1 week clean today

[oxy kid]

Pretty stoked, 1 week clean today. My last dose was actually last thursday morning at 8AM.

I've had the help of a few benzos, couple somas (literally 2 nights before bed, 1 soma) loperamide, and clonidine.

I'm feeling much better than I was earlier in the week, so things are coming around. I never really did take much benzos, maybe 1-2mgs of kpin & xan a day and I've tapered off that completely. Does it still count if i've been taking loperamide? Should I taper the loperamide or just stop taking it? I've been taking it this week and thats it.

Wow, on the other side of things I never thought I'd actually make it to a week of soberness.

[upstate_007]

Congrats! It's not an easy thing to do.

As for the loperamide...........you might want to taper down depending on how much you have been taking.

[wisegal]

Is this going to be a permanent thing for you? Or is it just temp. to reduce tolerance or something?

just curious. either way, Congrats & Good Luck!

[Duckfeet]

I'm not sure about the benzoes and the loperamide, hell it took me decades just to get off opiates: best wishes to you in this...I know what a struggle it can be and how tenacious you have to be to hang in there...

Pretty stoked, 1 week clean today. My last dose was actually last thursday morning at 8AM.

I've had the help of a few benzos, couple somas (literally 2 nights before bed, 1 soma) loperamide, and clonidine.

I'm feeling much better than I was earlier in the week, so things are coming around. I never really did take much benzos, maybe 1-2mgs of kpin & xan a day and I've tapered off that completely. Does it still count if i've been taking loperamide? Should I taper the loperamide or just stop taking it? I've been taking it this week and thats it.

Wow, on the other side of things I never thought I'd actually make it to a week of soberness.

[GOLD N DIEMONDS]

"Does it still count if i've been taking loperamide?"
Nope - IMHO you clean on loperamide, just comfort med and really a necessary one for general health concerns whilst kicking,
shitting one brain and everything else out for a few days can easily lead to to body dehydration, NOT GOOD
Taper off the loperamide, like cutting dosage by 1/3 every 3 days
CONGRADS- THATS HUGE
yeah longterm goals???

[oxy kid]

Thanks for the compliments.

I've been taking about 20mgs of loperamide a day. 10mgs 2X daily. It may all be in my head, but I feel like it is helping out. I've been waking up each morning in really mild w/ds, (teary eyes, maybe a little achy) and by the time I've had my shower and taken the lope, I feel good to go.

As far as what wisegal is asking, I want to be able to live a happy, successful and pain free life. And if I can do that without opiates, thats what I want to do. There are many different things in my life that don't go hand in hand with my previous use, so I had to straighten myself out before I could move forward with anything else.

I'm going to start a loperamide and clonidine taper today. Hopefully by Thursday or Friday of next week, I won't have to take a single med.



"Does it still count if i've been taking loperamide?"
Nope - IMHO you clean on loperamide, just comfort med and really a necessary one for general health concerns whilst kicking,
shitting one brain and everything else out for a few days can easily lead to to body dehydration, NOT GOOD
Taper off the loperamide, like cutting dosage by 1/3 every 3 days
CONGRADS- THATS HUGE
yeah longterm goals???

What all would go along with that? Obviously I havn't had the best appetite, so I havn't been eating a ton. I've been trying to drink a ton of fluids to prevent dehydration. I'll start on the lope taper today. Any suggestions on what to do with one of the major side effects that hinders you from something after taking loperamide numerous days in a row?

[upstate_007]

Thanks for the compliments.

I've been taking about 20mgs of loperamide a day. 10mgs 2X daily. It may all be in my head, but I feel like it is helping out. I've been waking up each morning in really mild w/ds, (teary eyes, maybe a little achy) and by the time I've had my shower and taken the lope, I feel good to go.

As far as what wisegal is asking, I want to be able to live a happy, successful and pain free life. And if I can do that without opiates, thats what I want to do. There are many different things in my life that don't go hand in hand with my previous use, so I had to straighten myself out before I could move forward with anything else.

I'm going to start a loperamide and clonidine taper today. Hopefully by Thursday or Friday of next week, I won't have to take a single med.

The loperamide can definitely help. To some degree. In my opinion.......it's mostly a mental benefit. It can slow down the shits, but it aint heroin.

If it's working for you one way or another, that's awesome! Taper down as you feel comfortable with and take it from there. Bottom line, stopping the lope isn't even in the fucking same galaxy as stopping whatever you were strung out on before.

[Thai_Stick]

Wow, lots of respect for this. You seem very serious and conscientious and excited about being clean, that's great.

I don't understand your question... You're worried about taking a huge dump? Any opiate constipation remedy will work for loperamide induced constipation. How about the boxcar method? Theres a sticky about it somewhere. You're probably worse off now than you were while using, so be careful. Don't wanta blow an o-ring.

[chopstix]

Congrats. First week is hard, for me it's when I start feeling better (second week) that I usually fuck up.. If you have some sort of exercise you're into, I'd suggest getting busy stat, exercise really helps kick in natural endorphins..

Old junky told me once as I was copping a bag on the way to a program: "Getting clean is the easy part, staying clean is what's really hard."

He was right.

[oxy kid]

Congrats. First week is hard, for me it's when I start feeling better (second week) that I usually fuck up.. If you have some sort of exercise you're into, I'd suggest getting busy stat, exercise really helps kick in natural endorphins..

Old junky told me once as I was copping a bag on the way to a program: "Getting clean is the easy part, staying clean is what's really hard."

He was right.

Couldn't agree more with you on that. I've been trying to do a lot of exercising, getting involved with some new stuff. I really have a lot of motivation to keep this going, and I'm GOING to stay clean.

[GOLD N DIEMONDS]

Yeah Lots of fluid- Gatoraide helps. Dehydration can happen very quickly and take days of hydration to bring back, most of the body fluids are absorbed going through ass pipage (medical term:).
Ah personal question what is dumpage situation like now?
Lots of threads her on consipation, evryone seems to have their "own" perfer method,
but YES to exercise+, stuff like celary and shredded wheat ceral (cheap) -and can even taper lope. quicker- cut off 1/3 a day for 3-4 days

GOOD LUCK- GOOD ATUTIDE GOES LONG LONG WAY
Getting laid helps too++++

vm -EII for details there :D

[duck]

Nice Work!! My envy is so crushing it's inspiring!! What were DOC were you on prior?

