light of day again..just like their victims.

[remybur12]

My friend told me trainspotting is the best movie he ever seen. I went to blockbuster the other day and they did'nt have it. But I really want to see it. Its about heroin right?

[flipside]

Check blockbuster online, they usually have a much larger selection than in the stores, order it and they'll deliver it right to your door.

[greenfox]

KINDER?? I do not have the inclination to be kind to any of these violent offenders. I agree death may be an easy way out, but until we stop letting murderer's and rapists, child molester's free,
time and time again,
it's the only gaurantee we have to keep them locked up, usualy to die a natural death or if karma comes a , violent death at the hands of another inmate, the majority will never see the chair or get the needle, but they will indeed never be paroled, or given time off for good behaivoir, or see the light of day again..just like their victims.

OK I don't wanna start a flame war so let's get one thing straight: I am not PRO_MURDER, PRO-RAPE, or PRO-ANY type of violent crime (I'm a dead head for fuck's sake!) If anything I am the POSTER child for being nice to your fellow woman (and man) heh... so.. please don't get the wrong idea. Yes, the fucks should be punished (in the case of rape I'm all for castration) I am simply saying that death is irreversable... in DNA cases, sure why not (even tho I don't think two wrongs make a right,) I was simply making the point that innocent people should not die.

Surely you agree with this?

and btw- in killing our prisoners, we do not deter crime and I don't think there is one other "1st world" country that does it... I know Europe doesn't. China does. Thailand does.

That is to say, if there is only circumstantial evidence and we fry some poor schmo, we can't go back and ressurrect him and say "sorry, we'll give ya an appeal since ya didn't do it".

YES violent crimes are fucked up. YES the people should be punished.. .by death? I don't know. I personally don't like to play god.. .so I personally couldn't pull the switch. I understand your situation and feel for ya and think that ur biased because of what happened (which is fucked up, and once again sorry it happened)... I am personally just too much of a dead head to kill anyone for any reason...

this world is fucked up enough with its prohibitive drug laws and such, I can't say going around executing people makes it better. It just makes the US look like jerks. I say jail `em for life and let Bubba have at `em. The *few* times I had *brief* stays in jail,. i can say i did not like it none too much... ... if I had to do more than a year, I'd probably flip out and hang myself. ... so...

I dunno. my $00.02

[remybur12]

I will do that. Thanks

[greenfox]

My friend told me trainspotting is the best movie he ever seen. I went to blockbuster the other day and they did'nt have it. But I really want to see it. Its about heroin right?

it;s more that :about heroin: it's prob. one of the most accurate movies about the scene out there. The "Perfect day/melting into the carpet" scene is prob. my favorite... look for it..

also: Requiem for a dream

[remybur12]

I will thanks.Did you know that the pink floyd song comfortably numb is about shooting heroin?

[Opiyum]

I will thanks.Did you know that the pink floyd song comfortably numb is about shooting heroin?


No fucking shit! Whats stairway to heaven about? ANyone????hehehe

[greenfox]

I will thanks.Did you know that the pink floyd song comfortably numb is about shooting heroin?


so is house of the rising sun, but few people know. :) actually if you wanted a list of pop songs with heroin references I could hook u up. If you want dead songs that you can download for free...actually fuck it (this isn't spam these sites are free- the music is free no copyright infringement- not trying to sell you ANYTHING:) check these songs out::

http://www.gdlive.com/dead/891009/gd-1989-10-09-208-DearMrFantasy.mp3
http://www.gdlive.com/dead/700514/gd-1970-05-14-312-NewSpeedwayBoogie.mp3 <-- really good one; listen to the lyrics carefully!
http://www.gdlive.com/dead/720921/gd-1972-09-21-109-Loser.mp3 <--- fav. dead song of all time; you gotta REALLY listen to that one to get the point.. :)

[remybur12]

stair way to heaven is about the singers wife dying and he's trying to reach her.

