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The Ryan
12-04-2010, 10:44 PM
i know theres probably information on here about this but i cant find it.

ok so here goes theres tons of GREAT info on how to kick dope/prettymuch any opiate on opiophile effectively and ways to kick with significantly lower withdrawal symptoms (lope, taper plans, etc) but there doesnt seem to be much info on reducing the pains of benzo withdrawals.

so heres my question, are there any things you can take or anything that will help ease the detox off a small (1mg clonazepam twice daily for about 2 months) benzo habit. i do have plenty left to do a taper but dont really know how to set up an effective taper plan for clonazepam.

so does anyone have any experience kicking benzos and have any tricks to ease the pain?

I'm-Nod-Addicted
12-04-2010, 10:55 PM
Are these prescribed to you?

The Ryan
12-04-2010, 11:04 PM
no, it costs me 4 dollars a day off the streets.

Oxyphile
12-04-2010, 11:08 PM
Other drugs with GABA effects will help, such as Neurontin (gabapentin) and Lyrica (pregabalin), but I think a taper would be your best bet since you said you have plenty of clonazepam left. I've been taking clonazepam for about 6 months now and one of my relatives has been taking it for over 10 years, so i've got quite a bit of experience with it. I would suggest taking 1.5mg a day for about a week, maybe less, however long it takes until you feel comfortable with the reduced dose. Then you can do the same with 1mg. After that you might want to only reduce by .25mg at a time, unless you feel comfortable going down to .5mg straight from 1mg. You should be able to taper down to zero in about a month since your dose isn't that high and you haven't been taking it for too long. Please keep in mind that benzo wd's can have some nasty results including seizures, so you may want to seek advice from a medical professional as well. I doubt you would have much risk of seizures coming off that low of a dose, but better safe than sorry. Good luck getting off the clonaz ryan!

Tony
12-04-2010, 11:23 PM
To the OP,


Please understand I am not trying to be a smart ass.

But how bad is the feeling when you don't take any?

How long does it take for the WD symptoms to start?

I have always had luck switching to another similar drug
and then doing fast taper.

Good Luck!

limitless_euphoria
12-04-2010, 11:24 PM
I would do a slow taper, slow and steady wins the race.

The great thing about klonopin is that it has a very long half-life meaning it will take a while to slowly, fully leave your system.

If you went to a psychiatrist to do a benzo detox, a lot of times they will use a stronger anticonvulsant such as topamax. Or, they have been known to put people on longer-acting benzos like valium which has one of the longest half-lives out there (20-100 hours).

Usually the benzos people that have a real helluva time gettin' off of are the short-acting ones (xanax, ativan) that they consume in massive dosages over weeks, months or years. I know this dude that 8-10 mg of xanax per day every day (he ordered 'em offline, got 'em on the street, had like three different docs giving him various strengths before Rx monitoring). This is a genuine SWIM situation.

Good old klonopin is my #1 favorite benzo even though it's not technically a benzodiazepine (it's a nitrobenzodiazepine as it's derived from nitrazepam) kind of like how Windows 7 is really Windows 6.1.

Anyway, I'm turning into TheGoodDoctor... :)

If you're only on 1 mg of kpin twice per day taper back to ½ a pill 3x per day. Then see if you can get it down to ½ a pill twice per day. The final step would be to see if you can just take 0.5 mg for the day and that's it. I think that would be the jumping off point. Maybe those last few 0.5 mg dosages you could stagger every 36-48 hours. Other drugs like lyrica or neurontin could be useful once you try to make the jump.

To give you honest advice, you should probably tell your doctor you want to taper. If you tell him you're an addict there's a high risk he/she might never treat you the same. But, if you frame it like... "I'd like to see if I can cut back on or discontinue using this medication" he/she might actually be willing to be proactive and help you.

Compared to the monster habits I've heard of on this site and IRL, yours shouldn't be as hard to break. If you jump off at 0.5 mg per day I have never heard of a seizure at that level. Or you can try the valium or the topamax route.

