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6-MAM
04-19-2012, 11:22 AM
Well I don't know why, but I've regained interest in stimulants, probably because I've finally allowed myself to believe deep down that ADD/ADHD is a real condition, and I most likely have it. I love simple organic chemistry, I understand the basics, and maybe a little more. And feel meth synth, no matter how dirty it is, is a good introduction into clandestine organic chemistry. But I do not wish to consume the drug, but I know it’d get the better of me if was there.

So I found Rhodium after 10 plus years of reading erowid, for some god reason I read and read about these one pot synths and what not. After reading all the responses on this site(no offence to anyone, this place is way better then any other site) and many other I've come to the realization that 90% of the people have no idea what any of the ingredients do, what the process is taking place.... Hell most people can't understand the concept of a non-polar substance or what the fuck an acid/base reaction is or even what it does.

Most people don't even know what desoxyephedrine is...... or what they are trying to do to the ephedrine molecule... Even the people posting these recipes!

But there are a lot of "Meth cooking for dummies" bullshit out there, like this "shake n bake"...

IF IS A VIOLATION OF RULES PLEASE INFORM ME:

"Materials : 1 box of pseudo-ephedrine pills, 1 Cold-Compress pack, a bottle of lye crystals, 2 AA energizer lithium batteries, Coleman fuel, Iodized salt, sulfuric acid or Muriatic acid, 2 20oz bottles, coffee filters, a clear hose about 6 - 12" long, funnel, 2 Pint Mason jars, and lineman pliers.

first off, make sure your working in a clean and safe area. Clean both of the 20oz bottles with some paper towels and a clothes hanger, rinse with Coleman fuel, and repeat. You want the bottles to be clean as possible to make clean dope.

After you clean one bottle, use your funnel and one coffee filter and put 8oz of Coleman fuel in the bottle. Then, using your lineman pliers, obtain the lithium metal from the batteries, tear them small balls and put them in your fuel. After you get both your lithium strips in, add 3 tablespoons of crushed AN from the cold compress pack, and 3 tablespoons of lye crystals. Shake the bottle and get a reaction going. After you get a good reaction add your crushed pseudo-ephedrine and let it cook for 45 minutes to an hour. Burping the bottle when it get tight. refrain from shaking the bottle in the during the last 15 minutes of the cook.

Their should be a good amount of copper "b.b.s" floating with your lithium strips. this is a good sign your cook is close to finished. Clean out the mason jar you have ready, and use 3-4 filters to filter off your cook into the mason jar.

Now its time to make a smoke bottle, either using sulfuric acid or Muriatic acid. Clean the 20oz bottle like before, and make a hole in the cap big enough for your hose. if your using sulfuric acid, add 1 tablespoon of salt to the bottle and just a couple drops of sulfuric acid. If your using Muriatic acid, put 3-4 balls of aluminum foil in the bottle and a couple drops of Muriatic acid. Put the hose right above your fuel in the mason jar and watch the dope drop.

Hit it with the smoke a couple times and stir it up until it doesn't drop anymore, then filter this into another mason jar, and you got your first pull in the filter. dry it out and test it. then take the fuel you poured off and put it back in the cook bottle. cook it for about 30 minutes and try for a second pull.

You should yield about a gram, to a gram and a half of Methamphetamine."

But I digress... Please do not try this because when lithium comes in contact with oxygen for to long it ignites.

If you followed that to a T you MIGHT get MAP: but the ingredients are no longer valid, and I'm glad. If you cannot figure out what chemical is inside those listed ingredients and what reaction is taking place (I know what chemicals are needed but I'm iffy on what process is actually taking place with (lets abbreviate) AN and SH, I know they produce an ammonia gas under pressure, that forces oxygen out of the bottle so the reaction can take place ect.. I'm fuzzy on what the lithium is doing in the presence if the gas.... what reaction is happing... obviously its pulling the oxygen off... but how? Is oxygen highly attracted to lithium, so in an anhydrous "although that doesn't mean to say oxygen free right, just H2o free" environment it scavenges oxygen from any available source?

In this: http://www.erowid.org/archive/rhodium/chemistry/amphetamine.reduction.html
It is claiming it is a heterogeneous catalytic hydrogenation, but I though that is when you are bonding hydrogen to a molecule, like hydromorphone. Is the hydrogen bonding to the oxygen to make h2o? I suppose I have more reading to do, or if someone can help point me in the direction I'd be gratefull. I'm not asking how to make anything.

