Recovery and Psychedelics. My experience. [Archive]

Opiyum

04-15-2009, 08:29 PM

So I'm starting this little account now because it has been over the last few months that I have firmed up my decision to give ibogaine a real shot. After researching every bit of documentation I can find on the subject I think I've come to terms with the cost and possibility of it not working as intended. So currently I am in the process of saving money which for me should be very easy to do. I work seasonally (spring/fall) as a union Boilermaker which affords me a very high hourly wage and will allow me to quickly save the money necessary for two weeks worth of full agonist maintenance, a round trip plane ticket and of course the cost of the treatment which ranges from 4000$ to 6500$ between the three clinics I am looking at.
For those who think the cost is ridiculous...Well your right but I know that last year I spent four times that much money on heroin and oxy. So with all that and a renewed interest in Hallucinogens due to a recent DMT experience and also due to a book I just read about psychedelics I am looking at this as not only a new experience with a rare African hallucinogen but also as something that could really improve my health and well-being. I do plan on after care of sorts but will not be twelve stepping by any means. I don't intend to be clean and sober the rest of my life but I would be perfectly okay with not ever being in the position of getting on some maintenance med again. In other words using heroin on a daily basis is not something I want to try anymore, at least not any time soon.
Ok so I guess that gets my justification and reasoning out of the way. So I'll continue with the little bit of dialogue I have had with those running these clinics.

My main concern was how they go about dealing with those on suboxone ( Say what you will but I have just as difficult a time getting off subs as I do heroin, possibly more difficult a time) and to my surprise all three had the same response.
Their way of dealing with a drug with such a long half life like bupe is to stop taking it two weeks prior to the Iboga dose. Whether they will supply a script for me to get me through those two weeks or whether Ill be on my own I don't know. Either way acquiring drugs is not something I would have trouble with but a script would certainly be cheaper. Upon arriving all three clinics said they would then put me on oral morphine for two to three days and then soon after that they would dose me.

So I have roughly 6-10 weeks left of my busy work season in which I'm just trying to keep my nose clean and increase the bottom line of my checking account. So far the last five weeks have gone well and I'm already half way to my goal. I'm really very excited about this and documenting the entire experience is something I am also looking forward too. I'm hoping I will have internet access close by so I can share my experience with everything still fresh in my mind...my hopefully newly refurbished mind.
I would also be interested in seeing how my experience compares to Underrides if he does end up going through with it as well. If all goes as planned this could be a nice little account of what it's like going through this process only this account won't be produced or funded by those who are selling Ibogaine.

Fornow Im just gonna leave this thing closed until I get closer to actually getting on the plane.

Opiyum

04-22-2009, 10:59 PM

Well I found which clinic I'm going to be using and after talking to the bank I now know that I can get a personal loan for the amount needed if I am unable to save the money myself in the next two months.
I talked to the founder of this clinic for over an hour the other night and was impressed by how much he knew. Other than opiophile I normally don't run into people who know much more than your average junky myths etc.... Unlike a few other clinics who tried to sell me on iboga and say things like "oh your still young at 26. It's time to stop this huh?". Condescending bullshit. This guy was cool. We must have talked about ibogaine deaths for twenty minutes or so. Though they are normally just a result of the patient not being completely honest about heart conditions or other meds they are on.
Oh also they offer a second week stay for an extra 500$ which I may take advantage of. I mean...500$ for a room and food for a week in the tropics on the beach???you can't beat that. So an extra week can't hurt in my opinion. The main reason they do this is because Ibogaine in addition to interrupting your addiction and relieving 90% of the withdrawal symptoms it also resets your tolerance and potentiates any opioids taken soon after the ibogaine dose. Some people who did decide to use soon after have Overdosed because of this.

Anyhow...that's all for now....getting a little excited.

Opiyum

05-13-2009, 10:53 PM

Had a little hiccup yesterday that may postpone my treatment.
I was arrested yesterday purchasing 24 bags off one of my dealers.
Thankfully he got away but I was not so lucky.
I was charged with simple possession, poss. with intent and receiving.
This may effect my ability to get a passport and leave the country let alone the county.
The new financial burden shouldn't be a problem because I have secured the knowledge that I can borrow what is needed for the treatment from my annuity.
I am still very determined and have been working on a lot of different things that I will hopefully be revealing for the benefit of the site after my treatment.
ACJ Holding cells suck horribly. The last 38 hours (having just posted bail four hours ago) have been dreadful but I remain intact fellow philes.

More updates on my charges and how they will effect this little journey will be provided soon.
I hate hate hate to think that when the time comes that I am to maintain myself on short acting opiates for two weeks prior to my iboga dose, in order to get off the subs, that I could possibly get busted again. I am going to do what I can to get through with prescribed narcotics but with the cost and difficulty being what they are I dont see how I can get by two weeks without heroin.
Wish me luck.

Opiyum

05-13-2009, 11:13 PM

Oh and a little side note. I swear to god that one of the dudes I was locked up with was that dude Oreo ( I think that was his name) from the HBO Black tar heroin documentary.
He was the dude of mixed ethnicity (at least I think) and was hooked up with that girl who was extremely pale.
He looked so similar to the guy from the Doc that I found myself starring at him inappropriately a few times. I was shocked at the similarity and dude was a junky too.

Opiyum

05-26-2009, 10:11 AM

Well it's all piss and shit from here on out.
Because of my recent legal problems I am going to rehab in the next two or three days. Where I don't know yet.
So what happens on the other side of that I don't know but if things do work out and I can get and stay clean then I saved myself 5 grand or so. Otherwise Ibogaine isn't going anywhere so I can always try it some other time.
So I'm gonna unsticky and unclose this and wash my hands of it for now. I talked to the owners of the place I was going to go to and they were very nice and wished me good luck.
Sorry to those who were looking forward to an ibogaine trip report.
I'm not happy about his either.
Im

DreamSellerInc

06-09-2009, 09:44 PM

Damn man. That's more disappointing to me than you know. I really wish you the best in all your legal troubles, if you can get the P.W.I.D. dropped your problems should be over within the year. Maybe the rehab will give you a break long enough to drop the w/d's.

