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Illadelph41
06-15-2010, 03:37 PM
I've noticed recently that the A215s seem to be much weaker tan say the V's. I have to take 2 of the A's for the same relief as one V.

I know generics can be upto 20% difference, but this seems a little crazy.

lespaulpower
06-15-2010, 03:54 PM
That's odd. I've always had the best effects from the Actavis brand oxy-ir. Though my experience has always been with the 30mg blue's (A 215).

There could be a lot of variables such as fillers, binders, pill design, etc; this will all effect the overall quality, and every brand is going to be unique; as far as gut solubility, maximum plasma levels, time to peak plasma levels (rush vs no rush)...

But what you say about there being a 20% discrepancy allowed on generics, 20% seems VERY high..
Usually the differences are insignificant.

What's your ROA?

SHELLEY
06-15-2010, 04:04 PM
A215s are harder to smoke, or so i've heard
whenever i have them, all the little retard kids are like "oh the As suck" because apparently they burn funny
i don't really get into the habit of smoking roxys like a defiant 13 year old though so i'm not sure

Illadelph41
06-15-2010, 04:10 PM
A215s are harder to smoke, or so i've heard
whenever i have them, all the little retard kids are like "oh the As suck" because apparently they burn funny
i don't really get into the habit of smoking roxys like a defiant 13 year old though so i'm not sureWho said anything about smoking?

It's not just me, nobody I know likes the A215s and some won't buy them if that's all that is around.

It could also be that the V's are abnormally potent I guess.

lespaulpower
06-15-2010, 04:15 PM
A215s are harder to smoke, or so i've heard
whenever i have them, all the little retard kids are like "oh the As suck" because apparently they burn funny
i don't really get into the habit of smoking roxys like a defiant 13 year old though so i'm not sure


Smoking oxy seems to be very prevalent in Sofla, at least from what I've heard.. Haha :rolleyes:

If you take them orally, crushing them up completely and swallowing the powder may help...

harmonik
06-15-2010, 04:29 PM
You can still get a-215s? shiit. all I've been able to get recently are Mallis/Vintage/Qualitest..

The a-215s are by far my favorite. I notice they sting a bit more when I've snorted them and I would almost bet money that I feel a lot more banging 5 of those than I would 5 of the other brands...

Illadelph41
06-15-2010, 04:38 PM
Smoking oxy seems to be very prevalent in Sofla, at least from what I've heard.. Haha :rolleyes:

If you take them orally, crushing them up completely and swallowing the powder may help...I've tried chewing them, parachuting, snorting etc. The A215s around here are horrible. I will take any other brand in a heartbeat.

Synack
06-15-2010, 05:58 PM
I agree with LesPaulPower; When it comes to generic oxycodone instant release pills, I prefer the actavis A15's to the mallinckrodt generic... but I've don't think I've ever had the Vintage generics, although I believe I've had the Qualitest from a friend.

Assuming you get them via prescription you can always request a generic if you have a good relationship with your pharmacist.

SHELLEY
06-15-2010, 06:08 PM
Who said anything about smoking?

It's not just me, nobody I know likes the A215s and some won't buy them if that's all that is around.

It could also be that the V's are abnormally potent I guess.

well with the roxyheads that i know, the only folks that have a problem with the As
are the folks who smoke em

they all get me high

Wilshire
06-15-2010, 09:39 PM
I've been using roxis exclusively for the last two years and I've never had a problem with potency from any brand. Although, the differences I DO notice are the way they snort up the nose and the taste of them. Mallis being my personal favorite just because of flavour. Mmmmm. Heh. I'm sorry to hear that you're having troubles. I really don't know what kind of advice to give you other than eat high fat meals before you dose, smoke some (or a lot) weed, grapefruit juice, ect. Good luck.

DarthStoner
06-16-2010, 07:33 AM
I think that the A215s from about 5 years ago were stronger than the ones being produced today.