Honestly, it's just sticking with it that's going to be a bitch. Psychologically it will be tough. But, the upshot of the situation is that you're not hooked on a massive daily dosage (e.g. 2 mg 4x per day or something). If there's anything else you want to know, ask away. I'll answer what I can.

Good luck!!!

I'm-Nod-Addicted
12-04-2010, 11:33 PM
I'd do a super slow taper.

The Ryan
12-05-2010, 12:03 AM
I would do a slow taper, slow and steady wins the race.

The great thing about klonopin is that it has a very long half-life meaning it will take a while to slowly, fully leave your system.

If you went to a psychiatrist to do a benzo detox, a lot of times they will use a stronger anticonvulsant such as topamax. Or, they have been known to put people on longer-acting benzos like valium which has one of the longest half-lives out there (20-100 hours).

Usually the benzos people that have a real helluva time gettin' off of are the short-acting ones (xanax, ativan) that they consume in massive dosages over weeks, months or years. I know this dude that 8-10 mg of xanax per day every day (he ordered 'em offline, got 'em on the street, had like three different docs giving him various strengths before Rx monitoring). This is a genuine SWIM situation.

Good old klonopin is my #1 favorite benzo even though it's not technically a benzodiazepine (it's a nitrobenzodiazepine as it's derived from nitrazepam) kind of like how Windows 7 is really Windows 6.1.

Anyway, I'm turning into TheGoodDoctor... :)

If you're only on 1 mg of kpin twice per day taper back to ½ a pill 3x per day. Then see if you can get it down to ½ a pill twice per day. The final step would be to see if you can just take 0.5 mg for the day and that's it. I think that would be the jumping off point. Maybe those last few 0.5 mg dosages you could stagger every 36-48 hours. Other drugs like lyrica or neurontin could be useful once you try to make the jump.

To give you honest advice, you should probably tell your doctor you want to taper. If you tell him you're an addict there's a high risk he/she might never treat you the same. But, if you frame it like... "I'd like to see if I can cut back on or discontinue using this medication" he/she might actually be willing to be proactive and help you.

Compared to the monster habits I've heard of on this site and IRL, yours shouldn't be as hard to break. If you jump off at 0.5 mg per day I have never heard of a seizure at that level. Or you can try the valium or the topamax route.

Honestly, it's just sticking with it that's going to be a bitch. Psychologically it will be tough. But, the upshot of the situation is that you're not hooked on a massive daily dosage (e.g. 2 mg 4x per day or something). If there's anything else you want to know, ask away. I'll answer what I can.

Good luck!!!

i dont get them from a doctor i buy them off the streets. i have to wait because i need this doctor that will prescribe them to me. but this certain doc is booked up for a few weeks (hes my moms doctor and he hooks her up FOR REAL, he will prescribe them, i legitimately need them), i am low on money and need to save the money im spending on benzos until i can get my appointment, so i would like just like to know the best way to get off them, someone suggested gabapentan my girl has 120 of those a month so i might try to taper down to .25mg twice daily then take that stuff for a week or so. thanks guys.

RxQueen
12-05-2010, 02:33 AM
http://www.benzo.org.uk/

please go to this site ^^^

you will find all kinds of info written by one of the most outstanding professionals in this exact field. do a SLOW taper! you can find approximate taper schedules for nearly any benzo on that site. the best benzo to use for a taper is valium, because of its super-long half-life, but k-pins should do alright since they also have a much longer half-life than some of the others (like xanax).

and never be afraid to slow a benzo taper down to whatever level you are comfortable with! if you feel you need to stay on a certain dose longer before your next scheduled dosage drop, just do it. i came off a benzo habit that lasted over 12 years, and it took me at least 9 months to get down to zero. (and i still didn't sleep well, or feel quite right, for a few more months after that). physical dependence on any benzo is NO JOKE. opiate WD can make you wish you were dead... benzo WD can make that wish come true.

there have been a few other threads on benzo wd.... try to find some. i know at least one of them had a bunch of us chiming in and listing some of the side effects we suffered through during our tapers and how we handled them and stuff (it might've been started by chopstix.... search threads that he started).

best of luck, ryan!



here's the thread i was thinking of:

http://forum.opiophile.org/showthread.php?t=15120

China white
12-05-2010, 05:34 AM
two words.....professional taper

Billy the kid
12-05-2010, 05:47 AM
A professional taper is the best way to go with a long acting benzo such as clonazepam or valium. I've had a few successful tapers with clonazepam.