I've a strong interest in Ibogaine, ever since Hunter S Thompson expressed belief that Nixon's oppisition in the presidential election, i forget his name, was under the effects of a strong hallucinogen hailing from Africa, called ibogaine.

nick

06-10-2009, 10:24 AM

dharma bum

06-10-2009, 01:24 PM

Ed Muskie, yep. This writing was in "Buy the ticket, take the ride" or one of those documentaries about Hunter S. read by Johnny Depp.

Sorry it didn't work out but like you said the Ibogaine will still be there. Hopefully, rehab will pass quickly and just might work for you. It sounds like you want it to....

Good Luck Opiyum

Duckfeet

06-10-2009, 04:54 PM

I'm terribly sorry about the legal shit...I hadn't really read this thread much--I don't like Ibogaine--but I wanted to see how you were doing with it, and *damn* you had some bad times in there...and all say this: of prison, and county jails all over the damn south, etc, etc...there is *nothing* worse than a holding cell: I've been in one, for oh, 12 hrs the most, in Orange County, and it's the worst jail ever: i'd rather be--and have been--in some East Texas rathole cell, than in a holding tank...but fortunately, that shouldn't happen again...

Best wishes in rehab, u know, keep an open mind, is what they told me...and take a big book you've been wanting to read...I remember taking "Crime and Punishment" w/me haha...and they got all pissed off 'cuz the intake nurses saw some "devils" or something on the book jacket and figured it was some kind of "satanist crap" or something...Poor dostoevski....

Best wishes, my friend...I wasn't that interested in the Iboagaine deal, but I'll start keeping an eye on this one...again: rehab...most times I kind of enjoyed, except for the first day or two, if I was kicking, but I liked the groups and shit, kind of funny, sometimes, and you always make pals...and girls were pretty, and u know...well, have fun...

Opiyum

07-15-2009, 04:00 PM

My name is DiMiTri and I am an addict....
So one thing I started scheming while in rehab was to have swim continue extracting DMT when I got home to see if I noticed any therapeutic effects or healing effects from it. I realize that there is no documented evidence that DMT has or ever had any healing properties especially in the area of addiction but not having access to Iboga Hcl is making me try to reach out in other ways.
While the two trips swim took today were very therapeutic (in a general sense) during the trip unfortunately there are no lingering effects of DMT other than very sore lungs
I say therapeutic because the one thing most addicts, especially opiate addicts, always wish for or ask for when getting clean is just a few minutes of relief. I would say just gimme a little oxy and then fifteen minutes ill let you fire me up with some Narcan. The DMT seemed to provide that. Granted I'm not in withdrawals nor am I experiencing any Paws other than my skin crawling once or twice a day (mostly in the heat) and my GI tract has yet to rebound, incidentally one other thing I noticed from kicking this time is that my sex drive has yet to come back in the past it only took a few weeks for that to come back but now I've been opiate free for 47 days and it still isn't back. I'm only 27 but I wonder if it has to do with getting older....getting back on track the DMT did provide 5 minutes of euphoria (all be it a different kind then we are used to) but regardless it was euphoria and it put swim in a state of joy and wonder that swim is not experiencing regularly, that's for sure. After the fact swim haves't noticed any change in mood or behavior but swim has only started smoking it as of a few hours ago and so far have only taken two hits equaling two seperate trips a few hours apart. So swim's going to try to maintain a morning and nighttime trip for the next few days to see what comes of it.
This may be difficult because one swim's freezer isn't as cold as swim would like it to be for precipitating and two swim thinks that the batch of root bark swim got was sub par quality. It could also be that swim is not taking the time to evap/concentrate the solution enough before the freeze precip. In any case swims yields have been sucking to the point that it's going to be hard to even maintain two large hits a day.
I will continue to post about this and what may be a possible new alternative for me to take Ibogaine in the near future. I am still planning on trying it but cannot see myself spending more than a grand on it considering I'm already clean and I won't be needing the withdrawal eliminating effect. So I'm gonna change the thread title to fit better what it is that I'm doing with this thread.
If anyone has any thoughts suggestions please do share.

Thanks for letting me share.

Wanted to quickly add that for me I will not account for the use of psychedelics when it comes to my clean date so if I ever refer to my clean date as being the five days that it is now (because of the jack and coke I had on the plance ride home) that doesn't count DMT or shrooms if I ever were to find any. This is something that I told my therapists in florida but I think now that I'm in outpatient Im not going to say it in group or in a 1 on 1 because they might not ever sign a certificate of completion.

Opiyum

07-16-2009, 05:09 PM

Had my first dose today during our lunch break and was able to get two large hits in (something I normally can't do) which provided me with a much more intense experience. The second hit has always been difficult for me because by the time you exhale the first your already in a state both physically and mentally that makes it hard to do anything. Nevertheless I got the second one in and because of this the euphoria was far more intense as was the body buzz. Normally I have trouble keeping my eyes closed while on DMT but this time I was able to it definately took me to another location so to speak.
When I woke up today and up until this trip I was not in the greatest of moods. I slept well but just woke up in a funk with racing thoughts and constant chatter going on in my mind. In group we had a new therapist that they were testing out on us and I didn't like her nor her message very much. She isn't in recovery herself and in the past few months I've noticed I prefer therapists and councilors who are in recovery.
After lunch, and my little journey, I was in much better spirits and actively participated in the first discussion we had. It was also one of those group sessions that you actually learn a lot from which I always like.
I'm not foolish enough to attribute this change in my mood and behavior solely to the DMT but it did seem to help me get out of that cyclical chatter that was going on in my head up until that point. The only other thing that has ever done that for me has been a breathing exercise which only seems to work sometimes being that I can only get into sometimes and other times I just can't get out of my own way. That or taking a walk has helped in the past. I've tried prayer because they say even if it feels ridiculous that it may eventually start to feel more natural and begin to work but even after trying it twice a day for over a week while I was in treatment it didn't seem to work. To me it always just feels as though I'm talking to myself.
Talking has also helped whether it was a craving or just anxiety but a lot of times I won't pick up the phone because of those things.
In any event the DMT did seem to help and I now think it best that I only use it when in these situations or mind set. Yesterday I had no other reason to do it other than It was the completion of my first pull since I've been home. I think it's because of this that I got nothing from it other than a reprieve from total sobriety. It was more of an escape and an indulgence yesterday than anything else so my idea to maintain two trips a day is now something I don't think would be wise nor is there any real reason for it.
So because I am still in good spirits and relatively calm and I have the rest of my night occupied with a meeting and then the last fifty pages of a book I've been reading I see no reason that I would take another dose.
That's all I got today.

