New way to bang MSContin

[jab]

This was posted on A.D.H today and I thought I'd pass it along here.. It's a method for banging MSContin, sans filter (that part makes me nervous). This is not related to me in anyway, but I thought some others might like to check it out too.

http://dhost.info/cdun/

Here is the text from the site.. It has images and step-by-step also.

I don?t use a filter for drawing up MS Contin. This is because the buff within Contins in not gritty. It all breaks down and is relatively beniegn, so it isn?t a problem is little amounts slip into the syringe when drawing it up. Just be careful to not draw up larger chunks as it has the tendency of plugging the needle when it cools off. As well, by not using a filter I get the maximum morphine content as I don?t have to worry about morphine getting trapped in the wax in the filter.
Here?s my method. I break down the MSContin as thoroughly as possible with a pistal/mortar routine using the bottom end of a small peeling knife (black hard rounded plastic end) in the spoon. It really breaks it down to light, fluffy power. Then I use the bottom end of the syringe?s plunger to break down even more finely the few little sand size balls that might remain.
Once it is the finest powder I can possible make, I add 130 units of water for a whole pill (each marking on syringe barrel is one unit, so that's a full syringe and another third of water). I hold the spoon with watery mixture over an electric stove (or a candle) and watch as the powder melts into the water, shaking the spoon a bit so it all breaks down thoroughly. Once it is completely melted, I put the center of the spoon directly onto the stove?s element and a quick boil begins in the middle. The boil point creates a clear liquidy pocket right in the middle of the mixture which is where I put the needle point to do the drawing up into the syringe.
I put a clean needle right in the middle of the liquid pocket and draw up the just boiled liquid. I draw up slowly enough that a strong suction current is avoided, and thus none of the gunk within the spoon gets pulled up into the barrel. Gunk might start collecting around the tip but very little actually goes inside it - only the very smallest of particles. Once all the liquid is drawn up, I withdraw the needle point from the spoon, and clean the end with a tissue, and clear any air bubbles from the syringe.
The syringe?s barrel might now be 60% full. I now add another 15 units of water into the spoon, and repeat the cooking. Again I draw up from boiled clear pocket of liquid and now the syringe might be 85% full.
I add about 15 units more of water, re-cook, and this last draw is very liquid. This is so that the liquid in the end of the syringe will easily start out of the needle as I?m shooting. I want that initial flow as I begin injecting so that the remaining thicker mixture comes out easily from the needle and any little chunks can pass out and not plug it up.
Try not to get any solid undiluted chunks of the pill?s powder into the needle while drawing up the boiled liquid. By avoiding little chunks the mixture in the syringe will stay fine when it cools and not reform into little solid chunks that might block it from passing back out the needle tip. I sometimes will prepare several fixes in a row and they remain fine and liquidy in the syringe for hours. Remember, this is even when not using a filter as long as care is employed to slowly draw up the morphine mixture so as to avoid getting any gunk into the syringe.
If I have a pill and a half crushed up in the spoon, I?d initially use 145 units of water in the first cook. Two whole MS Contin pills would take 160 units of water in the first cook. Then, depending on how much liquid is drawn into the syringe on the first pull up, I determine how much more water to add into the spoon for the second cook. But its usually no more than 20 units of water needed to ensure the second cook is appropriately liquid. Usually after the second cook/pull up the syringe is filled right to the 100 units point - leaving just enough space to flag to determine I?m in a vein.
And by the way, often I?ll be using a 29 guage ultra-fine 1 cc needle and they rarely plug. Of course, the larger, more common 28 guage needle is even less likely to plug. However, if there is a little wax plug right in the tip after you draw up the heated mixture, just a tap the needle point onto the hot stove element and the plug melts. You?ll always want to always check for any blockage by pushing up on the plunger until a little drop of the mixture appears at the tip of the needle. As long as a little drop appears in the tip of the needle when you apply a slight push on the plunger, you know the mixture is good and liquid. And therefore should easily flow out of the needle when you do your injection.

Here is the A.D.H link.. http://tinyurl.com/zj33a

[SirDonkeyPunch]

i was reading that last night, doesnt seem safe, i thought that stuff had talc in it or whatever. in any case i wouldnt want to bang anything without a filter. did he even mention the brand in his write-up / pictorial

[jab]

LOL.. what made me laugh was that he says, in the A.D.H post "On the other hand, chaulky type pills like Dilaudid totally require a filter. But name brand Purdue Frederick MS Contin and its 2 or 3 common generics definately do not."

Ah, ok, sure! :p

Interesting though, I may try it tonight, only with a filter.. But that's me.