Though I've always preferred the Mallies to any other IR oxy, the 215s used to be my clear-cut 2nd favorite. Now, the only IR oxy I'd take the 215s over are those oversized 224s that have recently come out... Yuck!!!

I even think those dark blue Vs, the ones that turn your snot blue if ya sniff too many, are superior by quite a bit to the 215s... and I used to HATE those - not cause they were weak or anything, but I don't like the way they taste.

In fact, I've noticed that the darker colored IRs (15s and 30s) have a funky taste that Mallies and Oxycontins don't have - and they seem to burn a tad more too. I don't know if the funky tasting filler is related to the added burning sensation, but tegardless, I've kinda grown fond of the drip from Purdue OCs and generic Mallies, so it's always a bummer to get anything else.

As for the smoking, I was under the impression that anything but brand OCs were shitty - cause they lack the wax matrix that causes them to slide down the foil so they vaporize and don't actually burn. Personally I never got off from smoking them, but I've got friends who won't use em any other way... and they'd rather pay twice what they normally would for an 80mg Oxycontin ($30-35 vs $60) than get an IR 30 at normal rate ($14-18).

mtren
06-16-2010, 12:22 PM
I would take any other 30 over an a215. I iv it and they don't seem to work as well or give as strong a rush as the m30s or the v's. Yeah I'd basically take any other kind over these lol I hate it when they the only thing available but it still better then nothing! Don't get me wrong lol

Actavis
06-16-2010, 04:34 PM
the KVK pharma seem the strongest to me (K 9 imprint) the V's (Qualitest) have always been the weakest IMHO. whenever i have gotten the qualitest, i have to double if not triple up on what i normally take just to get out of the heebs, let alone get any pain relief.

KVK
mallinkrodt
Actavis

are the 3 best IMO. even better than brand xanodyne.

the vintage/qualitest SUCK.

there are other manufacturers i am leaving out of course

i do take them orally by the way. maybe the qualitest are ok if you go up the schnozz or other ROA's besides eating them.

Actavis
06-16-2010, 04:39 PM
I think that the A215s from about 5 years ago were stronger than the ones being produced today.

.

agreed! i think they were much stronger before our wonderful DEA/FDA made actavis stop production in 2008. when they came back in march 2009 they seemed a bit weaker.

jersey_emt
06-16-2010, 08:40 PM
I think that the A215s from about 5 years ago were stronger than the ones being produced today.

agreed! i think they were much stronger before our wonderful DEA/FDA made actavis stop production in 2008. when they came back in march 2009 they seemed a bit weaker.

I was able to directly compare them.

http://forum.opiophile.org/showthread.php?t=25465

Shadowsblaze
06-16-2010, 08:58 PM
I was wondering if their was a saturation point with snorting Roxi's when I was getting A-215's but found that the it was the gelling factor of the pill. It seems they hold the active ingredient within it and don't allow it to be absorbed in the nose readily.

Cleaning the nose with a lot of water and Q-tip will allow for using one after another but you don't get the full amount up the nose. Getting mallies now and there is no problem with using one after another without a lot of rinseing and getting it all intranasally. And I think the A-215 are stronger.

Logistics
06-17-2010, 12:35 AM
I prefer the mallies for some reason but the A215's never seemed any weaker.

Raekwon
06-18-2010, 10:42 PM
I made a thread about the A 215's a long time ago, complaining about how i noticed a difference between the Activis from before the shutdown and the A's after they came back. And as i recall Jersey_Emt compared a A from before and a A from after the shutdown and they were exactly the same. But imho when the A's disappeared and i started doing the malli's more often i prefer them over the Activis, especially when I IV them, Since the A's do this weird clumpy thing when i put in water with the powder.

seven10kids
06-19-2010, 01:48 PM
its a mental thing because the mallies have more binder in them. That is all. I have people that try to justify one being better than the other, but most of the time they just say that whatever one they filled for that month is better because that is what they have. When they get the "A"s they call the other ones mellinCRAP and when they get the m'crts they call the "A"s ass or whatever. Stupid kids.