Also if anyone is thinking "Why are you posting this stuff?" all I can say is Fuck you I do what I want! I kid but really this is me just taking one of my therapists from florida suggestions that I do some journaling. So not always will this thread be about just DMT but also my recovery and how and what is going on with it.
More for me essentially than anyone else, but if anyone dose find any interest in it that's good to I guess. Plus any feedback I were to get would also be great.
So that's all I got for today.

nick

07-16-2009, 05:16 PM

Maybe think about trying TM,bro.

and you're doing good,a day at a time and all.

Seedy

07-16-2009, 05:44 PM

Opiyum

07-16-2009, 05:55 PM

Yeah, good going bro! I've never tried DMT, would love to, the closest i've got to it is K, which is a definite mood enhancer, any psychedelics are good in the sense that they help you look at things in a different perspective. And funny what you mention about prayer feeling like talking to yourself - I've always thought of it as reprogramming your subconscience, which is why it can actually work.

Having gone through treatment for the first time I do now have a different opinion about prayer than I did before but it still didn't seem to work very well for me. It may have just been to soon after getting clean and maybe my mind was just to foggy (which it certainly was) and ye4t busy at the same time.
I think I will take both yours and Nick's advice and give both meditation and prayer another shot just to see how it works out now that I'm much more clear headed.
Thanks to both of you for your kind words and input.

squareone

07-16-2009, 06:01 PM

Russellmeboy

07-16-2009, 11:41 PM

this is a cool thread :). im very interested in ibogane...sounds too good to be true almost...
as for prayer, man i was NEVER into prayer, since i was a little little boy, been praying for the last few months and going to church, shits great! change your whole perspective on things, ahhh thanks god ;)
- Russ

underide

07-17-2009, 01:04 AM

Sorry to hear about your legal troubles Opy, and the fact that the Ibogaine therapy is not happening for you, or at least being hung up 'till further notice'.

I'm in a somewhat similar position myself really (concerning the Ibo therapy)
I had initially planned for it to happen in April/May, but that was planned over a year ago, and at the time of planning it i was already getting hooked on benzo's without really intending to.
Back then, i met the doctor who agreed to do the therapy for me, coming over from London and he seemed very cool and really easygoing, also seemed extremely knowledgeable in my personal view and not someone who is in it to make a quick buck.
So while he was over here, i met him for a talk and an assessment and we sort of set up a plan that i would gradually drop my methadone to at least 30 or even just 40mgs and when i feel that i'm ready for it to let him know and we would try to set up a concrete date for the actual treatment. He said once i'm on that relatively low methadone dose that i would have to eventually stop taking it for about 5-6 days during which he would provide me with minute doses of ibogaine to ease the WD symptoms, before actually giving me a 'tester' therapeutic dose and proceeding with the treatment itself
So we left it at that, and on my own initiative i had made contact with and met 2 people who have gone through the therapy quite succesfully over here.

Unfortunately things did not go according to plan for me, but not due to Ibogaine. I did manage to drop 10mg's of methadone from 85 to 75mgs (big deal, right :rolleyes:)
But I got myself seriously hooked on benzo's (due in small part to a worsening emotional state i was in at the time, i suppose)
So the treatment kept getting postponed.
I've tried to get off benzo's CT when it was already a little too late and that was pretty damn tough to say the least..Got back on them, tried to taper a few times but each time ended back up on a high benzo dose

So i let the doctor know what happened and at the time of talking to him i think i was taking about 100mgs of valium daily, and he said that it would be definitely 'unsafe' to do an Ibogaine detox being on that high of a dose of benzo's (plus the methadone)
So he told me that he was a little surprised that i had managed to get myself into such a mess so quickly, but told me that he needed me to drop both the benzo and the methadone dose down considerably for him to even consider having me go through it.
More importantly he advised me to seek pshychiatric help since clearly things got VERY out of hand very quick.

Well anyway, back at the end of May I finally got my clinic to put me on a benzo detox, but the doctor in charge only agreed to put me on 40mgs of librium, which is equal to only about 20mg's of valium.
Right before that, I did manage to do a quick taper from 100mgs to 60mg's of Valium over about a month's time, but going from that to just what they gave me at the clinic was pretty painful, so i had started taking Zimovane (Zopiclone) about 5 per day, and Ambien at night, to ease the transition (i could not sleep a day during the second week of librium detox, so i had to do something, but the doc would not agree to anything more)
So now i'm down to 20mg's of librium and 2 x 7.5 Zopiclones with an occasional Ambien at night
So the last couple of mohths have ben hell and it's not even over
I'm HARDLY able to work a few days a week, but i am pretty determined to end this benzo addiction at this stage

Anyhow - sorry for such a long post in your thread (and most of it being OT). i guess it's been a while :P

I'm still looking forward to geting back on track and going for Ibogaine in the end, but obviously i have to get through this first.

