o- desmethyl tramadol

[codemeister3]

Dosage? BL doesn't know, and there isn't much info on this one. An opiate though??? Man, this one is going to go wild. I am sure interested.

List facts please. Including dosage, duration, and effect similarities.

(Updated info)

Half life is approximately 9 hours.

"(-)-O-desmethyltramadol retains activity as a noradrenaline reuptake inhibitor" - That means it will have somewhat of a stimulant effect like Kratom or reg tramadol. Thats assuming that the procudt being sold is (-) and not (+). Actually, its probably a combination of the two since u would have to try to get just one or the other.

Looks like its three times more potent. Off of BlueLight
"It's about 3 times more potent."

So that would mean that dosage range should be about 50-133mg, right? I would guess so. So that means a good allergy test would be about 2mg and a good starting dose until we can get that established would be 1/4th that, 12.5mg. (This is all assuming that this really is desmethyl tramadol and not BromoDfly....) Just because of what has happened recently; if we can't get it tested to make sure its real then starting out at 500micrograms is probably smartest, then working up slowly from there.

So, who wants to be the guinea pig? I would love to try this for sure, but after the BD incident I don't think I will be the first to try anything anymore.

[Paregoric Kid]

you know this wouldn't fall under the analog act I don't think. I really doubt they could say its an analog of tapentadol when its clearly an analog of an uncontrolled substance. it is DEFINITELY an opioid. I believe it also retains some SSRI properties. also it may have antagonist actions on the 5-HT2C[/URL] receptor. Antagonism of 5ht2c could be partially responsible for Tramadol's reducing effect on depressive and OCD symptoms in patients with pain and co-morbid neurological illnesses. and it is safe just watch your dosing, I imagine there is no dose ceiling unlike tramadol. though you may need to try and counteract any excess norepinephrine effects. not asking for a source but how did this material come about? an overseas manufacturer or domestically synthesized?
yeah it probably is a racemic mix as they probably started with racemic tramadol. here is some info on the isomers of tramadol:
(1R,2R)-(+)-[URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enantiomer"]enantiomer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5-HT2C) is approximately four times more potent than the (1S,2S)-(–)-enantiomer in terms of μ-opioid receptor (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opioid_receptor#The_.CE.BC-opioid_receptor) affinity and 5-HT (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5-HT) reuptake, whereas the (1S,2S)-(–)-enantiomer is responsible for noradrenaline reuptake effects (Shipton, 2000). These actions appear to produce a synergistic analgesic effect, with (1R,2R)-(+)-tramadol exhibiting 10-fold higher analgesic activity than (1S,2S)-(–)-tramadol (Goeringer et al., 1997).

[nick]

Enjoy,but it's kinda hard to get excited about tramadol in any form.

[codemeister3]

Lol, I have been told that on a few of my major forums now. "Who cares about tramadol???"

I think it has th chance to be an ok opiate. I guess I will just have to be one of the first. Yes though, it is from an overseas source in thailand.

As for the 4 times as potent, I am assuming that is the - isomer in purity. I am imagining that this shoud be at best 3 times as potent (supposed to be in between codeine and morphine in potency, so better than "just tramadol"). I am not a chemist by any means nor have I taken many chemistry courses. If anyone else knows much more plz inform me. I know this would be fun though! If not for the reasons I stated.

Everyone look out, this is easily findable on google :D (without the spaces (thats was not to draw attention to this forum))

[jacky]

my wife and I used to love tramadol.

a certian company used to sell it without prescription, in powder form.

I used it several times to detox off of oxy's.

some people dont react favourably to it.

check out tramadol compared to effexor...very, VERY similiar structure....although effexor seems much more potent as a stimulant.

it would be one of my top considerations if I was addicted to an opiate other than methadone and I needed to ween or get off of narcotics.
most people probably wouldnt do well with the substance...but for us, it was a lifesaver.

both of us had at least a 200 milligram oxy a day habit....
we weened down to 150 milligrams...
and then quit and started taking tramadol....

I didnt lose a day of work....didnt have major sickness, and after the third day, started realizing that I was feeling better than I should.
by day 4-5, we both felt energy, happy, and euphoric.

weening off of tramadol was far easier than any other opioid I have been addicted to. we weened off of tramadol in a few weeks with literally no meds other than herbs.

it was FAR easier for me to ween off of tramadol than methadone.

I am probably mistaken...but I thought o- desmethyl tramadol was an active metabolite of tramadol.

for maintenance...I think tramadol is a great substance for me...very low sexual side effects noticed.
I didnt need to dose in the middle of the night, like with kratom, hydro, or heroin.
all in all, this compound effects me like an ADHD med, an anti depressant, and a maintenance opioid all in one.
its a combination that many people find unacceptable though.
and there is a report on erowid this week of someone having siezures from just 150 milligrams of tram.