Another option, if your supply of benzos is running out or something is a Phenibut taper. Phenibut will completely relieve all of the withdrawls and it lasts quite a long time. It is also physically addicting though so it is important that you taper that as well. Just don't start taking the phenibut for a buzz because it's easy to get an insane tolerance to the stuff and the risk of seizures when coming off of that are just as high as coming off of a high dose of benzos.

Even if you don't have a script, you can still go to a doctor and they will give you a benzo taper. Doctors and hospitals don't fuck around when it comes to benzo withdrawal. I've always said it's one of the only drugs that you can go into the ER and tell them your an addict and they'll give you some and start a taper.

OrangeLude
12-05-2010, 07:13 AM
many of your questions about one benzo versus another ....comparative strengths & half lifes ...taper plans ...can be found here....

http://www.benzo.org.uk/

I just saw that this was posted a few up by RxQ - please do go to this site...

OxyRush Limbaugh
12-05-2010, 10:47 AM
ryan,

I can't add anything informative but I can say kudos for checking here first before you try anything.

I went CT on benzos 3 years ago (not knowing it could be lethal). luckily, it wasn't.

The Ryan
12-05-2010, 12:55 PM
thankyou RxQueen!

and everyone else ofcourse

---------- Post added at 01:55 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:36 PM ----------


To the OP,


Please understand I am not trying to be a smart ass.

But how bad is the feeling when you don't take any?

How long does it take for the WD symptoms to start?

I have always had luck switching to another similar drug
and then doing fast taper.

Good Luck!

sorry i didnt see your post at first, i have not discontinued use since my habit started, so i dont know.

Vico-Dan
12-06-2010, 10:27 PM
http://www.benzo.org.uk/manual/bzsched.htm#s2

kdog
12-07-2010, 05:21 PM
Probably something I'm gonna start doing too. I'm on klon's @ 1mg/day and per my other thread got an extra 60 by mistake, but I just don't wanna go through the true benzo w/d. I experienced a mild version of klon w/d's and for a week I didn't want to do anything or talk to anybody. It was like I was the most depressed person in the world. You have to be strong though, because in my situation, I don't live with anybody but my dog so I don't have a close support system, and you can easily get suicidal thoughts if you're lucky enough to avoid even getting a seizure. But I got back on the train and am actally going to try the taper method as suggested by the Ashton Manual. Right now I have enough pins and valiums to do it, but I keep questioning myself, only because these fucking things just make you feel sooo good.

Good luck though man, i'm with you on this I just might not be ready to start tomorrow that's all. But I will be benzo free sometime by sprigtime '11. Going to do the slooooooooow taper. Then after that I'll try the sub taper again. last time wasn't so successful, but I've talked to my doc about it and he'd very supportive of helping to ween off when I'm ready. Little does he know I have tons stockpiled because of what he rx's me, but I can do it eventually.

Get off Benzo's first > Then Subs > Then What?