Opiyum

07-17-2009, 08:03 AM

Opiyum

07-20-2009, 08:46 PM

Well. I'm sad to say that tonight I relapsed. I went to a meeting and saw an old friend there and after talking for awhile I learned that another one of our mutual friends (one I haven't talked to in close to a year) was doing dope again and that he just recently started shooting too. Hearing this made the bell in my head ring and it didn't end till I talked to this guy to see if he could spare a fit and unfortunately his answer was yes.
Now that I knew I could get a needle so easily rather than having to go to the exchange I got a solid case of the fuck it's and got 2 80's and the fit (a used one at that) and after boiling the fit for a few minutes I went ahead and fixed up 120 mg's to be safe (even though I'm quite certain 160 would not have killed me but I thought about how fucked it would be if 160mg of little old oxy did kill me...I don't think I could live with that) and it was great but not what I had been dreaming about, literally, for the last two months. I had reservations but was able to resist them. Tonight my will failed.
I peed in a bag to save my clean piss for tomorrow or the next day in outpatient if I get tested.
After using I decided to take a hit of my DMT (the little that is left remaining until I start another batch. I noticed no difference in the DMT trip because of the Oxy which I made a point to see because of the recent thread of nick's that was resurrected.
I think that opiates could effect things like mushrooms, MDMA and LSD or any other analogues and even probably would be noticeable when taking an MAOI and eating your DMT because it's more mild of a trip but when smoking it I think it's just far far far too intense of trip and far too quick both in how it hits you and how it soon after leaves (all effects being gone after 6-8 minutes. All that and with how overwhelming the visual and auditory hallucinations are I just don't think any drug could alter the the experience in any significant or noticeable way. It may have made the transition back to sobriety a bit easier but really the only thing that is bad about coming down is that it's like your waving goodbye to someone through the rear view window of a car and you know you may never see that person again.
This time though coming off of it I realized being honest tomorrow is the best thing for me. I have since dumped out the clean urine and resigned myself to just being honest about what I did tonight.
I'm also going to write about it in my journal (in addition to writing it here) just so I can see, in the future, exactly how this relapse began and how it ended. I want to be very specific on how the initial feeling came on and how that felt for the half hour after the craving set in.

I've also decided that I should definitely donate to the site again. For awhile there I was saying to myself "You've already donated to the site twice and you've done your part. Let someone else donate instead." but now I see that I obviously have money to spare if I'm able to spend a hundred dollars on two oxy eighties and if I have money to spare then why be so damn selfish. Why not contribute more to the place that has helped me so much in the past and is helping me a great deal here and now in the present.

nick

07-20-2009, 09:10 PM

Bro,everyone slips occasionally.So,don't beat yourself up about it because it really won't help.

You're at a crossroads now and what ever you choose I hope you find somekinda peace.

Oh and bro,I know you know what you're doing,but be very careful with dope.

Opiyum

07-20-2009, 09:35 PM

Thank you nick for your kind words. I appreciate it very much.

Opiyum

07-21-2009, 03:57 PM

To me listening to someone talking about and describing trips is about as interesting as listening to someone describe "This totally amazing dream" they had last night.

So I won't bore you with anything to long.
Today I think I had a certifiable "breakthrough" which is what the psychonauts over at the DMT Nexus call it. I forced myself to get two large hits and I think there was a good bit of resin from past hits that had recrystalized.
The onset was like being shot of of a cannon made of millions of layers twisting and turning geometric patters and unlike the other times there was an immediate ringing in my ear that seemed to respond to my breathing, Every breath I took seemed as though I wasn't the one doing it. In fact I lost any awareness of all of my senses which was replaced only by a universal sense and my body seems to be some sort of vesicle that I was wearing. It was totally foreign to me but I still had that amazing body buzz feeling as though I'm laying under a lead blanket on a waterbed but at the same time I was totally weightless.
My bedroom was still there but it was very hard make out anything I recognized. It had changed into what seemed like a long hallway with spinning walls ceilings and doors constantly replacing themselves with more and more intricate patterns in which every angle of every pattern shown bright lights....I didn't see any forms human or otherwise in a three dimensional space but rather faces and shadows and reflections of something psuedo-human within all the shapes and along the walls as I was flying through it.

That's the extent of what I can remember and when I came to I had tears streaming down my cheeks from what seemed to be complete wonder and joy and pure excitement the level of which these feelings came could in no way come naturally to me or as far as I can tell anyone within their first year or so of recovery. I was sad for a minute or so while the last of the visual distortions and the ringing in my ear started to peter out but over all today was an experience or more just a feeling that I don't think I will ever forget.

I've decided to put down the DMT pipe for awhile.
I still have yet to notice any diminishing qualities to the DMT as far as tolerance or intensity of the trip go obviously because today was by far the most intense yet. I also haven't felt any of the cracked out feeling that one gets after a night of tripping on L or taking a bunch of MDMA and dancing. No hangover or clouded mind whatsoever. I was very depressed today when I woke up because of my relapse last night but felt much better after my morning group and after my lunch trip. I have no desire to get high and took it upon myself to destroy the needle that I got last night.

I can't understand why this stuff isn't more popular than it is but am sort of happy that it isn't.

DreamSellerInc

07-22-2009, 12:51 PM

he explains later that it was a joke, watch his documentary's

NO FUCKING WAY?!?!?!?!!111 :rolleyes:

I've been keeping up with your thread man, and i hope everythings going well. we're right behind you

Papa Verine

07-22-2009, 02:59 PM

This has all been very interesting to read Opiyum.

I hope you keep up with your sobriety and most importantly, you find peace and happiness.

I completed treatmeant programs at least 4 times. The third time, I actually stayed sober for almost 4 years. Looking back on that time I have mixed feelings. I was happy, but I was also missing something, and I turned to gambling and sex as my new addictions during that time. So, with that being said, I'm not even sure I WAS really sober.

But that's not why I mentioned it. In all that time, I never *really* believed there was a God listening to my prayers. I faked it, and still hadn't made it. I prayed A Lot because that's what I was told to do, and I was being a good boy in AA. But... I never really bought into it. I guess that could explain why I never felt real peace and happiness. I was actually a fucked up person during those sober years. not exactly too proud of how I was treating other people. I got an ego... and that's never good for the other people around you.

I can ramble on and on about this. I just wanted to share some thoughts and wish you well.