I just want to know the specifics of the reaction, I know how to do it, I want the technical terms, so I can have the knowledge of it really, knowledge is valuable. I prefer if we not go into detail about the ingredients though. Basically I don't want people not smart enough to know how to figure out the chemicals and there modern replacements in current products, (if it really so much a secret) to know how to "shake and bake". Like I've read on here before, if you cant isolate pse from the binders, you shouldn't be doing this chemistry.

I don't want people burning there house down, because with this it's a real possibility, you need pressure in the bottle to make a reaction, but too much pressure is created when done correctly so if you do not "burp" the bottle it will explode sending highly caustic and flammable chemicals flying all over you and the area. Add on top of that you have lithium strips getting exposed to oxygen and potentially reacting creating an intense flame thereby effectively roasting you and anyone around alive.

So lets use these terms: An Sh NPS for those listed.

And forgive my lack of linguistics and grammar/spelling. I’m smarter then it looks I promise. I should have been a doctor…

Oh and on a differnt note: Is morphine racemic? I know morhans have dextro and levos, but do natural opiates? I've never seen d-morphine or d-oxycodone.... Is one an alkaloid and the other an indole?

TheTalkingAsshole
04-19-2012, 11:41 AM
isnt this just the one-pot method?
and isnt lithium reactive in h2o?
and isnt it true that burping the bottle can also lead to an explosion if too much air gets in?

6-MAM
04-19-2012, 12:08 PM
I believe lithium is reactive with oxygen...

I'm not trying to be a dick but if you'd have read the bold typing it says what you are saying clearly. A gas is created and pushes any oxygen out of the bottle. So yes, if you left the bottle open there is a high chance of oxygen reacting with the lithium. Like I said, if someone doesn't even know what desoxyephedrine is, they shouldn't be doing this. Period. This one pot is by far the most dangerous one pot that I've seen.

There are a few way to make a one pot method, RP/Id is another. But I understand what is happening better in that one, I want to know what is happening with An/Sh/Lithium metal specifically.

Larkin
04-19-2012, 02:58 PM
I believe lithium is reactive with oxygen...

I'm not trying to be a dick but if you'd have read the bold typing it says what you are saying clearly. A gas is created and pushes any oxygen out of the bottle. So yes, if you left the bottle open there is a high chance of oxygen reacting with the lithium. Like I said, if someone doesn't even know what desoxyephedrine is, they shouldn't be doing this. Period. This one pot is by far the most dangerous one pot that I've seen.

There are a few way to make a one pot method, RP/Id is another. But I understand what is happening better in that one, I want to know what is happening with An/Sh/Lithium metal specifically.

i am pretty familiar with the above method of cooking and yes, it is super dangerous. lithium just oxidizes and turns black in air, its h20 that sets it ablaze. some people do that cook in layers with a few drops of water as a catalyst

6-MAM
04-19-2012, 04:00 PM
That’s because An produces an endothermic reaction with H20. Not because of the reaction with lithium. The layers are to prevent lithium from coming in contact with water. This is very dangerous, it's only purpose is to kick of the reaction without heat.

But lithium is indeed reactive with water as you both stated, but according to wikipedia, only when in open air. It is not highly reactive with oxygen, but could possibly ignite.

" Lithium will ignite and burn in oxygen when exposed to water or water vapors.
[12] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium%20/%20cite_note-12) Lithium is inflammable (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inflammable), and it is potentially explosive when exposed to air and especially to water, though less so than the other alkali metals (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alkali_metals). The lithium-water reaction at normal temperatures is brisk but not violent, the hydrogen produced will not ignite on its own. As with all alkali metals, lithium fires are difficult to extinguish, requiring dry powder fire extinguishers, specifically Class D type (see Types of extinguishing agents (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fire_extinguisher%20/%20Types_of_extinguishing_agents)). Lithium is the only metal which reacts with nitrogen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nitrogen) under normal conditions (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normal_conditions)"

So in reality it would be the combination of water in the bottle, and then having air get in I believe.

But still, What is the reaction with An/Sh/lithium. I read An gives off nitric acid when reacted with HC. but lye is a base.... this is where I'm confused. Nitric acid is what you'd be after or am I understanding it wrong... Rp/Id gives nitric acid right?

I need some chemistry up in here.

6-MAM
04-21-2012, 01:17 PM
Always under my nose, I must be ADD.

It's a modified birch. Lithium in ammonia creates a "solvated electron" in which two are needed to reduce ephedrine.

Now how that happens, I'd still like to know, but I guess I'll have to find out on me own...

Maybe I could get this moved to chemistry...