[oxy kid]

Nice Work!! My envy is so crushing it's inspiring!! What were DOC were you on prior?

Ha thanks man...i feel like I have ran a marathon or something....ha. Ive been doing the bupe thing for about 1.5 years, so thats the biggest accomplishment in my mind. But way before that, the DOC would be oxy and morph.

[SHELLEY]

good work friend :)

[JTDuffet]

Congrats, sounds like your making some really good progress, and definitely inspiring to the rest of us who think of getting clean, but haven't had the luck or willpower to do it.

nice job... and keep it up.

-jt

[oxy kid]

I'm not gonna lie, it sucks trying to get clean no doubt....but time flies by. One minute your born, the next minute there putting you in the ground. So I thought if I really wanted clean time, the small amount of time it would take to get to that point in the whole scheme of things, I should be able to do it. I still have a long way to go, but I feel like I'm on the right track.

[Indy]

For me, though it's been a long time since i did a serious kick, loperamide really took away a lot of the withdrawal symptoms, but they didn't come back when i went off the loperamide. It doesn't make sense, you'd think if it was the opioid activity that helped the withdrawal, it would come back when you stop taking it. But that's the way it always worked for me. when i get home i'll have to look up if there's any new info on loperamide megadosing, i haven't done that in a while.

[HandMeSomeOpiates]

Man that's great news bro!! I'm a week clean myself.:drinkit: Just using kratom. If I could just get away from my source(FREE opiates...yeah tell me if that ain't hard), I know I could beat this thing. I think about getting clean EVERY SINGLE TIME I detox. It's a mothafuckin cycle every month. Use for 2 weeks, off for 2 weeks, use for 2 weeks, off for 2 weeks. Every time I think this is it man, I'm past w/d feeling alright, and then I look at the date...opiate time. I just wish I could erase the memory of the euphoria, the memory of the ever so welcoming warm blanket that wraps around me, the memory of that voice saying every thing is OK. That voice is a fuckin liar man. Kind of reminds me of that move "Sunshine of the spotless mind" with Jim Carrey where they can erase your memories. Why haven't they fuckin invented that. Erase my fuckin memory of these opiates. Anyway, I just wanted to say, do it kid, fucking do it! Show mothafuckers like me it can be done. You can enjoy and have a better life w/o opiates. DO IT MAN! I'm sure as hell pulling for ya bro!

[oxy kid]

Thanks for the words of encouragement. This is no doubt the best time to be getting them. Handmesomeopi's, stick with it brother. you'll make it. In a month me and you can sit here and talk about how we've been clean a month. That'll be great. I'm just sick of having something rule my life...im done with it. I too wish I could erase that memory of euphoria....but when I start thinking about that, the next thing I think of is laying in the bed going from hot to cold and RLS and aching all over...

The psychological part is been kinda hard on me. Just can't quit thinking about the damn things.

[The_Highwayman]

great job kid, keep up the good work..happy for you!!!!

[HandMeSomeOpiates]

The psychological part is been kinda hard on me. Just can't quit thinking about the damn things.
NO DOUBT BRO!

If it wasn't for that I would be +years clean right now.........

[oxy kid]

I don't know why, but it seems like towards the end of today, I've started feeling a little worse. I cut back the loperamide from 10mg 2x a day to 8mg 2x a day and I just took my second dose. I've been a little nauseated and couldn't hold down a ton of food tonight, but I had a good lunch and have been drinking a ton of gatorade and water keeping my fluids up. I cut back on the clonidine also today. I had been wearing a .1mg/day patch and took it off this morning, and took 1/2 of a .1mg tablet about 2 hours ago. I just feel kind of crappy. I know I still have a long road ahead, and its only been 7 days, but does anybody have any suggestions? I'm just gonna stick with it and wait to feel better.

Have any suggestions on foods I could get to be able to hold down and get enough of the stuff that gets you through the day?

I'm probably about to walk down to a bar or two and drink a few and I know that will temorarily make me feel better. I'm not getting smashed because I could imagine that waking up with a major hangover (which I really don't get very much anymore) after 1 week of clean time wouldnt feel that great. It would probably have me dialing the phone, calling somebody that I don't need to be calling.

[bigNasty]

Maybe try some herbal shit cause you know how pills always make you feel better, right? But seriously, the ritual of taking a pill might make you feel better. Like right now your mind has tricked you to feel bad cause you cut back on the clonidine and loperamide.

Take ZMA and melatonin or valerian at night to sleep. Then take some Ginseng in the morning and after lunch to give you some energy throughout the day. And take a multi-vitamin everyday since you're not eating much. And if you feel up to it, the best thing to do is EXERCISE early in the day before you start feeling shitty. That will get your natural endorphins back pumping

[oxy kid]

Maybe try some herbal shit cause you know how pills always make you feel better, right? But seriously, the ritual of taking a pill might make you feel better. Like right now your mind has tricked you to feel bad cause you cut back on the clonidine and loperamide.

Take ZMA and melatonin or valerian at night to sleep. Then take some Ginseng in the morning and after lunch to give you some energy throughout the day. And take a multi-vitamin everyday since you're not eating much. And if you feel up to it, the best thing to do is EXERCISE early in the day before you start feeling shitty. That will get your natural endorphins back pumping


I actually got a lot of exercise in last night and felt great the rest of the night. Didn't even think about any meds. Went to bed without any. It was great. Exercise seems to be the key to this right now. I wish I could just get my self up and go run a couple miles at least. Lack of motivation makes it hard to exercise. ha.

[More Feen]

Its good to focus on the negative crap--RLS, craving etc..., to keep from using again.

Just remember if you slip and use, don't let it get you down, but I don't think you will.

You're gonna stick with it and when you're tempted, you'll remember the insomnia and the jimmy-legs and avoid it.

I miss using too, but the longer you're away from, it gets a fraction easier to put it out of your mind. Again, I'm only 2-3 weeks out so, I ain't in the clear.

M F

[God_Albino]

man i look at anyone who can make that plunge in a new light, even though some people can kick dozens of times and it seems like a regular part of this life, i'm so fucking scared of going without again, this is refreshing.

major fucking congrats, i've got a little more courage built up pushing me toward the detox brink after reading this thread. i hope you got the strength to do whatever your intended life purpose is, even if youve gotta go back to opiates at some point in the process.