[Opiyum]

yeah i could hook you up with a list too. There are quite a few on this web site...you know the website dedicated to all things opiates. Jesus christ there is no end in sight.

I see you took me literally too...thanks I wasnt sure what that song was about. Afterall its a completely subjective piece of art. Something that allows everyone to draw their own conclusions. You dont just tell people any song is about anything if you do then your not really listening

[greenfox]

yeah i could hook you up with a list too. There are quite a few on this web site...you know the website dedicated to all things opiates. Jesus christ there is no end in sight.

I see you took me literally too...thanks I wasnt sure what that song was about. Afterall its a completely subjective piece of art. Something that allows everyone to draw their own conclusions too. You dont just tell people any song is about anything if you do then your not really listening


very true. hey question for ya: what is that drawing u have as a signature? I always get curious. :)

[remybur12]

Yeah I was wondering that to

[Ragdoll]

I voted. I've always voted liberal; this time, by the time I got into the booth after standing in line for 25 minutes, I voted ultra-liberal.

When you're a poet at twenty, you're twenty.
When you're a poet at forty, you're a poet.

I thought Trainspotting was a farce. But then, I'm not a child of the 80's. Drugstore Cowboy was the shit. But then, I'm a child of the 70's.

[greenfox]

:D :p I voted. I've always voted liberal; this time, by the time I got into the booth after standing in line for 25 minutes, I voted ultra-liberal.

When you're a poet at twenty, you're twenty.
When you're a poet at forty, you're a poet.

I thought Trainspotting was a farce. But then, I'm not a child of the 80's. Drugstore Cowboy was the shit. But then, I'm a child of the 70's.

The kids of today should defend themselves against the 70's
it's not reality
just some one else's sentimentality.

heh i love quotes.

[flipside]

OK I don't wanna start a flame war so let's get one thing straight: I am not PRO_MURDER, PRO-RAPE, or PRO-ANY type of violent crime (I'm a dead head for fuck's sake!) If anything I am the POSTER child for being nice to your fellow woman (and man) heh... so.. please don't get the wrong idea. Yes, the fucks should be punished (in the case of rape I'm all for castration) I am simply saying that death is irreversable... in DNA cases, sure why not (even tho I don't think two wrongs make a right,) I was simply making the point that innocent people should not die.

Surely you agree with this?

and btw- in killing our prisoners, we do not deter crime and I don't think there is one other "1st world" country that does it... I know Europe doesn't. China does. Thailand does.

That is to say, if there is only circumstantial evidence and we fry some poor schmo, we can't go back and ressurrect him and say "sorry, we'll give ya an appeal since ya didn't do it".

YES violent crimes are fucked up. YES the people should be punished.. .by death? I don't know. I personally don't like to play god.. .so I personally couldn't pull the switch. I understand your situation and feel for ya and think that ur biased because of what happened (which is fucked up, and once again sorry it happened)... I am personally just too much of a dead head to kill anyone for any reason...

this world is fucked up enough with its prohibitive drug laws and such, I can't say going around executing people makes it better. It just makes the US look like jerks. I say jail `em for life and let Bubba have at `em. The *few* times I had *brief* stays in jail,. i can say i did not like it none too much... ... if I had to do more than a year, I'd probably flip out and hang myself. ... so...

I dunno. my $00.02


Absolutely agree innocent people should not die. but they do every day. As for the death penalty I may very well be biased. But what you did not see was what the death penalty accomlishes is to insure that offender never sees the light of day again. Untill we stop letting violent offenders out of jail this is the only option we have to keep them in. To repeat myself, most prisoners on death row will never be executed but will die of natural causes while we appeal on their behalf or if karma comes perhaps death at the hand of another inmate.

I appreciate your point of view, and you make some valid points I can agree with, let's just agree to disagree. It's all good.:)

[madnesscult]

Just to clarify, I am not against the death penalty. I believe that it is a decent solution in certain circumstances. I just added that comment in my previous post in regards to the innocence issue others had been discussing.