Opiyum

07-22-2009, 04:58 PM

Thanks dreamy and papa.
I had a funny moment today in group I figured I'd mention.
The topic was the difference between Religious beliefs and spirituality.
I was the last to go so most of what I wanted to say had already been and after I was done talking we were breaking for lunch so I made it quick.
I said that to not only religious beliefs but just belief system in general are only good for setting limitations and are for the most part a crutch. An easy answer or solution to a problem that for whatever reason a person doesn't want to look at or work through blah blah blah....anyhow I then made the analogy in terms an addict would better understand. I said that religious beliefs are like an opiate. You know what is going to happen so there is no mystery, it's going to comfort you and eventually isolate you the same way that a strong belief will keep you from talking those with opposing beliefs.
Then I said how spirituality was more like a good hit of acid or some mushrooms. This of course got a laugh. I mentioned how it can be scary sometimes due to a fear of the unknown. It will take you places you never imagined and along with your mind it will open doors and shove you through them. I said a lot more I don't remember but I definitely took the analogy too far and started to let slip my interest in psychedelics.
Especially when I said "it can be an uncomfortable experience and sometimes it makes you look at yourself more honestly than you have liked but in the end it always amazing always a good thing." I heard some laughing and a few Gasps and looked up and realized I just said LSD is amazing and always a good thing while sitting in group therapy.
Some kid said "LSD is bad man I almost got hit by a train while I was tripping." I wanted to say your an idiot for not having any respect for something as powerful as L. I was gonna say how stupid he was for not taking it in a safe environment etc etc. but I just bit my tongue while a few people shared bad experience's (as a result of their stupidity and not a danger in the drug) with L and a few other things. I just nodded and smiled and waited for them to shut up so I could go eat lunch.

dharma bum

07-22-2009, 05:30 PM

Awesome thread. After reading this thread I watched a vid on youtube about DMT. I didn't get to watch it all but they mentioned that you might not be able to remember much of the trip. I guess that would have an effect on any insight you might have during your trip, or to make assessments after the trip. Often though...the positive effects I've felt from psychedelics were more of a feeling than anything else. I definitely wanna try the DMT. I know the Ibogaine is out of the question for me right now. I think a good strong trip would be good for me though.

Opiyum...any particular insights into your addiction that DMT helped uncover??

Fascinating subject though. I know you said you're gonna lay off the DMT for awhile but please keep us updated.

Opiyum

07-22-2009, 06:15 PM

Not any insights really because a lot of it I don't remember, at least the visual hallucinations I can't remember. I remember the feelings (as you said) and I do remember what the geometric patterns looked like and I remember just sailing through but all in all the specifics do get muddled after you come back to earth.
So no insights but it has helped a great deal with cravings and if I'm in a funk with the constant chatter going on in my head it will help with that too. I still have little aches and pains and the physical feeling of DMT is just as remarkable as the visual and auditory and that helps give me a momentary reprieve from any pain I might be going through. Not to mention it also helps with boredom. During the trip I'm obviously not bored and after it, most times, I am left in a state of shock and amazement and frequently have tears of joy running down my cheeks. Sometimes it's not that intense and sometimes I'm a little sad after the trip. Also the preparation, the extraction of it, is something that helps to occupy some of my time too. Granted it's not all that intense of a process but I am trying to learn more every time so I can get better yields quicker and that has me on the internet reading up on stuff a lot.
Once I either do a real big batch or am able to upwards of a few grams I'm going to start washing and purifying my product too. Right now I just smoke it with the plant oils that are pulled along with the DMT but I'm gonna start doing a few washes in the future because I want to get good at that and once I do I'm going to make a DMT salt, hopefully DMT fumarate, both so I can store it longer and I also am going to try out the ol' IV route. That is something I am going to want to have another person present for though.
I also wanna start fucking around with growing crystals. So obviously it's become a hobby for me and in my opinion a perfectly good one.
So everything I'm going through in the here and now it has helped very much but I haven't gained any insight on who I am and why I am that way. What is it I'm hanging onto in the past etc etc. but group therapy is helping with that.
Thanks for your kind words by the way.
I didn't think this thread would be as interesting as it apparently is to you guys. In any case I'm glad someone likes it.

Papa Verine

07-22-2009, 08:13 PM

It's intersting to read about your DMT reports. I've done it too. I even made my own, with Illinois Bundleflower root bark I picked myself growing along the Illinois River. I enjoyed extracting it myself, and enjoyed taking big hits like you are.

But, I stopped using powerful hallucinogens years ago. I did some damage to my brain, using lots of acid mostly. It doesn't happen to everyone, but I was left with a depleted supply of Serotonin. I was ramarkably improved with a common SSRI, and after tripping a few more times while on an SSRI, and feeling it take a few weeks for me to get back to "normal" every time, I figured I shouldn't fuck with them anymore. MDMA included... same problem.

I can only think of one other person I've known who seemed to fuck himself up with all the tripping too... most of my friends didn't have any problems like us 2 did. But I surely felt it, and paid for it for a long time. I'm still on an SNRI/SSRI today. And it all started and got worse with my acid use. I can't say DMT would do the same thing, I only did it a couple times as a novelty type thing, and preferred to just do acid after that. Got a good cheap source at the time... Stopped trying to be a chemist myself.

Maybe I'll try it again some day... It was pretty easy and I remember I got the instructions from a post on Erowid and made paper copies. Around here somewhere...

Edit: Shit I just remembered I had to travel 300 miles for the source... there's no fucking Illinois Bundleflower around here. I never found any. Fuck all what the USDA Plants database says... I looked! Damn...

Opiyum

07-22-2009, 08:25 PM

Oh don't use the QT method that is posted on Erowid if you were ever to attempt it again. That tek is way too complicated and takes far too long and only produces a very small yield. The most popular tek nowadays is a straight to base tek. Noman's is a good one. You can find it with the DMT wiki page.

underide

07-23-2009, 09:09 AM

Interesting stuff..
Never tried DMT..would definitely like to try it, but obviously not till i'm over detoxing and able too sleep at least somewhat normally.

Sorry to backpedal a bit to that long-dead horse but i think it could take another 'beating'. :P

I just wanted to say that before *some* of you begin to think that Opy, myself and anyone else here who might have an interest in using Ibogaine as a tool to detoxify oneself with and maybe even reverse both physical and psychological need for opiates/oids for good, think that we are simply guillible 'hippy' idiots with nothing better to spend our money on, i'd like to say that maybe some of you have been looking at it the wrong way

Some folks here seem to be a little judgmental or even plain 'stuck up' in their opinions based on the notion of "if it seems too good to be true then it probably is". Which is sadly true in a lot of cases, sure.
Or that one comment in this thread that really stuck out- "I don't like Ibogaine"
Have you even tried it? Gotta try something in order to like it or not. the poster (forget who, now) probably meant "I don't TRUST Ibogaine", which is fine by me.
And when it comes to me personally, a lot of people can reverse what i have just said and use it the same way by saying "No, but have YOU tried it?"
No I haven't tried it YET, but I do intend to..
I haven't tried it yet, but i've done an awful lot of reading and researching on this subject to be confident enough to give it a try.