Be safe all!!

i was reading that last night, doesnt seem safe, i thought that stuff had talc in it or whatever. in any case i wouldnt want to bang anything without a filter. did he even mention the brand in his write-up / pictorial

[SirDonkeyPunch]

reading further into it he says thinks like

"Gunk might start collecting around the tip but very little actually goes inside it - only the very smallest of particles."

And:

I want that initial flow as I begin injecting so that the remaining thicker mixture comes out easily from the needle and any little chunks can pass out and not plug it up.
Try not to get any solid undiluted chunks of the pill?s powder into the needle while drawing up the boiled liquid. By avoiding little chunks the mixture in the syringe will stay fine when it cools and not reform into little solid chunks that might block it from passing back out the needle tip

he fucking sees that there are "CHUNKS". You dont lose that much substance using a filter cotton, and theyre handy to have for withdrawal. i dont know why someone would benefit from not filtering.

[shaunclo]

This guy is a complete idiot and should be shot (if he is not dead already from all the crap he is injecting from not filtering) for giving out such wrong info.

Some gunk might get in????? WTF, that shit will get your arm amputated if done wrong, I cant believe how many people dont filter, it is just unfuckinbelievable!!!

[superman]

Just be careful to not draw up larger chunks as it has the tendency of plugging the needle when it cools off

a hot solution should never ever ever be drawn up. I agree this guy is a fucking nimrod

[jab]

I gave this a quick go and it seems to work, but I can see, like with crisping, it takes some practice.

The difference being that I drew up the solution and put it into a seperate clean spoon, then drew through a filter (though a wheel filter would be optimal). It worked good, no real complaints. The solution was clear, unlike crisping, which is nice. It was strong, so the yeild was pretty good for a first go, and there were no visible solids at all (and yes I understand that there is stuff I probably can't see in there, but I think any method suffers the same).

Again, and I want to state this clearly, I DO NOT recommend ANYONE shoot ANYTHING without filtering (unless it's desinged to be shot without filter, like the injectable morphs, etc)!! I only posted this as a different cooking techniquie to examine, and because we all like pretty pictures (especially of people doing drugs). ;)

[SirDonkeyPunch]

im only used to mallinkrodt contins. i dont think this method would work out like that so hot for those.

[jab]

im only used to mallinkrodt contins. i dont think this method would work out like that so hot for those.

Indeed, that is EXACTLY what I used, 100mg Mallinkrodt MSContin; grey coating. Cleaned the coating, followed steps, worked! Like I said, it takes some practice. The main thing is to use the slight bubbles from the heating to push aside the goopy stuff; leaving a fairly clear solution in the middle. It takes some manipulation but I'm sure I could perfect this in no time.. and probably will. :o

Also, make sure to crush them COMPLETLEY, so they are as fine as possible; no chunks. And use a big spoon, it requires a lot of water.

[SirDonkeyPunch]

so i found this interesting little tidbit of info from reading deeper into it


As well, by not using a filter I get the maximum morphine content as I don’t have to worry about morphine getting trapped in the wax in the filter.

first i thought the New ms contins used a silicone based compound to gel in the presence of water. and second of all... if you got a 100mg of morph in a spoon, and you put a filter in there after you cook. isnt there a minimal loss maybe of 5mg because of it sticking to the cotton and whatnot. In my case i wouldnt risk going blind and/or amputation, just for a small extra bit of 'phine... i always found the cotton handy to have around during w/d.

[shaunclo]

When you filter you lose a little bit always, but what is 5mg's anyways, and I agree I always save my cottons for desperate times. But I don not save my cottons from pills, I just thow em in my mouth and suck on em after I draw up. For some reason, saving cottons from a pill filtration just doesnt seem like something I wanna re-draw from.

So what I am saying is I only save my cottons from tar or powdered H, if its a pill, I just suck on the cotton.

[vanilla_mlkshake2007]

Not only is it nesscessary to always ue a filter but that sure does sound like way to much water.I say use a filter and cut down on the water and you would cut the work in half and getjust as high if not higher.
I have never IV'd without a filter>way to dangerous and also seeminI've caught cotten fever 5-6 times and gotten extremely sick I also wouldn't reccomend saving cotten balls,but I know people that have done it and never had any problems.That was what I used to do with the cottens but after the cotten fever I got aftersafely doing it several times I will never save cottens again.I just suck on them after I'm done preparing the mixture and then throw them away,but then thats a whole other great thread to read if you get the chance.

[SirDonkeyPunch]

well the more water you use the more safer it is. The inards of your body arent too keen on concentrated solutions running thru the veins. I have some 3cc boys i might have to use because.....