[More Feen]

You know, sometimes people are forced to quit (jail would be the worst), some people have to hit rock bottom.

It wasn't the easiest thing to do, but it wasn't the most difficult thing to do either. Biggest thing is finding something to occupy your brain.

The first 4 days, little else is being though of, except scoring & dosing, but make yourself busy doing other things--AND know that the cravings and unpleasantness will go away.

Now I tapered myself down to very little, so WD for me was RLS and craving. No vomiting or excessive shit-fest (yes, GI motility is returned to normal, slightly hyper normal, but not unreasonable).

If you don't have a big reason for quitting, its tough to do. I didn't have any big reason, just wanted a break and to get myself opi free for a while.

Many people dislike tapering, cause its like a long mini-WD while you're decreasing. I think that the minimal symptoms are/were worth it when you finally kick.

Lots of folks here can offer advice/help/suggestions if you're looking to decrease use, taper or consider stopping altogether. Just start a threat and ask (give particulars about your situation so you don't get UTMSE MFSOB !!!) :)

M F

[ouaisOut]

Yeah, major fucking huge congratulations! You're doing great and you're definitely an inspiration for others. I'm so happy when I hear about someone getting clean.

Major props on the exercising too. It's hard when you're a CP patient, b/c you go out and exercise your ass off then you come home and you're in pain and that's a trigger.... But it sounds like you're doing great with exercise. I swear when I used to be able to run pre-surgeries, it was as good as or better than dope for me. And I bet you're enjoying that awesome feeling of being naturally exhausted after working out. Great work! And thanks again for being an inspiration.

bigNasty - Thanks for the suggestions of herbal pills to pop. I've been thinking about that a LOT b/c so much of my addiction is psychological. I've been menaing ot go down to the bigass mega-hippie co-op and ask them for some sugggestions for stuff I could take throughout the day to (a) give me some energy or make me sleepy, and (b)more importantly, give me that mental satisfaction of having dosed myself. So I'll start with what you suggested and temporarily save myself from The Potential Scorn of the Hippies.

[HandMeSomeOpiates]

I'm so happy when I hear about someone getting clean.


Me too man. It gives me hope that one day I will be where they are.

[Shadowsblaze]

Now this is more like it for the Nobel Prize. You win in it my mental runoff with Obama , OxyKid, congratulations bro. Rep for a tough job in progress.

[oxy kid]

Man this is exactly what I needed this morning. Went to bed last night around 12 after a couple beer, slept great until this morning I woke up at 445, wide awake, couldnt sleep. First time insomnia kicked in a while, finally fell back asleep, woke up at 7, (gotta be somewhere at 815) and felt like crap. Hopped in the shower, got out, walked to my computer, logged on and went to my thread and read all the awesome things yall said and it completely lifted my spirits. I honestly feel better. I still have a long way to go, but im headed there. Have a good saturday everybody.

[oxy kid]

I still have this slight achy light headedness things going on that I can't shake with OTC meds. Any ideas how long this sticks around? I took some aleve earlier to hopefully help with a slight achy legs, but it didn't help much. I just ate some soup a little bit ago, so im going to take 2 more aleve in a second. Cut down on the loperamide today. 8mgs 2x. Didn't seem to notice that much of a difference. Might stay at that same dose tomorrow or maybe try to see if I feel any worse on 6mgs 2x daily.

I'm having a really hard time eating. I can feel super hungry, but when I put some food in my mouth i just want to throw it all up. Any suggestions for this? I'm going to buy some slimfast or something to make sure I get all my nutrients and what not, but I just gotta get to where I can eat. Its ridiculous. I don't want to start losing weight.

[duck]

maybe a little caffeine to help the headache/light-headedness? Keep fighting my brother, you have more than most of us have had in years...I'd club a baby animal to death for 7 days + clean, and I love baby animals more than anyone you know.

[bronyraur]

Congratulations on the 1 week clean, Oxy Kid!

Just take it one day at a time–you seem to have the motivation required to succeed. Good luck man.

[HandMeSomeOpiates]

Yeah bro keep that motivation going! The reason the saying "This Too Shall Pass" is so cliche, is because it's SO true!

[dieselbaby]

Exercise.

Drink something with caffeine for your light-headedness.

Try to munch on smaller meals/snacks throughout the day instead of only a few big meals. Carbs and starchy foods helped me a lot.

Make sure that you take at least a half an hour per day to do something for yourself.

Listen to music. MUSIC THERAPY = for me it's listening to some kind of aggressive, upbeat, punky shit. I have plenty of suggestions. Get your natural endorphins flowing again! Go outside and just explore. You are coming out of a dull cloud of numb emotion...enjoy all the little things.

Remind yourself how strong you are for getting through this. The hard part is done, and soon it will be so far in the past that it will seem like a distant memory, and you will forget what it even felt like to wonder if you would ever be able to get off opiates. Congrats.

[Duckfeet]

I didn't much like eating either, so I'd get food I *really* liked, u know, pizzas and junk like that: anything to cheer me up...that all gets better, sleep too, all of it...aches pains and general malaise get slowly better: I'm alright now, don't think about it much, been over 3 months...generally focus on how miserable I usually am when I'm strung out on anything--legal or illegal--and just try to tolerate temporary cravings, go do something, get out of house, take a swim, hell went to lunch with a couple of pretty girls then we went to beach: socal u know :)...then went swimming: one girl was from maine, the other from nyc...we all've been kind of off dope for some time, and were happy, it was a nice day, one of them had her two year old kid with him, and I took him swimming...it's worth fighting a bit for, the freedom...I never know where my life will take me, and fully expect I'll succumb again some day...and that's o.k....just not today......

I still have this slight achy light headedness things going on that I can't shake with OTC meds. Any ideas how long this sticks around? I took some aleve earlier to hopefully help with a slight achy legs, but it didn't help much. I just ate some soup a little bit ago, so im going to take 2 more aleve in a second. Cut down on the loperamide today. 8mgs 2x. Didn't seem to notice that much of a difference. Might stay at that same dose tomorrow or maybe try to see if I feel any worse on 6mgs 2x daily.

I'm having a really hard time eating. I can feel super hungry, but when I put some food in my mouth i just want to throw it all up. Any suggestions for this? I'm going to buy some slimfast or something to make sure I get all my nutrients and what not, but I just gotta get to where I can eat. Its ridiculous. I don't want to start losing weight.