And yeah, i am quite amazed at what it can *potentially* do for me and maybe many others too and what it has already done for a good number of people.
Problem is - most people distrust it outright without looking and digging a little deeper into it. like the fact that both animal and human trials have been very successful in a number of different countries with very different cultures.

There is also that fact that some people misinterpret what Ibogaine is
It's not a majic bullet cure all that sometimes people might think of it as. Some people do go back to their DOC after a period of time and any decnt Ibogaine therapist/provider should never deny that.

What it does seem to do though, for the majority of people who give it a shot, is detoxyfy them incredibly quickly (considering the alternative, especially with Methadone and Bupe) and pretty much painlessly from the WD/physical pain point of view
Sure there is the fact that some experiences might be hard to handle from a psychological point of view
But for me personally, the 36-40 hours of hard tripping to end a long addiction to heroin and methadone (and now benzo's) is definitely worth a try.

And another important factor - people should really do their best at chosing the RIGHT provider/therapist, because there people out there that are just in it for the cold hard cash, or maybe just inexperienced therapists, and that's where you get the most of unsuccessful treatments, horror stories and even sadder - fatalities

Anyways, sorry for the above rant ^^..
I do not hold grudges, and never have on this board so-far, so sorry if it seemed a little condescending towards the board in general, or just a few people in particular, but that wasn't my intent
And anyway - who cares about what anybody else thinks, right?
just get on with it already and do what YOU think is right for you (talking to myself here) :)
Not that i did care that much in the first place though...benzo's took care of that nicely..now it's back to cold reality

Papa Verine

07-23-2009, 09:23 AM

nick

07-23-2009, 10:04 AM

I agree with Underide,ibo is no magic bullet,but it gives hope to folks that don't have many options.I,personally,know several long term addicts,that one wouldn't expect would get clean,who have managed just that through ibo.

Opi,this is a great thread.The use of psychedelics post wd is fascinating and it's a real shame their isn't more research done in the area because it appears to offer valuable help in coming to terms with sobriety.
Psychedelics have been used to help the bereaved in the past and kicking dope is very similar to a bereavment.

dharma bum

07-23-2009, 01:04 PM

Opi,this is a great thread.The use of psychedelics post wd is fascinating and it's a real shame their isn't more research done in the area because it appears to offer valuable help in coming to terms with sobriety.
Psychedelics have been used to help the bereaved in the past and kicking dope is very similar to a bereavment.

I agree there. I think it's healthy to have a little hope but at the same time be skeptical of anything. But I think most addicts already think that way.

In my state's last election a well known, shameless pot advocate/smoking lawyer from Lexington ran for governor. His name is Gatewood Galbraith. Come to think of it he runs every time. He works with NORML and is an outspoken proponent of privacy rights, education, and civil liberties. Well, he was working with an organization called "Cures Not Wars". He said if elected he would offer free Ibogaine treatment to any addict who could pay for his/her own travel expenses...of course the libertarian didn't win..that would make too much sense. That would be too logical to fit into 'government'. Oh and he is friends with and can often be seen with Willie Nelson. He's badass.

This topic though--just thinking about the possibilities gives me butterflies...and hell, maybe even a little hope.

Good posts Underide and Opy...and don't worry about ranting. Rant on....yep. yep.

underide

07-24-2009, 09:15 AM

I haven't researched it enough myself. Thanks for your opinions Underride. I'm very interested myself... as I have an opiate addiction and my major hurdle in getting "over" it is the long kicking process and however long it's gonna' take to kick it the old-fashioned way. Then to have to live sober I guess will be just as difficult with or without the Ibogaine. but maybe not. Like I said I haven't researched it enough myself... but I'm very interested to hear back from you guys or anyone out there that gives it a try.
.

I totally agree here, PapaV.
Like it has been pointed out many a time here and there, that the detox is the easy part...staying clean aferwards,or even at least for some period of time, that is what counts.
Whether it be the good old taper or even CT or Ibogaine, or any other method, even if you totally succeed with being detoxified through any of the above methods, you're still gonna have to find something to fill that VOID that drugs like opiates, benzo's etc., have so efficiently and pleasantly filled for you before you detoxed.

And the doctor i was talking to about the Ibogaine treatment in my case has told me that it could do me an awful lot of good if i started to look for something that I can use to fill up my time with, after the therapy, since there is a real chance for anyone going through with the Ibogaine to end back using again over a period of time and sometimes even just weeks or even days after treatment, but then again, for others, Ibogaine has the capacity, it seems, to fully "rewire" their brains and more importantly banish the cravings or psychological want of Opiates, that they simply end up staying clean of opiates/opioids for good - one good and probably best known example of that is Dr. Howard Lotsof who used to be an opiate addict himself.

Whether the Ibogaine can do the same for me, like it did for people like Dr. Lotsof, and the 2 people i met and talked to about their experiences, remains to be seen

I guess I might be coming across as overconfident sometimes when talking about my Ibogaine treatment which is YET to happen, (or just talking about Ibogaine in general) but after all i have read, researched and witnesed (to some extent - through the people who have been through it and opnly talked to me about it), I guess I simply have high hopes for this treatment. But i would like to add that it's definitely not just blind faith either.
And I think I've found one of the best people to guide me through the therapy - i.e my Ibogaine Doc, who seems to be one of the more laid-back and very intelligent docs i have ever talked to on the subject of drug addiction and all that goes along with it. I would not be surprised if he used to be an addict himself.

Opiyum

07-25-2009, 10:35 PM

Well since my first relapse I have yet to use again and this is the weekend and I haven't been to outpatient since thursday. I go back monday but tomorrow will be going to a morning meeting and then attending an NA picnic in a large park nearby.
It's been a really great weekend and I'm just happy to have made it another day sober.
Thanks again for everyone's support here. I was not expecting it here. I was expecting to not be able to come here anymore when I got home but it has been quite the opposite. I've had quite a few people reach out to me.
much love folks.