ITS MY BIRTHDAY TODAY! And i got awarded 3-30mg ms contins as a party favor from an old friend. now i got his number and can get a hold of him so that'll help me out. in any case i crushed and powdered 2 of them. Then i add a small bit of acetic acid (i know its kinda inconclusive, but i find a better rush when i use a small amount) and then a buncha water. and it just gelled up on me. it looked like a thin enough solution to draw up but it didnt work. and just for kicks i didnt use a filter drawing it up (i wasnt gonna slam it, ya silly goose) but it just clogged right up. i dont have a heating element and i used a lighter on the lowest setting, really far away from my cooker.

is surface area a concern here. my cookers i get from the exchange are just like bottle caps, in that their the same style. should i stoop to the spoon. I dont know but these cookers i get seem to get more outta my shots (IE, not sticking to the large surface area of a spoon). But even before i used heat it gelled up on me. so wtf. damn mallinkrodts.

[bogumil]

Are MSCOntin the capsules with the many little pillies in them?

Those can easily be prepared like this:

About 5 of the capsules are breaken open and the pillies are dropped into a little glass vial.
Water is added and HCl is added until the pH is 5 - 6.
It is left alone over night, at least 12, better 24 hours.
The clear liquid is drawn into a syringe or decanted.
It is filtered and then dried.

Thats it. The morphine goes into the aqueous, cause the pillies are made to release it into the acidic milieu in our digestion tracks. Only the pH should be below 5-6 because this would hurt tissue. PH below 3 wouldnt be good for the morphine itself...

[SirDonkeyPunch]

interesting.... perhaps the acetic acid ive been using has been acting the same way kinda as its stronger brother hcl. in any case, does that just wash the morphine out and leave it in a seperate layer. thats the visual i have in my head anyway. A lot of times when i get pills i cant hold on to em for that long....much less wait 24 hours for a good fix.

does the hcl method work with pills that have a crazy matrix, like the mallinkrodts. i tried crisping mine but i didnt do it all the way thru, and as i added water i got a nice dark brown hue (much like that of a good shot of dope) however there was still tons of goo. i need to perfect my method for crisping pills, and ill probably post it here in the morphine board.

anyone else got some experience with crispings....and can do it WELL.

[superman]

"About 5 of the capsules are breaken open and the pillies are dropped into a little glass vial.
Water is added and HCl is added until the pH is 5 - 6."

crushing the balls w/ mortar and pestle while dry is sure to make you extraction quicker than 24h and shouldn't require anything but water.

why make something so simple so complicated?

anyways, they're talking about tabs, not caps....

[Allies]

i was reading that last night, doesnt seem safe, i thought that stuff had talc in it or whatever. in any case i wouldnt want to bang anything without a filter. did he even mention the brand in his write-up / pictorial


I can understand if anyone hasn't used this method to think it could be unsafe but this is how I've been doing it for over 20 years of my life. By not using the filter the risk of cottom feaver is min. also it helps to cut the risk of hep c by saving filters over time that could end up shared off to others when sick and using what little is left in the filters.

By using the correct amount of water the fit is full but you can be sure all the morphine is in there and really ready to give you what is needed if you will.

I love this method myself...it takes practice but is worth it for not risking feaver.

P.S. He mentioned MSC a lot in his write up

Always with respect
Debs/Allies:)

[HappinessIsaWarmGun]

This guy is a complete idiot and should be shot (if he is not dead already from all the crap he is injecting from not filtering) for giving out such wrong info.

Some gunk might get in????? WTF, that shit will get your arm amputated if done wrong, I cant believe how many people dont filter, it is just unfuckinbelievable!!! I've used this method for 10 years of several shots daily. I'm still standing... :rolleyes:

Do you not think most filtering still allows a little bit of the crap that is within Contins into one's syringe. Of course it does. But if you use this method carefully you get no more crap, and you don't risk a bad hit because of some bit of the filter getting into your syringe.

Since using this method I've never had "cotton fever" from some bit of filter, whereas I averaged a hurting several hours of chills and shakes and muscle spasms every four months when I used a filter to cook my Contins.

Saving filters is an antiquated thing to do - it is an "old school" junkie thing. Yes, you have some left for a rainy day. But used cottons is what you can get REALLY BAD bacteria from.

The methad outlined in the Shooting MS Contins tutorial is clean. Nothing is added into the mixture but your dope (well crush contins) and sterile water.