[Paregoric Kid]

the government has no legitimate claim on anyones income, so fuck income tax. the treasury should get their money through non-coercive methods, like user fees, lotteries, raffles, contract enforcement, etc., when they collect money in those ways the people are voluntarily giving the government money. with taxes if you choose not to pay them the government will come find you with guns drawn.
taxation is theft.

[HistoryofMadness]

After bush
stole the first election
and the people re-elected him
the second time;
I decided fuck it.
No more voting for awhile.
I'll still bitch tho-
it's my constitutional right.

no shit good point and for the record I was drunk the other nite... when was that again?

seriously I think its important but I also think if other people don't care then that's really their thing.. no big deal.

in fact I strongly oppose "get out the vote" stuff...

[greenfox]

Absolutely agree innocent people should not die. but they do every day. As for the death penalty I may very well be biased. But what you did not see was what the death penalty accomlishes is to insure that offender never sees the light of day again. Untill we stop letting violent offenders out of jail this is the only option we have to keep them in. To repeat myself, most prisoners on death row will never be executed but will die of natural causes while we appeal on their behalf or if karma comes perhaps death at the hand of another inmate.

I appreciate your point of view, and you make some valid points I can agree with, let's just agree to disagree. It's all good.:)

yeah that's "one of the things that makes this country great.. " heh..

[madnesscult]

HOM: Do you mean that you oppose the campaigns to get people registered/voting?

Although I do believe that people should get off their asses, get informed, and go vote, I don't think that bribery should be used to get people to vote...in Arizona, there's a proposed legislation that would make voting similar to the lottery: for every election, one voter would win $1,000,000, which presumably would make turnout much higher. I think this isn't a terribly good or well-thought-out idea. First of all, people should be convinced to go vote by other means than this essential bribery. Secondly, this will probably just fuck things up more...so many people would just go and vote randomly without being informed or caring about who/what they're voting for, just so they can get in the running for the prize money. Finally, it would be a much better system if they were to pay every voter $5 or $10 instead of the large amount to just one person. Oh, and I never understood that MTV "vote or die" campaign. That Robot Chicken skit always comes to mind - Puffy and his thugs showing up at non-voters' houses and shooting them.

I'm amazed at how many people just don't care about politics and don't vote. The laws and politicians that are voted in effect all of our lives in one way or another, and sometimes can effect us greatly. And I too believe that if you don't exercize your right to vote, you're not allowed to complain about things*.

*There's one exception: if one cannot/could not vote. Like me, for example. I wasn't old enough to vote during the last presidential election, but I believe that I am still allowed to complain about Bush.

[flipside]

HOM: Do you mean that you oppose the campaigns to get people registered/voting?

Although I do believe that people should get off their asses, get informed, and go vote, I don't think that bribery should be used to get people to vote...in Arizona, there's a proposed legislation that would make voting similar to the lottery: for every election, one voter would win $1,000,000, which presumably would make turnout much higher. I think this isn't a terribly good or well-thought-out idea. First of all, people should be convinced to go vote by other means than this essential bribery. Secondly, this will probably just fuck things up more...so many people would just go and vote randomly without being informed or caring about who/what they're voting for, just so they can get in the running for the prize money. Finally, it would be a much better system if they were to pay every voter $5 or $10 instead of the large amount to just one person. Oh, and I never understood that MTV "vote or die" campaign. That Robot Chicken skit always comes to mind - Puffy and his thugs showing up at non-voters' houses and shooting them.

I'm amazed at how many people just don't care about politics and don't vote. The laws and politicians that are voted in effect all of our lives in one way or another, and sometimes can effect us greatly. And I too believe that if you don't exercize your right to vote, you're not allowed to complain about things*.

*There's one exception: if one cannot/could not vote. Like me, for example. I wasn't old enough to vote during the last presidential election, but I believe that I am still allowed to complain about Bush.