Oh and I plan to try another trip sometime in the middle of this week. I have one more pull to freeze up on my last batch then I have to start a new one. Once that runs dry I think I'm gonna take a bit of a break before I order another batch of bark.
I may even try from a different source material just our of curiosity in addition to my mimosa. That and I've seriously been considering getting a Bufo Colorado river toad. I've wanted a pet anyhow but something that I could take with me to hotels when I work out of town and one of those babies would be perfect. Plus I'd like to see what the difference between pure 5MeoDMT and Bufotine is compared to the NNDMT I'm doing now is.

Shadowsblaze

07-26-2009, 12:38 AM

10 dots

Morfiend

07-26-2009, 12:42 AM

10 dots

success?

Shadowsblaze

07-26-2009, 01:13 AM

Of sorts.

Opiyum

07-26-2009, 09:02 AM

10 dots

You talking about snow globes on glass? If so how did they come out sludgy or crystaly?

dharma bum

07-26-2009, 10:58 AM

The Howard Lotsof reference was great. He seemed to discover it by accident..After waking up from it, getting dressed he realized he wasn't in w/d and the idea of being addicted to anything seemed ridiculous. He once saw heroin as a thing of comfort, after ibogaine he saw it as a thing of death.

There is a full documentary on youtube called Ibogaine: Rite of PAssage. I haven't watched it yet but it looks Okay..

Opiyum

07-26-2009, 02:53 PM

It's (Rite of Passage) pretty interesting...I think I made a thread about it on here awhile ago.

Opiyum

07-29-2009, 01:40 PM

I've decided to go back to inpatient. I just have too much time alone and don't have enough clean time. I'm not going to florida but to an inpatient place that where Im going to outpatient has. I'm just going for a week or so and mostly because I know how close I am to another relapse and that's not something I want to get into the habit of.
I'm just lucky I have the ability to do this. That my insurance will cover it.
I also am looking to get on an anti depressant for a short while.
Really I'm just doing whatever I'm told and after talking to my sponsor and councilor and after they both suggested inpatient again for a little while I couldn't say no.

Anyhow. See you guys in a little while.

Seedy

07-29-2009, 10:37 PM

^^ Best of luck!

This thread's got me fascinated, there's a couple of species of trees growing locally from which DMT can be extracted and the process isn't too complicated!

chopstix

07-30-2009, 12:28 AM

I haven't researched it enough myself. Thanks for your opinions Underride. I'm very interested myself... as I have an opiate addiction and my major hurdle in getting "over" it is the long kicking process and however long it's gonna' take to kick it the old-fashioned way. Then to have to live sober I guess will be just as difficult with or without the Ibogaine. but maybe not. Like I said I haven't researched it enough myself... but I'm very interested to hear back from you guys or anyone out there that gives it a try.

It doesn't have to be difficult, you just have to be ready for it, and ready for a life that isn't punctuated by chemical pleasure measured in weight. I've done it, I returned to dope for medical issues that I, nor my doctors, even knew where to start with, so I got back on H, and am off again after a 5 year run.

You have to want it, it's easy to be sick of being sick, but fully willing to fix to alleviate that. When you're tired of fixing to fix that, you might be ready. You really just have to be ready for a life without heroin, and then..

You gotta fill the void and be strong, because heroin and opiates fill that void like nothing else, and it's really easy to fall into the trap of thinking that *nothing* else is as good. Not true, but you have to let your body and brain repair the natural reward systems. You'll feel better after a year, then two.. Five years seems the real target for most, you make it 5 years off *all* dope and I bet you stay clean for life, if you want to.. I read once that about %10 of junkies walk away after about ten years, just get tired of it and quit. You typically won't hear those stories in AA halls, but they exist..

I have had problems with scripted pharms, and actually started out getting in trouble with them not long before I jumped back in with both feet, and will probably always need someone to monitor opiate meds for me. Can't take one, have to take 4.. That's probably gonna stick with me for life. But I CAN say no to heroin and oxy and methadone and dilaudid and opium, especially if I have someone that I can straight confide in and say "get this shit away from me" before I start with the lies and the sneaking..

Doesn't matter if it's Astronomy, biology, brewing beer, fucking the neighbor girl, restoring motorcycles, getting an interesting job, going back to school, ice carving, photography, mountain biking, remote control sailboats, flying 747s, your playstation, getting involved in something with your daughter, learning to play a musical instrument, excessive masturbation, a career in politics (hey, if Sarah Palin can do it..), fishing, paragliding, AA (ugh), all of the above, WHATEVER.. You likely won't stay sober, until you find something else that interests you enough to distract/occupy you long enough to over-ride the initial cravings, and then continue to fill the old void with interesting things... There's a whole world out there, ya ain't gotta spend your life staring at your shoes feeling dead to the world..

Your body will heal, and maybe there was an underlying cause all along.. I'm personally very wary of anti-depressants though.. But if you're healthy and not in CP, and even if you are in CP, there IS life after opiates IF you truly want it. I've done it and I know other, DIE HARD, gutter junkies that eventually walked away.. Some tired of the game, some locked up for awhile.. But don't for a second believe that junkies can't quit and lead normal lives... They certainly can, it takes motivation and patience.. Takes awhile to re-wire your brain.. When I got sober at 29, after nearly dying (again), it was 2-3 years before I really even remembered who I was.. It takes awhile, especially if you're in rough shape..