I've even spoken to a couple doctors and they concur that the makeup of MS contins is pretty safe for shooting. You should just try to get the solution you shoot as liquidy as possible, rather than having a thicker makeup. So, yeah, use as much water as possible. Completely fill a 1cc syringe, or like someone said, you could even use a 3cc.

btw, for those who seem confused. The tutorial is talking about MS Contin (it says so MANY times ... hell, even in the title) http://www.purduepharma.com/PI/Prescription/MS_Contin.pdf

http://www.healthsquare.com/newrx/images/p03331a1.jpg

These were the original time release morphines??? There are now several generics on the market, but they too can be cooked up using this method. I know. And my latest physical informed me I have healthy blood ('cept for HepC) and good blood pressure, my breathing is just fine - unlike those who shoot pills that can cause chalk lung. Note - the 200mg MS Contins are usually RED (i've never seen a green 200 and the 15s are usually GREEN (i've never seen a blue) - but maybe these colours are for the US. I'm just familiar with the colours in Canada.

This is the voice of EXPERIENCE talking. Whether you want to discard what's being suggested is your right entirely.

[SirDonkeyPunch]

still i dont know.... theres probably people out there that have been skin popping black tar for 10 years without any ill effects, but its still not recommended. using a wheel filter will keep the bad stuff out and the good concoction go thru. I can understand experience is a big deal here, but i just dont understand why someone would not use a cotton. you can risk cotton fever... theres a lot less chance depending on what kinda cottons you use. i get mine from the "exchange" so i know theyre good. and the ex-junky that works there always asks "your using our cottons right?".

have you guys tried crisping the ms contins. i find that this method works a lot easier. and if you have the means i must insist you at least try it. i just have horrible experience not crisping them and just ending up with a gellatanous mess. i tried using that method and it didnt work as well as i hoped... so i lost a lot of a good potential shot. but thats what its all about.. trial and error.

Everyone is entitled to their own right to administer a drug whatever way they want. but i just try and find the most effecient safest way possible. and albeit there arent any downright SAFE methods. its up to us as users to find the best way that suits us.

BTW: i havent gotten cotton fever once from using a cotton, but then again i havent EVER used cigerette cotton

[superman]

"By not using the filter the risk of cottom feaver is min."
cotton fever is a bacterial infection, it is not from injecting a piece of cotton. you are perpetuating an ancient myth that I'm sure very few people on this forum still subscribe to. I suggest you google 'IDU safe injection manual' for other facts related to IV drug use.
==========
"I put a clean needle right in the middle of the liquid pocket and draw up the just boiled liquid."
ok, cook your hit just like this fool does, BUT, don't inject it. let it sit for several hours. you'll see that the hot water has dissolved some weird shit, and upon cooling it you will see a spider-web effect on the inside of your barrel. Morphine does not do that, it is far too soluable. This is gunk that will (probably) slowly kill you.
==========
I've slammed thousands of those pictured MS Contins. always filtered, never gotten sick. i've had cottons alone keep me high for a week+. If you dry and store them properly they are safe. If you cook your pill right it's pretty safe.
...Don't sacrifice your cardiovascular system just to get your shot faster.
...Let it cool to room temp, then push the now-hard wax out of the way.
...FILTER IT. These words are constantly repeated for a good reason.
==========
"my latest physical informed me I have healthy blood ('cept for HepC) and good blood pressure, my breathing is just fine"
Well that changes everything!
HEY EVERYBODY!!! Stop using filters! make sure your hit's above 80C before sucking it up!

[shaunclo]

Like Superman said, Cotton Fever is not from a tiny piece of cotton getting inot the rig, it is a bacterail disease that makes you ill. Not filtering is not a good idea, whether your still standing or not after not filtering all your shots is irrellevent, it just means your lucky as hell.

Not trying to be an ass here, but if you are shooting pilll, you need to filter using something.

[jab]

Somehow this turned into a big filter vs. non-filter thread.. Not what I intended.

I merely put this up as a new way to cook.. Notice I even said that *I* do use a filter with this process.

As for the crisping question, yes I've cripsed these many times, but this is a bit easier and the yeild "feals" about the same; to me.

BTW, I cooked up a shot like this and let it sit, and it did not solidify. I left it for quite a while too.