Oxyphile
12-13-2010, 09:40 PM
Probably something I'm gonna start doing too. I'm on klon's @ 1mg/day and per my other thread got an extra 60 by mistake, but I just don't wanna go through the true benzo w/d. I experienced a mild version of klon w/d's and for a week I didn't want to do anything or talk to anybody. It was like I was the most depressed person in the world. You have to be strong though, because in my situation, I don't live with anybody but my dog so I don't have a close support system, and you can easily get suicidal thoughts if you're lucky enough to avoid even getting a seizure. But I got back on the train and am actally going to try the taper method as suggested by the Ashton Manual. Right now I have enough pins and valiums to do it, but I keep questioning myself, only because these fucking things just make you feel sooo good.
Good luck though man, i'm with you on this I just might not be ready to start tomorrow that's all. But I will be benzo free sometime by sprigtime '11. Going to do the slooooooooow taper. Then after that I'll try the sub taper again. last time wasn't so successful, but I've talked to my doc about it and he'd very supportive of helping to ween off when I'm ready. Little does he know I have tons stockpiled because of what he rx's me, but I can do it eventually.
Get off Benzo's first > Then Subs > Then What?

That's a fairly low dose, I'm a bit surprised your week of WD's was so uncomfortable. Were you taking more than the 1mg/day because of your extras? Either way, if you're staying on them you're not on too high of a dose, so getting off them in the future shouldn't be too hard. And if you're going to start working on a taper, the Ashton Manual is definitely a good reference. Good luck with whatever you decide to do regarding the kpins, kdog!


Ryan, how are you doing man? Still on the same kpin dose, or working on a taper? Let me know how you're doing.

seven10kids
12-14-2010, 10:26 AM
man, im lucky i guess., I went from 5-6 2mg xanax bars a day, to nothing and to this day dontreally mess with benzos anymore. some of those 5-6 bars a day were sniffed so they didnt hit me super strong but i was asleep by 8 each night after a huge meal. I just weened but it took about 2 weeks. I really really wanted to get off em. Im really thankfull i did it. too bad i cant do the same on opies..

Poppylvr
12-14-2010, 10:55 AM
Ryan, how's the taper going?

Benz
12-14-2010, 10:58 AM
I haven't had time to read all the previous posts, so sorry in advance if I repeat anything that's already been suggested.

I'm also dependent on benzos, I started off taking diazepam & temazepam bought from the street. I was taking about 60mg diazepam & 20mg - 60mg temazepam daily. I went onto a script because I wasn't willing to let the uncertainty of my street source & my finances potentially cut off my supply, leading to a hellish rattle.

I feel MUCH better now I'm on a script. I worried constantly about the supply. I'm currently on 50mg diazepam. The Ashton Manual, which can be found at benzo.org is an excellent resource. I showed it to my doctor & she follows the suggested system of switching to an equivalent dose of diazepam, remaining stable for a few weeks/months then tapering down either 1mg per week or 2mg every two weeks. I've been through this regime before & barely felt it.

I believe from previous posts you take clonazepam. You probably know this benzo has very powerful anti-convulsant properties and is less sedating. You may feel more sedated at an equivalent dose of diazepam but you will become tolerant to it. Diazepam really is the best benzo to taper down from. It is very long lasting & is available in 2mg tablets which can be halved or even quatered.

Best of luck with the taper. Try to break your ties with your street connect so you aren't tempted to use a few extra on top. I ditched the number from my phone. The girl wasn't happy and called/texted at first.



Benz

duck
12-14-2010, 11:09 AM
Best way to kick benzos is Cold Turkey, for sure.

1. Get on as high of dose as possible for as long as possible -- you want to be sure to really spike your dosage high right before kicking.
2. Immediately stop, DO NOT TAPER whatsoever.
3. Enjoy the seizures, they're good exercize

just kidding.

Kicking benzos sounds like the most fucking awful thing fucking ever in the fucking whole world ever. Seriously. Christ, that shit scares me so fucking bad. I mean, SEIZURES!??

Please take care and be careful.