panda
06-20-2010, 03:09 AM
me and a few friends always liked the A215's the best. i dunno, i have not gotten high on them since they shut down and came back. there was a rumor around here that they were putting to much oxy in each pill, so the government shut them down.

when i picked up and seen a bag/bottle/hand full of the a215's i was very very happy. when i seen the mallies, i was like "it could be worse". when i seen the white fuckers, i was like "this is the worst".

i seen one of the little blue a215's the other day and just looked at him for a few minutes and remembered the good times we used to have.....then the bad times that followed shortly after.

ox-e
07-10-2010, 04:50 PM
without reading the rest of the thread, I do feel A215's are weak or somewhat inferior compared to others. At least as far as snorting goes. I snorted 17 a215's over the course of an hour and just barely felt a body high. I was completely "what the fucked", so i sucked the coating off 2 oc80s and snorted 1, smoked the other and instantly nodded out. Maybe eating A215's might be a better route to go, but i would not snort them imo its a total waste. As for other methods(dont smoke a215's they aren't what they used to be)

Lourdes
07-10-2010, 05:19 PM
I would take any other 30 over an a215. I iv it and they don't seem to work as well or give as strong a rush as the m30s or the v's. Yeah I'd basically take any other kind over these lol I hate it when they the only thing available but it still better then nothing! Don't get me wrong lol

I thought it was just me! I IV them too and I have ALWAYS noticed that the A's don't give me a rush.. Only the V's and M's.. But the M's give me the best rush out of all of them. I never shoot the a's anymore.

harmonik
07-10-2010, 05:28 PM
without reading the rest of the thread, I do feel A215's are weak or somewhat inferior compared to others. At least as far as snorting goes. I snorted 17 a215's over the course of an hour and just barely felt a body high. I was completely "what the fucked", so i sucked the coating off 2 oc80s and snorted 1, smoked the other and instantly nodded out. Maybe eating A215's might be a better route to go, but i would not snort them imo its a total waste. As for other methods(dont smoke a215's they aren't what they used to be)
jesus dude, you snorted 17 pills over the course of an hour? no wonder you didn't get high -- all but a few of them went into your fucking stomach! when you swallowed that drip... what the fuck was that like? like swallowing a gram of talcum?

seriously, find a needle or something and use 'em right!
kidding, of course. but don't blame it on the a215s... I seem to get higher than hell when I blast any amount of those fuckers compared to anything else. And I've had my fair share of brands..

I miss the a215s so bad... obviously the distributor that provides IRs to the pharmacy hasn't been getting a215s in a while.. or something. :(

the good doctor
07-10-2010, 06:16 PM
Actavis was always one of my favorite brands when oxycodone was around and it was cheap. I'd never pay more than $5-7 for a 30, dope is too economical at that point, but sometimes I liked to have some shit to eat or sniff, say, at school or work, when fixing up isn't something I'd want to be doing, and I had to face the fact that dope isn't worth a shit eaten and not much better sniffed. Unlike most, I never made the "jump" to the H-train: my first opioid experience was with a $10 stamp of Chicago's Finest. My experience of brands of oxycodone is limited to A|215 (Actavis), M|30 (Mallinckrodt), and ETH|446 (unknown).

The best oxycodones I ever had were rock-hard (good binders), cooked up nice and fine in solution, no cloudiness after minimal filtering, broke down nicely for sniffing, and kicked in like a mule no matter how you got them in you. They were by far the strongest I ever had.. they had the imprint ETH|446 with a stylized "E" (kind of like a backwards "3"). I'm not sure who made them, but they were the best.. some of that might have had to do with getting a bottle of 120 for $300 though, and I hadn't been using for very long at all (this was eight or ten years ago, and two blues necked made me nod for 3-4 hours).