[oxy kid]

Thanks again for all the input. If it wasn't for some of the things I read here, I probably would have already relapsed. Today is 10 days clean, no opiates. Still tapering down the immodium, and taking a benzo from time to time to help if some anxiety kicks in. Luckily for me, havn't really had too much of that.

DB, I'll start snacking all throughout the day and see how that works. I just have to keep some food on my stomach. I don't want to make myself feel worse, because I havn't been eating right.

DF, your wisdom, yes wisdom, always really lays out a broad perspective for me, keeps me in line. A lot of the things you say really benefit me, and I thank you for that.

Bronyraur, thank you for your kind words. It's so nice to be able to log on and have people keep helping me push through this.

Duck, question on the caffiene. I've never been a big caffiene drink (swore off carbinated drinks about 9 years ago) so aside from the occasional coke, I don't have much of it in my system. I used to drink coffee everyday until a few years ago I had a benzo seizure, and after that day, I have still yet to make another cup. Don't know why, just havn't.

Last question for the moment, If I could get a script for Neurontin, do you think it would help anything at all? I read more feens topic before I came here, and am just looking around all corners for any help I can get. I havn't been abusing the benzos, but it would be nice to have an alternative to having to take them, and from what I've read, they produce a similar effect. Like I said earlier, I did have a benzo w/d induced seizure, so do you think I would have any issues with that type of neuro medication?

Again, I can't thank you guys enough for helping me get through this. I don't have anybody in my "real" life that I can talk to about whats going on, or get advice from, just a lot of loving family members that don't understand the ins and outs of opiate addiction and withdrawal.

I owe you guys and gals. Thank you. Your a major factory in my ability to get clean.

[More Feen]

Hey Oxy-K,

I'm not a doctor so I don't know all the ins-outs of seizure problems (drug-related, or otherwise). But if you're planning to get a Rx from the doctor, you can ask them about it.

I think, just like with a benzo-D tranq, you want to minimize how much you take, and you don't want to stop taking it abruptly.

If you take gabapentin once, every other day (it lasts long enough to do this without much problem), you shouldn't need to up the dose.

I wish I could e-mail 1-2 Gabas so you could try them, but we're not there yet with the technology.

I didn't see a doctor, but I borrowed (with permission) from a friend who no longer needed them. You might be able to find someone who's taking them and bum a few and see how they work.

Keep going man! I still think about scoring/copping about 5 times an hour (or for an hour:) ), but its getting easier to push back. Just find a good movie/TV show/Football Game/Something and get into it mentally, might help.

M F

PS-- Oh, spoil yourself with some of your favourite foods--don't worry if its greasy pizzas, fatty-fried Chinese food--whatever! Your favourites, reward yourself--even if you just eat like a slice of pizza every 2 hours, or whatever you're comfy with.

[Duckfeet]

Most of us have been there, Oxy Kid, and know how bad it can feel in the middle of this thing. And many of us have failed time and time again, and also know how discouraging the whole "how do I make it another hour, when I feel so bad" situation can be...best wishes, it gets better...

[oxy kid]

MF,

Haha...im actually watching some football as we speak. Hoping my fantasy team does work this week. That stuff is actually pretty fun. I'm going to see what I can do to try and find a few to see if they'd help. I'll ask my doctor tomorrow. We have a GREAT relationship. All I have to do is call him up and ask him what he thinks and he will either call it in for me or tell me to run by for a quick appt.

Take care today guys and gals.

[More Feen]

MF,

Haha...im actually watching some football as we speak. Hoping my fantasy team does work this week. That stuff is actually pretty fun. I'm going to see what I can do to try and find a few to see if they'd help. I'll ask my doctor tomorrow. We have a GREAT relationship. All I have to do is call him up and ask him what he thinks and he will either call it in for me or tell me to run by for a quick appt.

Take care today guys and gals.


Dude, sound like you got yourself a great doctor! They are out there, few & far between.

Good luck--who's your team?

Ain't really got a team, but I'd like to see the Lions & Rams win (which rarely happens), Colts are fun to watch, and they tend to win, Packers are inspiring from time to time. I can find myself cheering for Chicago (if they're not playing any of the teams I mentioned previously. After that..., I can enjoy any good game by any good teams.

M F

[oxy kid]

MF, how should I approach the Nerontin to my doctor? Just say i've been doing some reading, and I believe it will help me. He knows I'm going through w/d and is very compassionate towards me. I know its a neurological drug, and he doesn't have anything to do with neurology, so I'm not really sure how to approach it.

[duck]

e the Lions & Rams win (which rarely happens), Colts are fun to watch, and they tend to win, Packers are inspiring from time to time. I can find myself cheering for Chicago (if they're not playing any of the teams I mentioned previously. After that..., I can enjoy any good game by any good teams.

M F

Nice, I'm somewhat of a Rams fan, being from Missouri....Rush Limbaugh has an offer on the table to buy them from Goldman Sachs for ~$750M (he makes ~$50M/year on his radio show alone)

[More Feen]

MF, how should I approach the Nerontin to my doctor? Just say i've been doing some reading, and I believe it will help me. He knows I'm going through w/d and is very compassionate towards me. I know its a neurological drug, and he doesn't have anything to do with neurology, so I'm not really sure how to approach it.

I don't know if your doctor would be swayed by Wikipedia, but you can add it to your ammunition.

1-Additionally, Gabapentin has been prescribed to menopausal patients being treated with anti-androgenic compounds to reduce the incidence and intensity of the accompanying hot flashes[14] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gabapentin#cite_note-13). It has occasionally been prescribed for treatment of idiopathic subjective tinnitus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tinnitus), although a double blind (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_blind), randomized controlled (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randomized_controlled_trial)trial (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clinical_trial) has found this ineffective.[15] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gabapentin#cite_note-14) Gabapentin may help deepen sleep, positively affecting stage 4 sleep, and reducing arousals during the night.[citation needed (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)] It could potentially be helpful for both sleep onset and sleep maintenance.[citation needed (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)] Gabapentin is sometimes prescribed for RLS (Restless Legs Syndrome (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Restless_Legs_Syndrome)). Finally, it may be effective in treating akathisia - a rare side effect of typical antipsychotics that causes severe agitation and anxiety.[citation needed (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)]
Gabapentin has also been used to treat some symptoms of opiate withdrawal.[16] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gabapentin#cite_note-15)

2- You can add to your argument, say that it is a NON-Scheduled Drug, so he can feel comfortable Rx it to you, maybe more so than a benzodiazepine.