I do like how easy it is to get tramadol scripted.
although in the beginning...most Dr's were treating tramadol as a non narcotic. fucking idiotic.
also, at the same time, they were pushing effexor for opiate addicts...thinking that it just worked well for them, and not realizing that it had opioid activity as well.
I know at least 5 females that became severly addicted to effexor without being told it had habit forming potential, and had opioid activity.
really, the chem companys, the pharms, the doctors should have guessed that these compounds might present a problem for some people.

I guess I need to do some reading on this particular compound posted....is it really being sold by research chem companys?
to the general public?

this class of compound seems to hold potential for 1-2 out of 10 junkies....
many cant stand tramadol or effexor.
but for me, getting clean, I was more than happy to take effexor, which initially feels much like cocaine to me.

[Papa Verine]

I've always been a fan of Tramadol too. Before I had an opiate tolerance Tramadol felt just like any other opioid to me. Later on, with a much bigger heroin habit, it wasn't so pleasant. I seemed to feel some unwanted side-effects and no opiate-like effects. But, considering it is a weak opioid with other neurotransmitter activity, it makes sense.

I'd love to try this more potent metabolite. Especially as a withdrawal/detox aid.

[Paregoric Kid]

yeah jacky it is the primary active metabolite of tramadol, in fact some consider tramadol a prodrug because of how much stronger the M1 (o-desmethyl) metabolite is. there was some research done on it for use as a potential new opioid but I think they ended up releasing tapentadol. o-desmethyltramadol is much more potent and like I said it doesn't have such a low dose ceiling as tramadol and not nearly the same amount of issues with serotonin reuptake.

[Paregoric Kid]

is this pure or are you talking about Krypton Kratom. has anyone heard of Krypton Kratom, it allegedly actually contains o-desmethyltramadol. apparently the same German lab that analyzed the Spice products and determined they contained synthetic cannabinoids determined Krypton Kratom to be essentially caffeine and o-desmethyltramadol.

[OverDriven]

I like tramadol with another strong opiate. Pods + 200mg tramadol feels very much like oxy to me, but lasts much longer. Very nice, but it only works well if you don't do it very often. 2-3 days in a row with tramadol and I can't really feel the euphoric stimulant effects anymore. I have a feeling it's because the body starts running low on serotonin reserves, which take a few days to regenerate completely.

Anyways...the metabolite sounds interesting, but there is one big concern. As you know, tramadol is known to cause grand mal seizures in moderate doses (over 400mg per day or more depending on the person). If this is 3 times stronger than tramadol, I would be concerned that it is also a stronger seizure inducer. Anyone have info on this? If it was stronger but didn't have the seizure inducing effects, well that would rock IMO. I highly doubt that's the case though.

[dieselbaby]

is this pure or are you talking about Krypton Kratom. has anyone heard of Krypton Kratom, it allegedly actually contains o-desmethyltramadol. apparently the same German lab that analyzed the Spice products and determined they contained synthetic cannabinoids determined Krypton Kratom to be essentially caffeine and o-desmethyltramadol.

Yes, I have heard of this several times as well. A well-known web RC vendor just started stocking this o-desmethyl tramadol. I have no interest in opiates whatsoever anymore, so funny that something like this comes about when I have no need for it. Insane shit going on in the RC/legal drugs world the past few months.

[Citricburn]

Enjoy,but it's kinda hard to get excited about tramadol in any form.

lol

[doctor diesel]

Could one of you chem guys answer this for me? If a particular chem - say tramadol - is broken down by your liver to a metabolite that is stronger than the original chem - say o- desmethyl tramadol, or in the case of heroin, 6-MAM - is the greater strength of this metabolite actually of relevance?
What I'm asking is whether that resulting metabolite, once created by liver process, then has any psychoactive influence on the body, or whether it's just then lined up as waste.
If it's NOT of use then would it be desirable to collect it in one's piss, single it out (if that were possible) and re-use it by whatever ROA makes the most sense?
Please explain what the exact role of the metabolite is.


Doc

[Paregoric Kid]

it gets metabolized and enters the bloodstream. this is how codeine is active. there is a lot more to it and depending on urinary pH it can enter the blood again I think.

[Paregoric Kid]

from people I've talked to who have used this and from what I've read it says it is 4-8x stronger than regular tramadol. if you need 400mg of tramadol to feel any effects then something that is 4x stronger the dose would be 100mg. so I would say if you have an opioid tolerance maybe 75-100mg would be a good starting dose and go from there.