Buperenorphine blocking Salvia?

[Opiyum]

As far as I know Salvia works on your Kappa opioid receptors or some such shit. If this is the case I wonder if the suboxone I had been taking prior to smoking some 40x salvia could have blocked the effect.
A few years back I bought some 5x and fucked around with that with no effect and never thought to try it again until a friend bought some recently. He bought 40x and couldn't stop talking about it for a week so I decided to give it another try. My friends half gram had run out so I bought a half gram of my own. Once it arrived I packed a bowl large enough for two large hits since that's what my buddy told me did it for him and the others he had dosed.
Five minutes later when I noticed no change I packed a bunch more and took another five or six hits. Still nothing. I thought maybe I got ripped off and the shit was fake but just the other night while I had a few friends over for the pens game one of my friends (a junky but not on subs) smoked it and was most certainly effected by it.
So I was now convinced it just didn't have an effect on me and even read that that is the case for some people.
Though now I don't know because I did a little research and although I knew Salvia was different from all other hallucinogens I didn't realize that it worked primarily from an opioid receptor as opposed to flooding your brain with serotonin.
Even if I don't get an answer what I am going to do next time I go on a little binge with heroin, or once I get off the subs, I'm going to try the salvia again and see what happens.
I was under the impression that in order to pinpoint the mechanism by which certain chemicals interact with the brain was to use blockers like Naltrexone (or maybe in my case the blocking action of bupe and its high affinity) to see if it had a diminishing effect. If that is the case I would think it would be documented somewhere but I don't seem to have the knowledge it takes to find research documents and clinical studies and such....

[Russellmeboy]

yup, ive had the same experience homie..pissed me off just as much as it seems it did you lol.
i shelled out the 40 bucks (alot for me) for the 60x and it didnt do a thing and previously i have tripped on it ( i compare it to the peak of a strong acid trip for around 5 min). on 16mg of subs it did nothing.
i once did the same thing with a tripple stacked roll...ugh what a waste...it just felt like straight speed.

[Opiyum]

Interesting. This only gives me more motivation to get off suboxone. IF nothing else I would think the desire to use other drugs without them being blocked might be what I need to kick this shit.
I wonder what drugs, other than opiates of course, are blocked by this foul chemical. I've been on subs for so long and haven't done anything other than heroin and oxy, which I have no problem with blockage, and I never thought to stop and think what other drugs it may block.

[Russellmeboy]

stay on the subs bro, its better then being a smack head. ;)
i know it sucks. but i have an "if it aint broke dont fix it" mentallity about subs.
idk tho, everyone is differnt. how do u get off on da oc/dizzle if ur on subs?

[Opiyum]

I only take 2mgs a day and anytime I am going to use I will normally wait around 24 hours before I do. Those two things combined with an IV ROA make for a barely noticeable blocking effect on the first dose and there after none at all.
This summer I'm planning on trying Ibogaine on for size so if that works out I will hopefully be able to stay opiate clean for an extended period of time. I really need a break from being on suboxone though. I've been on them for too damn long.

[Seedy]

yup, ive had the same experience homie..pissed me off just as much as it seems it did you lol.
i shelled out the 40 bucks (alot for me) for the 60x and it didnt do a thing and previously i have tripped on it ( i compare it to the peak of a strong acid trip for around 5 min). on 16mg of subs it did nothing.
i once did the same thing with a tripple stacked roll...ugh what a waste...it just felt like straight speed.

are you saying you've had bupe block the effects of mdma?

[Russellmeboy]

yeah, i never had done the pills before, they coulda just sucked but i really doubt it. i didnt feel the molly in it at all, it just felt like i had done some light speed or adderall...

oh to op
i understand wanting to get off it...its not a fun thing to be on lol..ive heard ibogaine works wondrs i hope it works..youll have to tell us about it

[Seedy]

^^ that's interesting because I haven't been gertting much of a buzz off e's recently. I thought it was because I've recently got off ssri's - I've heard it takes the brain a while to re-adjust, but that would sure suck if bupe blocks mdma!

[Opiyum]

I would think it at least blocks some aspects of mdma. I only say that because I've read, or think I've read, that it works on many different receptors in the brain and body.

[dharma bum]

Yes bupe blocked salvia for me and the more I see and hear about it I'm glad it did block it. I've subsequently had a trip that lacked insight, meaning lack of insight that I had taken a drug and that is why I feel this way---which I'm pretty sure while you're on salvia you forget you smoked it. I don't know but at the time I wanted to trip very bad and thought it might help in my attempts to quit using opiates.

The people that sent me the salvia said I was maybe what they call a "hardhead"; the unlucky one outta ten who didn't feel it.

For anybody that wants more info on this same topic they discussed this on drugs-forum.

[resorcinol]

Yep, buperenorphine will block or strongly attenuate the effects of salvia smoking. As you know the active chemical in salvia is Salvinorin-A, which causes a trip by acting as an agonist at k-opioid receptors. Buprenorphine is a potent antagonist of k-opioid receptors, so it has an effect on salvia analogous to that of naltrexone on narcotics.

Buprenorphine's effects on the three main opioid receptors break down like this:
Mu: partial agonist
Kappa: antagonist
Delta: antagonist

For naloxone:
Mu, Kappa, and Delta: antagonist (with some inverse agonist activity possibly)

So at the kappa receptor bupe and nalox will have the same effect -- blockade.

This is not necessarily a bad thing unless you like salvia. I feel that most psychonauts would always prefer to use a 5HT(2a) agonist classical psychedelic or an NMDA antagonist dissociative over salvia (or any other kappa agonist) because salvia can be profoundly dysphoric and the trip is thus more likely to be hampered by bad vibes. If salvia was illegal I doubt many people would seek it out; I figure that they would seek out hallucinogens that don't cause intrinsic dysphoria instead.

I could try salvia but never would -- I KNOW I'd hate it. It sounds absolutely horrifyingly unpleasant. I liked when I tried them once shrooms, and I loved DXM for awhile before it lost the magic (never got to try Ketamine but I bet I would have liked that too), but I have no desire to try salvia from what I've heard about its effects. It sounds like it has an intrinsically dark feel to the trip ... and I know I wouldn't be able to handle that (it's the fact that serotonergic and dissociative psychedelics are either [arguably] intrinsically slightly euphoric or intrinsically neutral mood-wise, that allows me to avoid a bad trip).

When it comes to my opioid receptors, I only want my Mu receptors tickled by agonist drugs (delta can be agonist tickled too if it comes with the mu package for a particular drug since AFAIK it's mood-neutral or even enhancing to the mu agonist mediated euphoria). Kappa agonist is a no-go for me.

In fact I think my "ideal" opioid would do this:
*Mu: potent full agonist
Kappa: potent antagonist
Delta: potent partial agonist

*DAT: moderate potency reuptake inhibitor (would want mu opioid agonism to be dominant over this though)
*NET: mild potency reuptake inhibitor (would want mu agonism to dominate over this also, and for the DAT blockade to be stronger than the NET blockade)
*SERT: wouldn't mind if it blocked reuptake with mild potency, but this is optional

[libertine]

heroin blocks it completely also, in my experience

[Opiyum]

heroin blocks it completely also, in my experience

The person whom I talk about in my original post had done 4 bags previous to smoking the salvia and it sure didn't block it for him.
I don't doubt it does for you but thats surprising to me. I can understand bupe because it's so damn sticky and it's hard for anything to get passed it.
I'm just glad it doesn't block DMT or anything else that I enjoy.