3- You know other former opiate users who relate that occasional gabapentin use was VERY helpful in the WD and immediate-post WD time period.

4- (This might be too much) But say you have a doctor friend in europe who suggests the following regimin:
Rx : Neurontin (Gabapentin) 800mg #30
Disp/Sig: 800mg P.O. QD at bedtime (may break scored tablet and take 400mg), PRN
Allow generic substitution

Basically, take half or a whole tablet (400 or 800mg) at bedtime. You'll be "sleepy" or "floaty" when you wake up, so you might want to start with half a tab.

If you take this every day, or twice a day, you will develop a tolerance, so you don't have to tell the doctor, that you might skip every other day--your call.

This isn't a total miracle drug for our purposes, but it does help.

Let me know if you need more "ammo" for your doc. I don't know what s/he is like, so I don't know how you would best convince him. The fact that you're not asking for benzos is great, and should be considered a good sign by him.

Good luck man!

M F

[More Feen]

Nice, I'm somewhat of a Rams fan, being from Missouri....Rush Limbaugh has an offer on the table to buy them from Goldman Sachs for ~$750M (he makes ~$50M/year on his radio show alone)

No Shit?? That's something else. God, if I made $5 Million a year, let alone $50M, AND I liked oxycontin, I would OWN the MOTHERFUCKING FACTORY, and eat my fucking fill every God damned day !!

So you're a Rams fan--bad game today--sorry. I got a step family around St. Louis--is it Baldwin, or Ballwin? I don't talk with them any more, but I've been there a few time--like it!

M F

[oxy kid]

Well, today is day 12. Still havn't screwed up. Pretty proud of myself. I havn't had a chance to get any neruontin, so can't really report anything on that.

I tapered the lope down a little, been going easy on the benzos, and taking a few aleve throughout the day.

I still have this light w/d every morning and it'll hang around a little throughout the day. I know I havn't had enough time yet, but I'm just not 100% yet. Yesterday, I got super anxious for some reason and wanted some opi's, but I held back.

Again, I can't thank you enough for all of everybody's support. Couldn't do it without you guys.

Oh yeah, and the majority of the light-headedness has went away. I've started drinking some coffee in the morning and then gatorade and water throughout the day.

[More Feen]

A few weeks ago I tried loperamide as well, but aside from giving a sore ass a break from activities, I found the Lope caused me to be crampy and uncomfortable (backed-up), instead of just letting things go

au naturale.

So I stopped taking them, unless I needed a (1-day) break to recover.

M F

[oxy kid]

Tomorrow will be 2 weeks on the clean chart, if you can exclude the low amounts of lope i'm now taking, .25-.5 of kpin every other day or so, and maybe 1 soma at night once every 3-4 days. It feels nice breaking free of all the meds. Havn't been able to say this in a longgggggggg time......its just relief. Don't get me wrong, I miss sitting here typing about how great I feel, but then when that goes away, and the money goes away, things and opinions change. I still want to be clean, and I want a clean life. Anybody out there who is considering getting clean, just keep in mind you can do it. If i can, anyone can.

I can tell that I'm starting to feel more "normal" than I did during the first week. I'm still waking up each morning in slight w/ds (I mean very very slight, maybe a little teary eyed or a tad bit achy). I'm guessing that hopefully it will just be a steady increase of improvement for a while? Hopefully thats the case.

Any other suggestions from you guys to keep me on track? I've done the NA thing a little bit, and going to look into finding something around here. Also I've been keeping myself super busy. I've noticed when I have a million things to do, you don't even really have time to think about opis. (Didn't ever think I'd say that.) Oh, and I also even got a job. Things are great.

You guys and ladies take care.

[Papa Verine]

Good job man!

I just read this whole thread for the first time. One thing that jumped out at me is that Loperamide causes nausea for me. If I was taking the doses you were, 20mgs a day, I'd be nauseous as Hell, and probably have no appetite either.

And it's really not doing much to help with withdrawals. A very small amount of it gets to your brain. Give your digestive system a break, maybe try 2-4mg/day if you're having a problem with frequent diarreah. (You know, how normal people use the stuff)

I've cut my opiate use way down last few weeks. No heroin, no benzos, only small amounts of Poppy tea. I didn't drink any tea for the past 2 days and withdrawals weren't too bad. Much better then previous breaks when I was drinking huge amounts of the shit. I got myself a cup today but it was just enough to take the edge off. I still feel like I'm kicking, or tapering, or something...

[oxy kid]

Good job man!

I just read this whole thread for the first time. One thing that jumped out at me is that Loperamide causes nausea for me. If I was taking the doses you were, 20mgs a day, I'd be nauseous as Hell, and probably have no appetite either.

And it's really not doing much to help with withdrawals. A very small amount of it gets to your brain. Give your digestive system a break, maybe try 2-4mg/day if you're having a problem with frequent diarreah. (You know, how normal people use the stuff)

I've cut my opiate use way down last few weeks. No heroin, no benzos, only small amounts of Poppy tea. I didn't drink any tea for the past 2 days and withdrawals weren't too bad. Much better then previous breaks when I was drinking huge amounts of the shit. I got myself a cup today but it was just enough to take the edge off. I still feel like I'm kicking, or tapering, or something...

Thanks for the input PV. I'm going to start that tomorrow. I agree, I should probably give my digestive system a break. It hasn't made me nauseous at all. I've been taking, at most, 16mgs a day, and I cut it down to 12 yesterday and I've only taken 10 today.

I'm ready to be completely clean.

[Cherry's Jubilee]

I'm really proud of you oxy kid. This thread is super-inspiring to me. I want to be clean and non-dependent more than anything.

Stay strong and keep us updated. I have a good feeling about this one... ;)

[Duckfeet]

Tomorrow will be 2 weeks on the clean chart, if you can exclude the low amounts of lope i'm now taking, .25-.5 of kpin every other day or so, and maybe 1 soma at night once every 3-4 days. It feels nice breaking free of all the meds. Havn't been able to say this in a longgggggggg time......its just relief. Don't get me wrong, I miss sitting here typing about how great I feel, but then when that goes away, and the money goes away, things and opinions change. I still want to be clean, and I want a clean life. Anybody out there who is considering getting clean, just keep in mind you can do it. If i can, anyone can.