You can absolutley bitch about Bush wehther or not you voted, he stole the damn election anyway I know my vote did not count in that election. Only in America....

[madnesscult]

I wasn't saying specifically that one cannot bitch about Bush if they didn't vote, just in general. That election was total bullshit, and although he did win outright the second time, he had no business being president in the first place. The electoral college system is ridiculous. Because of that system, we are not a true democracy, as the masses do not directly decide who controls our country - the electoral college does. It was supposed to safeguard against unfit people being elected, but in the case of Bush, it has entirely backfired.

[Coddfish]

I think this isn't a terribly good or well-thought-out idea. First of all, people should be convinced to go vote by other means than this essential bribery. Secondly, this will probably just fuck things up more...so many people would just go and vote randomly without being informed or caring about who/what they're voting for, just so they can get in the running for the prize money.

I'm amazed at how many people just don't care about politics and don't vote. The laws and politicians that are voted in effect all of our lives in one way or another, and sometimes can effect us greatly. And I too believe that if you don't exercize your right to vote, you're not allowed to complain about things*.

*There's one exception: if one cannot/could not vote. Like me, for example. I wasn't old enough to vote during the last presidential election, but I believe that I am still allowed to complain about Bush.
ok, where to start. this post is not aimed at anyone in particular, just buck shot with a good spread.

for those people who say that i don't have a right to complain because i don't vote, let me put it to you like this: i am going to beat you to a bloody pulp, but you can vote on whether i use a sledge hammer or a baseball bat. i probably won't listen to you, but if you don't vote then you can't complain about how bloody your clothes are when i am finished with you. c'mon, hurry up! which one will it be?

i refuse to vote for evil, so i will not vote for the lesser of two evils. you people who did knowingly vote for evil, i should be complaining about you because you're the reason there are evil people running this country. and i promise i keep up with politics more than most people; it ain't apathy.

i'm not saying don't vote. but vote because you think it does good, not because you only think it gives you a right to bitch. that's just kinda pathetic.

ok, can getting most people to vote through some lottery scheme really fuck things up more? think about it. not likely.

the death penalty: a government does not have an ethical justification to kill its citizens who are in prison and can be kept there for life. period. there are certain inalienable rights (i believe), and by killing one of its citizens a government takes away all of his rights--including the right to life. if you believe that there are inalienable rights and you also believe in the death penalty, then you have an ethical dilemma. if protecting people from convicted murderers is the concern, then don't let convicted murderers out of prison.

i could go off on the way the two parties work covertly together in order to keep third parties on the outiside, thus perpetuating indefinitely the current power structure of the corrupted american sociopolitical system, but it's too long and i hate politics.

[robojunkie]

I usually vote in all the elections (even when I have been sick) although I missed this one as I didn't get out of work till 8:30 pm. Even though I vote on principle the sad mathematical truth is that it really doesn't matter if I vote or not unless some election comes down to 1 vote. I mean I would much rather see a Dem Congress/Senate but few if any of these people give a rat's ass about true freedom of choice (not just abortion rights) and freedom of consciousness. Who's to say that as an agnostic opiate, and to a lesser degree other drugs, aren't the closest thing someone like me has to a non-reality spirtiual system. It fits with everything else in the world (strings attached, no free lunch, feel good now, bad later). Despite this I will make a greater effort to vote in '08 even thought its symbolic (I usually vote for the libertartian if he/she is a strong supporter of individiual civil freedoms and not just "get rid of very tax...etc." It is interesting to see though that, what, two states with full marijuana legalizaiton (not just MMJ) got up to 40% support! I couldn't see that happening 15 years ago. Thanks George Soros and others, its what I would do if I were a multi-billionaire.

[madnesscult]

I usually vote in all the elections (even when I have been sick) although I missed this one as I didn't get out of work till 8:30 pm.

Employers are required by law to allow their workers time off to vote.