Mallinckrodt was always second-grade for oxycodone for me. I bought a bunch of Mallinckrodt Vicodins once (M357) because I got a good deal ($50 for 90), and I had to extract every last one of those motherfuckers and STILL did not get a decent high. My tolerance was never that high, so I must conclude that Mallinckrodt hydrocodone is about as effective as horse shit for the treatment of dopesickness. Their oxycodone was a little better.

But no pharmaceutical ever manufactured on the face of the planet will ever be as good as Dilaudid imprint K4. I've not seen them in a good few years - I'm not sure if they're made anymore - but they were the slam to slam....

And no pharmaceutical ever manufactured on the face of the planet is ever going to be as bad as anything manufactured by TEVA or MYLAN: they are the asshole of the world's pharmaceutical industry. I dare say a 2mg MYLAN clonazepam is about half the strength of a WATSON generic and about 0.4 the strength of a K-PUNCH (ROCHE) Klonopin, and the Mylan lorazepam is even shittier: it may be equal to 1/3 a Watson generic or 0.4 of an A-CUT (WYETH) Ativan. Everything Teva has ever made that I have used sucks, period, from anti-depressants, to opioids, to benzodiazepines, to fucking Thorazine. Mylan similarly fucks up anything that touches their pill-presses: you could put ten Purdue OxyContin 80mg tablets on the Mylan or Teva pill presses and get a single Vicodin back.

The only generics I have ever found stronger than name-brand are Watson lorazepam, imprint WATSON|242|2, Watson diazepam, imprint DAN|5619|5, and Vintage carisoprodol, imprint 2140|V and Mutual Pharma carisoprodol, imprint MP|58. Now that I think about it, every generic Soma is stronger than name-brand... does brand Soma even exist?

All of those pill imprints are from memory, some nearly ten years old (the Somas). Shit on anyone who tells me I don't have an eidetic memory again.

jersey_emt
07-11-2010, 12:54 PM
The best oxycodones I ever had were rock-hard (good binders), cooked up nice and fine in solution, no cloudiness after minimal filtering, broke down nicely for sniffing, and kicked in like a mule no matter how you got them in you. They were by far the strongest I ever had.. they had the imprint ETH|446 with a stylized "E" (kind of like a backwards "3"). I'm not sure who made them, but they were the best.. some of that might have had to do with getting a bottle of 120 for $300 though, and I hadn't been using for very long at all (this was eight or ten years ago, and two blues necked made me nod for 3-4 hours).


These are made by Ethex.


Now that I think about it, every generic Soma is stronger than name-brand... does brand Soma even exist?

Yes, it does. Meda Pharmaceutical makes brand Soma in 350mg and 250mg dosages.

TrackStar
07-11-2010, 02:22 PM
Yea, the A215s kinda suck now.... They may have restructured the pill or something because they gel up a little bit now, and I dont remember them doing that before. I banged 3 of them about a month ago and it definately didn't feel like I did 90 mg of oxy... more like 40. So yea, I personally think the A215s are weaker.

jersey_emt
07-11-2010, 11:54 PM
Yea, the A215s kinda suck now.... They may have restructured the pill or something because they gel up a little bit now, and I dont remember them doing that before. I banged 3 of them about a month ago and it definately didn't feel like I did 90 mg of oxy... more like 40. So yea, I personally think the A215s are weaker.

They were not reformulated.

http://forum.opiophile.org/showthread.php?t=25465

DarthStoner
07-12-2010, 12:57 AM
I know that pills are not exact in their mg count - like it's more of a "ball park" figure, than an exact science. I don't have the specific numbers, but I know that each pill has to fall within a range of their quoted mg count - so a 30mg oxy could be as low as 28mgs or as high as 32mgs (this is a generalized example, since I'm not sure how much leeway they have).

But it kinda makes me wonder if certain companies shoot for the lower number, cause I recently grabbed a mixed bag of A214s (the 15mg version of A215), and green 15mg Mallies - cause there were no 30s available, not by choice - and thought that the Mallies were noticibly stronger than the 214s.