I can tell that I'm starting to feel more "normal" than I did during the first week. I'm still waking up each morning in slight w/ds (I mean very very slight, maybe a little teary eyed or a tad bit achy). I'm guessing that hopefully it will just be a steady increase of improvement for a while? Hopefully thats the case.

Any other suggestions from you guys to keep me on track? I've done the NA thing a little bit, and going to look into finding something around here. Also I've been keeping myself super busy. I've noticed when I have a million things to do, you don't even really have time to think about opis. (Didn't ever think I'd say that.) Oh, and I also even got a job. Things are great.

You guys and ladies take care.

Even tho some days I don't buy a word of it, it sure helps me to go to meetings(I go to AA)...kind of keeps me motivated, makes me think I'm doing o.k., all that...and every once in a while, there'll be somebody like me in there...I'm about surviving, not about proving any point, and whatever works, and makes life bearable, or even happy, is o.k. with me...best wishes...glad you're doing good...

[oxy kid]

I'm just so thankful I havn't fallen off the wagon yet. Its just so nice that I can somewhat see my life coming back together. I can do what I want and not have to revolve everything around making sure I'm not sick. Its amazing. Like I said earlier, i absolutely love and miss opiates, but i was just plain sick of the ball and chain attached to me, holding me back of anything that I wanted to do. I feel free.

[Duckfeet]

I'm just so thankful I havn't fallen off the wagon yet. Its just so nice that I can somewhat see my life coming back together. I can do what I want and not have to revolve everything around making sure I'm not sick. Its amazing. Like I said earlier, i absolutely love and miss opiates, but i was just plain sick of the ball and chain attached to me, holding me back of anything that I wanted to do. I feel free.

I'll always love'em, and know I'll probably do'em, and have problems with'em again, some day, sooner or later...but knowing that, and accepting it, helps me put it off another day...and I only miss them sometimes...most of the time I don't think about'em...seems like time helps, and finding other pursuits....

[HandMeSomeOpiates]

Oxy kid I'd like to think that as time progresses, your cravings/love will fade. Sending all good vibes your way. Your an inspiration to others trying to kick this seductive chemical/plant. Hang in there, it can only get better bro ;)

[More Feen]

Hey Oxy,

If you feel like you really don't need any added meds, like the gaba-P, there's really no need to get any.

In a clean state for a penny, you're in for a pound.

Keep going--and congrats!

M F

[doctor diesel]

Oxy Kid, I think I understand from this thread that what you kicked two weeks ago was subs. If that's the case, can you tell us what subs dosage you had got down to when you kicked, and how long you were on the subs for?
Isn't it odd how, when we've kicked, the one thing we can't kick is the memory of how lovely we feel when opiated, yet we all of us also have plenty of memories of how fkin vile we felt all those times we slipped into partial or full WDs, and for some reason those memories don't seem to hold much weight? Why is this?
They are every bit as powerful and real as our thoughts of being enveloped by the warm opie blanket blah blah etc, and yet they are memories that we somehow choose to forget. If they could be made as prominent as the nice, positive memories, then that would make it easier to stay off the opies, wouldn't it?
And BTW, I too am proud of your work and devotion, OK, so well, very well... done, mate.


Doc

[oxy kid]

Oxy Kid, I think I understand from this thread that what you kicked two weeks ago was subs. If that's the case, can you tell us what subs dosage you had got down to when you kicked, and how long you were on the subs for?
Isn't it odd how, when we've kicked, the one thing we can't kick is the memory of how lovely we feel when opiated, yet we all of us also have plenty of memories of how fkin vile we felt all those times we slipped into partial or full WDs, and for some reason those memories don't seem to hold much weight? Why is this?
They are every bit as powerful and real as our thoughts of being enveloped by the warm opie blanket blah blah etc, and yet they are memories that we somehow choose to forget. If they could be made as prominent as the nice, positive memories, then that would make it easier to stay off the opies, wouldn't it?
And BTW, I too am proud of your work and devotion, OK, so well, very well... done, mate.


Doc

Doc,

I'm not going to lie to you, the way I went about my subs was probably one of the largest mistakes of my life. My incompetent doctor wrote me 32mgs to start off after a somewhat mild 100mgOxy+100mgHydro habit that could get me through the day. I should have started out with 2mgs, POSSIBLY 4. With that being said, I was pretty good about things for the first little while....then the vacations started to come after a few months. Every month it would be 2 weeks on subs, 2 weeks off. So my tolerance went through the roof. I was on subs for about 1.5 years, just dragging it along because I still wanted to get high, not get clean. With the subs, I always had a "fall back plan" if I couldn't find anything. Well I think it was about 3-4 months ago, I really decided how much I wanted to be clean. I think it was June something another. So I started tapering my sub. At that point at was at about 8mgs a day. Got down to 4. Then 2. Then 1. Then couldn't get below that to save my life. In my eyes, it was impossible. No matter how hard I tried, I couldn't get lower. Id feel sick and dose up to 1mg. I tried to jump from there, and it was misery and hell for 4 days, then I went fell off the wagon of that attempt. Then I thought to myself, I have freaking months and months of this crap stored up in my system, theres gotta be a better way to do this. So a little oxy/hydro taper surprisingly, really helped. Maintained on probably anywhere from 35-40mgs a day for about 2-3 weeks, then after that tried to kick....Couldn't do it because of everything going on around me and I didn't have the days to lay around and feel like sick. So then, what I think was the key to this entire process came into play. A short Done taper starting at 30mgs (was actually outrageously high that first night) and made it all the way down to 5mgs and said "ok, I can do this." Jumped and havn't looked back since.