Thanat0s
12-14-2010, 11:35 AM
i had a benzo w/d seizure from fairly light(4mgs day ativan for about 5 months) benzo use for anxiety. was drinking on top of it of course...

but id had a couple coke seizures a year earlier so my threshold was obv lowered...

very dangerous to give any advice other than worst case.

see a doctor, go slow with a taper and pay attention to your body.
ANY weirdness should be taken to the ER,
be aware of any factors that may have permanently lowered your seizure threshold.

sigprn
12-14-2010, 11:49 AM
i know theres probably information on here about this but i cant find it.

ok so here goes theres tons of GREAT info on how to kick dope/prettymuch any opiate on opiophile effectively and ways to kick with significantly lower withdrawal symptoms (lope, taper plans, etc) but there doesnt seem to be much info on reducing the pains of benzo withdrawals.

so heres my question, are there any things you can take or anything that will help ease the detox off a small (1mg clonazepam twice daily for about 2 months) benzo habit. i do have plenty left to do a taper but dont really know how to set up an effective taper plan for clonazepam.

so does anyone have any experience kicking benzos and have any tricks to ease the pain?

four a tablet. Those go for 2 dollars all day everyday. But to answer your question. Cut a 1mg tablet in half take twice a day then take just a half once a day then discontinue

kdog
12-14-2010, 12:00 PM
That's a fairly low dose, I'm a bit surprised your week of WD's was so uncomfortable. Were you taking more than the 1mg/day because of your extras? Either way, if you're staying on them you're not on too high of a dose, so getting off them in the future shouldn't be too hard. And if you're going to start working on a taper, the Ashton Manual is definitely a good reference. Good luck with whatever you decide to do regarding the kpins, kdog!
Ryan, how are you doing man? Still on the same kpin dose, or working on a taper? Let me know how you're doing.


Yeah I was taking temazepam's and xanax on top so that's what made it rougher. I should have made that more clear. As far as the Ashton Manual, I can't get a dr to rx me Valium, they all say it's stronger than clonopin then you'll be addicted to that. Stupid fucking dr's, do some goddam research. I plan on purchasing some valiums and doing my own Ashton taper.

Benz
12-14-2010, 12:30 PM
According to the Ashton Manual, 0.5mg clonazepam = 10mg diazepam. I would STRONGLY advise against making cuts in dosage that large. If you have any kind of physical dependence your body will notice a dose drop of this size. I have been through benzo w/ds & a subsequent seizure. It's no joke.

Try to do any benzo tapering with an understanding doctor. If one can't be found, switch to diazepam & follow the taper in the manual. The lowest dose unit clonazepam is available in is 0.25mg. That's like 5mg diazepam. If diazepam is not available, you could reduce by a halved 0.25mg every two weeks.



Benz

The Ryan
12-14-2010, 02:42 PM
Ryan, how's the taper going?

i start tomorrow

12/14-1mg 2x daily (been doing this for a while, this is what im doing today, but took an extra 5mg dizepam in the am)
12/15- .75mg 2x daily
12/16- .75mg 2x daily
12/17- .5mg 2x daily
12/18 .5mg 2x daily
12/19- .25mg 2x daily
12/20- .5mg 1x daily
12/21- .5mg 1x daily
12/22- .5mg 1x daily
12/23- .25mg 2x daily
12/24- .25mg 1x daily
12/25- .25mg 1x daily
12/26- .25mg 1x daily
12/27- KICK

this will plan will take all my supply and i have 27 gabapentin to help me through.

Poppylvr
12-16-2010, 11:03 AM
i start tomorrow

12/14-1mg 2x daily (been doing this for a while, this is what im doing today, but took an extra 5mg dizepam in the am)
12/15- .75mg 2x daily
12/16- .75mg 2x daily
12/17- .5mg 2x daily
12/18 .5mg 2x daily
12/19- .25mg 2x daily
12/20- .5mg 1x daily
12/21- .5mg 1x daily
12/22- .5mg 1x daily
12/23- .25mg 2x daily
12/24- .25mg 1x daily
12/25- .25mg 1x daily
12/26- .25mg 1x daily
12/27- KICK

this will plan will take all my supply and i have 27 gabapentin to help me through.
Looks like a good plan. Good Luck!
Keep us posted, K?