This didn't surprise me, since I think Mallies (15s&30s) are better than the As, but you would think that if a company was shooting for a 30mg pill, while some would be slightly stronger/weaker they'd pretty much even out in the end.

But when I got these 15s, I did 4 Mallies at a time and they seemed more or less equal to 2 30s - maybe a little weaker, but I did take them in a slightly different manner and there is more buffer. However, I did 4 A214s about 8 hours later (after work) in the same way, and these felt significantly weaker - I did an extra 214 (5 total) and thought that was about where I should've been with 4.

This got me thinking that maybe the producers of the A214s and 215s purposely aim for the lowball mg count, whereas other companies actually try to hit their quoted mg count. It just seems like the 215s are consistantly weaker than other IR oxys, and it was never more evident than when using the 214s - cause if you're trying to hit 15mgs, while some pills will be stronger/weaker, they should even out in the end.

I got a bunch of 15s in that mixed bag (24 A214s/16 Mallies) and never once did I do a hit of 214s (2-3 pills/per hit) that seemed stronger than the Mallies... In fact, I did 2.5 Mallies in one sniff, and 3 214s in another a couple hours later, and thought the Mallies were noticibly stronger.

motox7
07-12-2010, 12:58 AM
I consider the fact that people actually think one or the other is "better" as placebo. ;)

Shadowsblaze
07-12-2010, 01:22 AM
I kind of agree with Motox that there is a placebo effect, but if you don't work with the pills they will affect you measurably different. The Mallies are bigger with more filler that will cover more membrane and allow less absorption. Where as they clean out easier and more can be taken right away.

But I think by weight the A-215's are stronger because they burn more but there gel is stickier and harder to remove. And a big nose is a nice addition to any face so if cosmetic surgery is in your future keep that in mind.

motox7
07-12-2010, 01:45 AM
hey your right! snorting shouldnt be looked down upon! you can always get a new septum!

sweetpain
07-12-2010, 01:48 AM
Illadelph-I have to agree with you. At first, I thought it was a tolerance issue with the A's. But recently, I did an experiment. I got a 30mg A and Y and a bunch of 30mg M's (around here, we call em Mbox) and they are my favorite so I bought extra on these.

I tried all three-A's, Y's, and M's. First, I took a 30mg A; I waited a couple hours and felt nothing. So, I tried a 30mg Y; I felt it, but noticed (as usual) it messed up my stomach. Later on that evening (around 6 hours later and way after the Y had worn off), I did the M(box) and got off great, no upset stomach, just a smooth energetic high. I leaned my room, ran the vacuum, did a couple loads of clothes (the usual when I do M's). I felt great and had lots of energy.

I don't know why, because I used to get off on the A's, but not any more. The M's are my favorite.

Shadowsblaze
07-12-2010, 01:52 AM
Or a double septum, and go for that Jimmy Durante look. "That's not a banana, that's my nose."

jersey_emt
07-12-2010, 02:38 PM
I know that pills are not exact in their mg count - like it's more of a "ball park" figure, than an exact science. I don't have the specific numbers, but I know that each pill has to fall within a range of their quoted mg count - so a 30mg oxy could be as low as 28mgs or as high as 32mgs (this is a generalized example, since I'm not sure how much leeway they have).

This got me thinking that maybe the producers of the A214s and 215s purposely aim for the lowball mg count, whereas other companies actually try to hit their quoted mg count.

Your 28 mg - 32 mg example is actually pretty accurate. They must contain +/- 7% of the stated content, or 27.9 mg - 32.1 mg.

But purposely aiming for the lower end of that range doesn't really make much sense, because it would actually end up costing more. If you aim for 30 mg, you are allowed a pretty wide tolerance (+/- 7%). However, if you aim for 28.5 mg in an attempt to save money by using less active ingredient, you must tighten your manufacturing tolerances to 2.1% in order to stay above the 27.9 mg minimum requirement.