[doctor diesel]

Doc,

I'm not going to lie to you, the way I went about my subs was probably one of the largest mistakes of my life. My incompetent doctor wrote me 32mgs to start off after a somewhat mild 100mgOxy+100mgHydro habit that could get me through the day. I should have started out with 2mgs, POSSIBLY 4. With that being said, I was pretty good about things for the first little while....then the vacations started to come after a few months. Every month it would be 2 weeks on subs, 2 weeks off. So my tolerance went through the roof. I was on subs for about 1.5 years, just dragging it along because I still wanted to get high, not get clean. With the subs, I always had a "fall back plan" if I couldn't find anything. Well I think it was about 3-4 months ago, I really decided how much I wanted to be clean. I think it was June something another. So I started tapering my sub. At that point at was at about 8mgs a day. Got down to 4. Then 2. Then 1. Then couldn't get below that to save my life. In my eyes, it was impossible. No matter how hard I tried, I couldn't get lower. Id feel sick and dose up to 1mg. I tried to jump from there, and it was misery and hell for 4 days, then I went fell off the wagon of that attempt. Then I thought to myself, I have freaking months and months of this crap stored up in my system, theres gotta be a better way to do this. So a little oxy/hydro taper surprisingly, really helped. Maintained on probably anywhere from 35-40mgs a day for about 2-3 weeks, then after that tried to kick....Couldn't do it because of everything going on around me and I didn't have the days to lay around and feel like sick. So then, what I think was the key to this entire process came into play. A short Done taper starting at 30mgs (was actually outrageously high that first night) and made it all the way down to 5mgs and said "ok, I can do this." Jumped and havn't looked back since.


Brilliant. So when you were on just 1mg subs a day, did you feel AOK on that? And what was to stop you chopping up a pill and going to 0.5mg a day - did you try that?
I'm interested, Oxy, cos I'm on subs, and will in due course try to get off them. I'm not really anticipating problems doing so, but I've heard a fair few horror stories about jumping off the sub boat, so I need to hear more from experienced people.


Doc

[Flowergirl]

Good job! You've accomplished quite a lot. Keep up the good work!

and for some reason those memories don't seem to hold much weight? Why is this?
They are every bit as powerful and real as our thoughts of being enveloped by the warm opie blanket blah blah etc, and yet they are memories that we somehow choose to forget. If they could be made as prominent as the nice, positive memories, then that would make it easier to stay off the opies, wouldn't it?

The mind is an amazing thing with the tricks it plays. Kind of like childbirth. I gave birth, vaginally (sorry, men), 3 times with no pain medication. The first time, I begged them to slice me open and end the torture. The second time, it went a little better. I didn't want to die instead of enduring another moment of pain. The third time? Piece of cake. I smiled through it. Lucky for me, my labors were short. I had my daughter in the elevator of the hospital, actually. My longest labor was an hour. I don't know how women labor for hours upon hours with no epidural, and then go on to have another child. Our minds have selective memory, and some way of reducing the bad thoughts to make them seem not so bad after the fact. Amazing.

It would be neat to learn some scientific reasoning for this phenomenon...

[doctor diesel]

And conversely, it would seem the mind also has some way of making memories of GOOD experiences even better than they were, after the fact!
Why?

Doc



BTW Flower, I think you'll find that most of us men have nothing against the use of the word 'vagina'. No, really.

[More Feen]

Hey Oxy-K,

Are you noticing that its been so long since you've been ~drug free, that feeling just normal is kind of unusual, and has a strange high of its own??

If you haven't noticed from my posts recently, I've been feeling goofy as hell lately, its kinda nice.

Keep up the good work man.

M F

[oxy kid]

Hey guys...got a question. Today I've had somewhat of a hard day. This morning started out ok. Around 11, started feeling kinda bad. Achy legs, and just general restlessness. Could this be because of the lope? I'm ready to be better......well.....I know its a long process, but right now, today is hard. Harder than previous days. Please keep me motivated guys. I'm not going to fall off, but the bad days defiantly don't help matters much.

What should I do with the lope? Any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

[Cherry's Jubilee]

Hey guys...got a question. Today I've had somewhat of a hard day. This morning started out ok. Around 11, started feeling kinda bad. Achy legs, and just general restlessness. Could this be because of the lope? I'm ready to be better......well.....I know its a long process, but right now, today is hard. Harder than previous days. Please keep me motivated guys. I'm not going to fall off, but the bad days defiantly don't help matters much.

What should I do with the lope? Any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Supposedly methadone takes a couple of weeks to clear out of your system and since you tapered off done it would make sense that maybe that last little bit is clearing out and making you feel kind of crappy.

Try to look at it as a good thing though--your body is finally completely ridding itself of all those chemicals and yeah, you might have a rough day or two, but here's where you're really getting CLEAN--exactly where you WANT to be you know? So tough it out. The one thing we do know for sure is that it definitely does pass.

Or maybe it's swine flu...:p

[oxy kid]

hahah CJ that made me laugh. Swine flu is everywhere down here. I tried to spend about a week on some short acting stuff to get some of the done out....so I had a week head start on it. I just hope I get to feeling somewhat back to whatever normal is soon. I'm going to go have a beer. Have a safe and fun night ophiles.

[oxy kid]

I think I'm getting better. Woke up this morning, again, with teary eyes but not too much achyness(sp). Havn't taken any lope today, and tried to slim down yesterday. Any ideas when the "teary eyed mornings" are going to go away?

After I ate me a decent breakfast, took a couple vitamins, drank some juice, and got moving around, I've started to feel better.

Hope everyone has a good day.

[More Feen]

I think I'm getting better. Woke up this morning, again, with teary eyes but not too much achyness(sp). Havn't taken any lope today, and tried to slim down yesterday. Any ideas when the "teary eyed mornings" are going to go away?

After I ate me a decent breakfast, took a couple vitamins, drank some juice, and got moving around, I've started to feel better.

Hope everyone has a good day.


I think you're thru the worst of it Oxy. Next morning will be that much easier, & so on. I think it s good to cut down on the loperamide.

I'll take it once a week (4mg) just for a break. Any more than that, and I'm feeling like shit.

Keep us informed!

M F

[oxy kid]

I think you're thru the worst of it Oxy. Next morning will be that much easier, & so on. I think it s good to cut down on the loperamide.

I'll take it once a week (4mg) just for a break. Any more than that, and I'm feeling like shit.

Keep us informed!

M F

Thanks for the reply. See thats the thing, I havn't really been taking a ton...but if i don't take the lope, I dont' really start feeling as good as if I did, (obviously) and I always wind up taking some. The fact that I am only making it on lope, an occasional benzo every couple days or so, and a soma at night every couple or night, or possibly even in the day.....all that is an extreme accomplishent to myself, and I need to remember that.

Oh yeah, today is day 16 without opi's (excluding lope)

[More Feen]

I think its okay to exclude lope as an opi. Half a month man! Go have a beer !