Be safe all! :D

[sister morphine]

Hey- Last night was the first time I ever tried to bang MS-contin, the 100 mg. I did 1/4 of it at first just to try it.... all I did was mix it in a cooker, crushed as much to a fine powder as I could get it, with like 30-40 cc's cold water, stirred it around with my plunger, and let it sit for 5-10 minutes.... at this point it looked like a milky liquid was some visible particles. Then I put a little more water in it, stirred it around with the plunger again, stuck a cotton filter in it, (the tiny kind you get at the exchange) and sucked up as much as I could get. What was left over in the spoon was alot of particles and gooey stuff around the cotton, but there was alot of liquid in the rig. When it was in the rig I could still see some visible particles so I just pushed it back into another cooker and filtered it again, of course with a clean cotton. After the second filtering process the liquid was clear....so I shot just that, which was still about 30 cc's of liquid, and I got a great rush from it! Then I just added a little more water to all the shit that was left over in the spoon, and repeated the process over with that, filtering it until the liquid was clear in the rig. It worked great for me, not as good as dope of course, but good enough! Actually the rush, although more short-lived, was almost as strong as a good bag of dope, but the next time I get my hands on another pill, I would do half of it at once...just make sure there are no particles in the syringe when you shoot up....I know alot of people say cook it with vinegar or some shit like that and scrape the wax off, but I think doing that you loose alot of the morphine itself and moreover I think this way is safer because of all the filtering you do...and cold water is alot... friendlier to our veins then a boiled up liquid with vinegar, citric acid, baking soda or whatever crap is used... anyway, I hope if anyone tries this mothod it worked as well for them as it did for me....

[HappinessIsaWarmGun]

If you wish to add an unnecessary adulterant (i.e. filter) into the process, then definately don't use a cigarette filter as SirDonkeyPunch pointed out.

I agree that cotton fever in its actually meaning is bacterial infection. I pointed that out previously in my second point. I also said "cotton fever" in regard to little bits of something that get into the mixture and make you sick. That is a common laize-faire usage of the term also, is it not?

The concept of "chunks" does not mean something solid in this description. It actually means something that is not fully melted. There is actually nothing solid. But the waxy stuff does solidify into a mass that can plug the needle point if care is not taken to only updrawn the well liquified.

Everything that is a component of MS Contin is drawn up into syringe regardless of using a filter. All the filter does is keep out the less liquified gunky stuff. You do not need a filter to ensure you don't draw up the less liquified portions - you just need to make sure its cooked well, has lots of water, and take care while drawing up.

I guess you can let mixture cool in spoon prior to drawing up if you wish. Or you can draw up hot, and let it cool within the syringe.

I compare the clearness of what's in my syringe with many people who filter, and trust me, what's in my syringe is alot clearer. But that's because I take care.

If you actually think that filtering is keeping out something substantial in terms of what's the makeup of an MS Contin, give it some more thought. It all breaks down into a liquid when heated. Filtering does not keep out any of the components, but only the gunky composition of them. But, as I said, you can keep that gunky composition out just as well without using a filter.

And without a filter, there is one less potentially harmful thing within your spoon in the first place. Some pills ABSOLUTELY need filtering... and yes, some don't.

Yes, you will get the spider-web effect if you don't take care in what you draw up. In other words, some stuff re-solidifying after cooling. But again, filtering does not guarentee keeping that from happening. It is the care you take in what you pull up in the first place. I make lots of pre-cooks for trips and they don't cool with stuff adhering to the edges of the barrel.

I entirely agree that if you're going to keep your filters, then take care with them and keep them properly stored like Superman sez.

Luckily the body ultimately breaks down and excretes the stuff that is the components of a Contin. So regardless of how much crap you end up getting into your bloodstream, it doesn't have a collection point where it builds up. The body breaks it down, absorbs it, and it ultimately leaves your body one way or the other.

[SirDonkeyPunch]

Luckily the body ultimately breaks down and excretes the stuff that is the components of a Contin. So regardless of how much crap you end up getting into your bloodstream, it doesn't have a collection point where it builds up. The body breaks it down, absorbs it, and it ultimately leaves your body one way or the other.


i know part of that is true, the body can break down some of it... but theres plenty of instances where the makeup of a pill, whether filtered or not, can be really dangerous. especially if u accidently miss.

[Adormidera]

I have shot these for years using cottons (which after a couple bouts of fever I stopped saving) but not filters (don't know how to get those without an exchange nearby) and have had no problems, which I agree doesn't prove anything, but thought I'd add my $.02.

Letting it cool in the spoon is not a bad idea.

"Are MSCOntin the capsules with the many little pillies in them?"

Those sound like Kadian or Avinza. MS Contin are tabs not caps.

The Endo generic of MS Contin is a little trickier to shoot, but I find if powdered and mixed well the waxy additive crap forms a skin on top that can be flipped back to reveal nice clear liquid that leaves no residue when it cools. Even so, I use a cotton when drawing it just for ease of getting it into the syringe. Then the residue can be recooked once or twice for another (weaker) shot.