Morphus
12-16-2010, 10:54 PM
i start tomorrow

12/14-1mg 2x daily (been doing this for a while, this is what im doing today, but took an extra 5mg dizepam in the am)
12/15- .75mg 2x daily
12/16- .75mg 2x daily
12/17- .5mg 2x daily
12/18 .5mg 2x daily
12/19- .25mg 2x daily
12/20- .5mg 1x daily
12/21- .5mg 1x daily
12/22- .5mg 1x daily
12/23- .25mg 2x daily
12/24- .25mg 1x daily
12/25- .25mg 1x daily
12/26- .25mg 1x daily
12/27- KICK

this will plan will take all my supply and i have 27 gabapentin to help me through.


Heh heh, this is how I taper too, best time is always tomorrow!

Seriously, good luck with the benzo simian

LayinLow
12-17-2010, 06:40 AM
Taper benzo's tomorrow, and opiates day after tomorrow... right morphus? ;)

A 2 week taper sounds right ryan. Even at high doses, a 2 - 3 week taper is sufficient, and seizures shouldn't be a problem. That's if you stick to the planned taper. Have had 2 benzo w/d seizures, and 2 weeks of being a little uncomfortable will be much healthier on your mind and body. I get zaps to this day from those grand mals, ack.

buc
12-17-2010, 09:31 AM
After the benzo related death of my best friend in 2000 I kicked a decades long addiction to them.
I did it slowly...........tapered over a few month period.

It was the death of my buddy though that made me lose the taste for them.

I'm glad your leaving them behind.
Buc

borohydride
12-17-2010, 12:53 PM
14 days is much shorter than any doctor would recommend - make sure you have access to something in case it starts getting bad. Usually you stop sleeping & such; that's a warning. If you keep missing sleep then seizure threshold goes right down and a single tonic-clonic can be pretty final.

The Ryan
12-17-2010, 03:42 PM
if i went to the ER would they give me more to help taper, i only have 10mg clonazepam to work with and i changed my taper plan a bit im dropping to .5mg 3x daily tomorrow instead of 1mg 2x daily.

LayinLow
12-17-2010, 03:53 PM
If you worked a tiny bit of magic, getting a small script of benzo's from ER wouldn't be too hard. Do you have an Rx for them now? If not, may be harder getting them. I have been given IV benzo's from the ER quite easily... taking a script home is a little different..

The Ryan
12-20-2010, 10:51 AM
down to .5mg 2x daily, fairly painless so far.

Oxyphile
12-20-2010, 02:11 PM
down to .5mg 2x daily, fairly painless so far.

glad to hear it hasn't been too difficult. did you get some more clonaz? the only reason I ask is because you seem to be taking the taper a little slower than the schedule you posted a page back. you're almost in the clear man, 1mg isn't too much at all and the gabapentin should help too, at least a little bit.

Score_K4
12-20-2010, 02:59 PM
Coming off a 1mg klonopin habit should not be too bad considering its 18-50hr half-life. If you were coming off a high 3mg+ a day xanax habit then I would say be take your time. Coming off benzos is not fun, and I'm trying to get back on them because my anxiety is kicking my ass. You can try GABA or 5htp to help with mood, but you should just take it gradually. I don't feel that u are in a huge danger.

Poppylvr
12-23-2010, 10:59 AM
Ryan, I used clonazepam 2-3 mg on sat sun & mon every weekend for the past year + couple months. Sometime in Nov I noticed I was starting to get low level WD's on fri and Sat am, and I was getting a craving for the things, so I decided to quit. Have a script I had asked for for some really low level anxiety.
To wean off I did 5 days of 1 mg/day, then a week of .5 mg/day and then ~8 days of .25 mg.
I haven't had any clonaze in 14 days.
What I notice now is dramatically less sleep than when I was taking the kpins. Am unable to fall to sleep or sustain sleep w/o benedryl or ambien. I have this unpleasant speedy feeling that I just barely tolerate. I have a much lower apetite - have lost 5 pounds since the benzo munchies have ended. I am hoping that with each day further away from the clonaze it gets better, but it hasn't started to feel better yet. I also have a constant fine tremor of my hands.
Not trying to scare you off, just relating my experiences.
Please let us know how it goes for you.