MF

[GOLD N DIEMONDS]

I think I'm getting better. Woke up this morning, again, with teary eyes but not too much achyness(sp). Havn't taken any lope today, and tried to slim down yesterday. Any ideas when the "teary eyed mornings" are going to go away?

After I ate me a decent breakfast, took a couple vitamins, drank some juice, and got moving around, I've started to feel better.

Hope everyone has a good day.

WELL the eye watering and kind of running nose
can go on for long time, your immunity sytem is pretty crashed now
A lot of nightime eye /nose situation is due to allerigies.
I DONT KNOW your finicial situation
BUT if you can go out and buy a brand new pillow
and good alergene pillow case cover
and a bunch of new pillow cases , it will help tons
and uses an antihistame eye drops before sleeping.
THIS REALLY IS KIND OF IMPORTANT AT YOUR STAGE
because all the nose/eye watering is setting up perfect growth enviorment
for a bactercail or virual sinuis infection
LAST THING YOU NEED NOW IS GETTING SICK
go goggle " DUST MITES' to see what living in your pillow w/ yea

I think your doing GREAT and deserve a new pillow
change pillow cases every other day:)

PS SORRY FER TYPOS , not gonta spell check;)

[oxy kid]

Looks like I'm going to be looking into a new pillow. ha. Those things are some nasty dudes. I'm just ready to be "well" if I even remember what that feels like. I know its going to take long, long time, but I know things get better.

[GOLD N DIEMONDS]

Looks like I'm going to be looking into a new pillow. ha. Those things are some nasty dudes. I'm just ready to be "well" if I even remember what that feels like. I know its going to take long, long time, but I know things get better.

YEAH - don't mean to freak you out
but the're microscopic and feed off of dead flesh
and what it is we are alligric to is their "SHIT"
kid you not -think everytime that pillow puffs
and millions of shit allerigens goes flying into the air your breathing
7-8 hours of sleep time (little fuckers):D

NEW PILLOW= NICE NEW START ON LIFE
stay well & healthy!!!!

[More Feen]

If you can, rotate the pillows you use. Not just the pilly-cases.

Use one set for a week, set them aside, use 2nd set. Keep changing every week.

The week that the pillows aren't being used, should starve any critters.

Prolly will never be 100% critter free, but you can keep their population to a minimum.

Same with lice, bag contaminated crap for 7 days--or more. Any lice, nits etc..., would die, or hatch & die in that time.

Other suggestions?

M F

[oxy kid]

Kinda having a hard day today for some reason. Really jittery, and jonesing pretty bad. Last couple days it seems like this has been a steady increase in cravings I guess...I don't know.

Any suggestions? I think today is day 18. Still going strong. No plans to change, just want to be better.

[Flowergirl]

Go make yourself do something, anything.

On the topic of pillows and beds... We got a new Dyson when they were all the rage years ago. The first thing I did was strip my bed, jump up, and vacuum the hell out of it. The amount of white fluffy stuff in the canister was enough to make me want to burn the house down. I kept vacuuming, and it kept filling. We've since bought a different type of mattress, and nothing will make me go back to a conventional (practically uncleanable) one ever again!

So, Oxykid, go buy a Dyson and vacuum yer bed! :)

[More Feen]

If it makes you feel any better, you might start a new thread, you are not 1 week clean, but probably on your 3rd week or so.

Cravings are a bitch. Sometimes you simply have to find a method of breaking that mental obsession.

The boredom and tediousness (I know, they're synonyms) of everyday, opiate-free life is tough to get through.

I think about the movie Transpotting when Rents is clean, and sitting in a Bingo Parlor (its called HOUSE over here) with his mum & dad, just bored out of his freaking mind. Great camera work, btw, the slow track backwards, with everyone else moving around at 2x speed, Rents sitting there nearly immobile.

M F

[GOLD N DIEMONDS]

Kinda having a hard day today for some reason. Really jittery, and jonesing pretty bad. Last couple days it seems like this has been a steady increase in cravings I guess...I don't know.

Any suggestions? I think today is day 18. Still going strong. No plans to change, just want to be better.

WELL SINCE WE ARE ADULTS HERE
ONE sugestion- go jerk off when you get craving
It will start to retrain thee brain , so to speak
and again get the flow of natural endroph. going

okay- looks like you got work to do;)




AGAIN GOOD LUCK- this too shal pass

[More Feen]

^^^ 3 +++ ^^^

Great Advice !

MF

[GOLD N DIEMONDS]

^^^^^^^^ you SCOTTISH ^^^^^^^^^^^
ANY REASON (excuse) for waxing the old cane:)




ps.Thanks- tip of the hat me good man

[JTDuffet]

props.!!! congrats on the clean time. i wish i was counting the days clean, and not counting the days until i get clean... i consider you a lucky bastard cause W/D SUCKS!!!

congrats.. and keep it up...

-jt

[More Feen]

^^^^^^^^ you SCOTTISH ^^^^^^^^^^^
ANY REASON (excuse) for waxing the old cane:)




ps.Thanks- tip of the hat me good man


All the terminology for wanking!!

Coolest one I've heard recently, was from a Russian, translates as:

[ Running the bald dude through the fist.]

M F

[GOLD N DIEMONDS]

All the terminology for wanking!!

Coolest one I've heard recently, was from a Russian, translates as:

[ Running the bald dude through the fist.]

M F


OKAY AH FOR PERSONAL REASONS;

I NEED THAT IN RUSSIAN pleazzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzE:D

[OrangeLude]

OK - congrats on your progress - sounds like we're on the three M's...

meetings (maybe); movies & masturbation !

Good luck! Progress is really a much underused term in the recovery language. Your desire, your awareness & your clean time show for much progress in your mental attitude...props to you.....stay honest with the people you know care for you and be careful.

[More Feen]

OKAY AH FOR PERSONAL REASONS;

I NEED THAT IN RUSSIAN pleazzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzE:D


Dude, I wrote that quote in Russian in a book cover, but I'm ~packing all my crap (books included). I will try to find it, or after I'm in my new place I will unpack and try to give it to you (remind me!).

Here is a close approximation from Gugel Translate: (check with a Russian friend for understandibility):

Запуск лысый через мой кулак. [ Za-poosk lee-see cher-ez moy koo-lak.]