Tighter tolerances means higher costs. Also, the amount of active ingredients in a pill generally does not affect the total cost of producing a pill. If you have less active ingredient, you need more inactives (fillers/binders/etc.). The amount of active ingredient is a relatively small part of how much money it takes to produce a single pill.

DarthStoner
07-13-2010, 12:22 PM
Your 28 mg - 32 mg example is actually pretty accurate. They must contain +/- 7% of the stated content, or 27.9 mg - 32.1 mg.

But purposely aiming for the lower end of that range doesn't really make much sense, because it would actually end up costing more. If you aim for 30 mg, you are allowed a pretty wide tolerance (+/- 7%). However, if you aim for 28.5 mg in an attempt to save money by using less active ingredient, you must tighten your manufacturing tolerances to 2.1% in order to stay above the 27.9 mg minimum requirement.

Tighter tolerances means higher costs. Also, the amount of active ingredients in a pill generally does not affect the total cost of producing a pill. If you have less active ingredient, you need more inactives (fillers/binders/etc.). The amount of active ingredient is a relatively small part of how much money it takes to produce a single pill.

I guess what I was trying to convey is say a company is aiming for a general 30mgs, they know some pills can be over by a couple mgs or under - but they'd rather have pills average 31mgs than 28 or 29mgs, so they put just a little more active ingredient into their mixture to ensure that fewer pills will end up under the 30mg mark, even if it means that a higher than average amount will be slightly over at 31 or 32mgs.

On the other hand, let's say you have a company that's been previously harassed - perhaps even temporarily shutdown - for having too much oxycodone in their pills... Maybe when they start manufacturing again they feel like they're under heavier scrutiny from the FDA and would prefer to err on the 28-29mg side of a 30mg pill, rather than on the 31-32mg side, so they put slightly less oxycodone into the mixture.

Now both will pass under the +/- law, but the former will probably yeild better "medicinal" results than the latter - especially when taking more than just a pill or two at a time.

I'm not trying to argue with you on this - not only cause I've got no evidence to back me up, but it's really only a reflection of my personal dissatisfaction with the A214s and 215s - I'm just trying to clarify what I was saying in my previous post.

It may be the placebo effect, or personal bias, but I seriously have not come across an A215 hit (2-3 pills usually) that is as strong as a Mallie or Oxycontin dose - in fact, I think an 80mg Oxycontin is as strong or stronger when sniffed than 3 A215s... Though I have to admit, the soon to be reformulated Oxycontins (40s/80s) are my favorite of the bunch - something about the formulation, I think :D.

harmonik
07-13-2010, 12:25 PM
Though I have to admit, the soon to be reformulated Oxycontins (40s/80s) are my favorite of the bunch - something about the formulation, I think :D.

WHAT?!?!

1, how are they your favorite? have they been released in your locale?

2, WHY THE FUCK ARE THEY YOUR FAVORITE?! This new formulation is going to seriously impede many ROAs of users, and probably impede legitimate oral PM patients as well..

DarthStoner
07-13-2010, 01:05 PM
WHAT?!?!

1, how are they your favorite? have they been released in your locale?

2, WHY THE FUCK ARE THEY YOUR FAVORITE?! This new formulation is going to seriously impede many ROAs of users, and probably impede legitimate oral PM patients as well..


Ya got me, I misspoke - current Oxycontins pills (40/60/80mgs) are my favorite oxycodone products on the market right now - not the reformulated ones. Thanks for correcting my mistake.

As we've kinda discussed in another post, it greatly saddens me that the heavenly drip and subsequent wallop that a sniffed 80 brings on will soon be gone - possibly forever :(.

I agree with everything you said about the new formula, and hope there is an absolutely titanic outcry from legit pain patients - which hopefully results in a company wanting to capitalize on the void left by Oxycontin, and in turn the production of virtually perfect replicas of classic Oxycontin pills.

And for the record, since where I live is usually the last place to receive shipments of new things, I hope stock of this OC reformulation follows trend, and the good ones are still around for at least another year.