Opiyum

08-10-2009, 11:49 AM

So I've been fighting a war on boredom lately. I decided to stop paying my cable bill and will be glad once it is shut off. I went out and bought some books and last week I bought a mountain bike which I ride on the trail that is just outside my front door and have been enjoying that a great deal and I plan on getting back into my drums. I sold all my cymbals four months ago but still have the kit I just never moved it into my apartment. So Im going to go out and buy some used cymbals and some practice pads so the kit isn't too loud in the building and I'm gonna start playing again. I'm also planning on buying some tabla drums and I want to try and find a place I can take lessons for those. I've always wanted to learn how to play those.
Still doing Outpatient and I have been going to a meeting almost every night. I have 14 days clean now since my last relapse and am feeling generally very well. I have been sleeping very well too which is very nice.
I have continued to produce my DMT, which is certainly another hobby that takes a good bit of my time, but I haven't been doing any. I am in the process of saving up to the point that I have 2 grams (I've been doing rather small extraction). Once I do, which should be by the end of the month, I am going to start to purify what I have, probably 3 times over, then I'm going to do some crystal growing with one gram and with the other gram I'm going to make DMT fumarate for the purpose of IV and IM use. I am going camping this weekend and I plan on smoking 40-50 milligrams at night out in the woods.
I now know that DMT has no therapuetic properties for me. The use of it has helped a little bit with boredom and has helped me when I get into my own head a little too much but ultimately once I come back to a baseline there are no lasting effects or any great insight.
I am going to start looking into Ibogaine again. I am hoping to find a clinic that will give me a discount since I only want it for the craving and possible insight it will give me.
IF I can't find a deal then I have found a few sources for either root material or even Ibogaine HCl.
A friend of mine has just started off some Psilocybe spores and I look forward to giving those a shot once they are ready.

Opiyum

08-17-2009, 03:42 AM

Well I had my first nightmarish experience after smoking some of my product.
I hadn't done any for a little over a week and was planning on keeping it that way but I was reading some stuff that got me going and I decided to try to smoke more than I have ever in the past. The first hit was large but I didn't hold it in as long because I wanted to get two more big ones in. I got the second one in and it was way too big and I was unable to hold it in very long and had a coughing fit. At this point I was already completely out of my body and was instantly terrified. Coughing was very weird but the feeling that I always immediately have (which is that everything leading up to the onset in my life no longer mattered and all memories of who I am seem to completely vanish and I am destroyed completely and utterly shattered to the core, Obvioulsy I don't know what's it's like to die but death is really the best way to describe it) was far more real this time than in the past and far more terrifying. So this started things off badly and I was having an impossible time trying to regulate my breathing because my lungs hurt so bad and I couldn't take long slow breaths. On top of all this the absolute worst part was the taste of blood in my mouth. I'd never had this happen before and I thought that somehow I was injured and in need of medical assistance. I remember sticking my finger (what apparently was my finger into what I seemed to recall being my mouth or at least in the general area that I thought a mouth would be) into my mouth to then look at my finger to see if there was blood. There wasn't but I still tasted blood and was convinced that something was wrong.
I tried to shut it all out by keeping my eyes closed but I couldn't seem to control whether they were open of not and it didn't seem to make any difference because I really couldn't tell whether they were open or not at any given time anyway.
I think the main difference was that from the onset I was fighting the effect. I was trying to hold on and stay grounded in some sense (which tells me I wasn't ready to let go) but the harder I fought the worse things seemed to get.
Oh and I remember the, what feels like electricity flowing through your veins, was far more intense this time and it was all localized in my face, brain stem and the top of my head. Intense to the point of feeling as though my head was expanding and getting ready to blow up. If I have described this trial or episode correctly then I have made it clear that not only had I been completely destroyed in the first few moments but I seemed to be dieing throughout the experience over and over and in different ways for different reasons.
Two things I have learned from this. One. I'm no longer going to do DMT in my apartment. Any bad moments or experiences I've had on DMT have been when I did it in my apartment. Outdoors has always been better and I haven't had any anxiety or fear outdoors and two I'm not going to smoke DMT from a pipe anymore. If and when I do it again I'm going to try vaporising and collecting specific amounts of smoke in a funnel and then just taking one very very large hit and holding it in as long as possible.
Also I'm going to start purifying my product so it's easier to smoke. Sure you lose weight since you getting rid of all those plants oils and shit but it's all weight that is of no consequence anyway.
I have to clean it to make the acid anyway.

I never did find any sign of anything in my mouth which would have created that very real taste of blood and it went away around 20 minutes after I smoked. So ever after I came back to earth and my body and was only having mild visuals I still thought my mouth was bleeding.

Opiyum

09-05-2009, 07:59 PM

I'm starting to get very discouraged with all the contradictions I am hearing while in group therapy and in meetings.
I really have been enjoying Group therapy. Mostly the ones where we talk about what's eating each other and we get honest with each other. I was in tears one day when I was talking about something that has been haunting me for for almost ten years now. The people in group were very helpful as was the therapist. I worked through something that day and felt relief. I really like that stuff and I like doing what I can to help others with the same type of shit but it's when we start talking about the 12 steps and AA/NA that I start to tune out a bit. I was open-minded while I was in treatment in Florida for the forty-some days I was there and I remained that way when I got back but over the last two weeks things have started to change.
I just don't like hearing all about how this is a disease and then in the next breath the therapist starts to analyze someone who recently relapsed and begins telling them it was a choice. There was a whole process in going to cop and through that entire process they kept reaffirming that choice.
I don't like the self-fullfilling prophecy aspect of the program.
If you tell someone they are going to end up dead or in a jail or institution if they ever pick up again then chances are that is going to happen.
I don't like the bit about "Science hasn't done so yet" because there have been great leaps and bounds in the scientific community when it comes to alchoholism and addiction. Either they just don't know about it but worse than that if they do the are completely against it because it isn't "The program" and if it isn't "The program" than it doesn't work. That fly's right in the face of the spiritual principal of being open-minded and honest. Just because Naltrexone doesn't work for everyone doesn't mean it should be discounted so damn quickly. IF it works even 5% of the time then it is just as valid as NA and AA because that's how often they work though there is no way to truly know since they don't keep records.
Shit I won't even get into Ibogaine. That shit sprouts from the ass of satan himself as far as they are concerned.
I don't mean to generalize all members of AA because I'm sure there are those who are somewhat open-minded about these things and others but for the most part from what I've seen no one is. So from my perspective everyone is this way.

I haven't given up on it but these things and a great deal of other stuff is wearing on me a bit.

pain-pateint

09-06-2009, 12:11 PM

This is a great thread and I can't reconcile how I just came across it today! Thanks to you, Opiyum, for starting it and thanks to all who posted. While I have never done ibogaine and am more of a pain patient than a recreational user of opis, I have done quite a few psychedelics and RC's. With both of these, but more so with LSD or 'shrooms, I have experienced after pretty much every trip a noticeable decrease in the amount of pain meds I needed for up to a few days afterwards. A few years ago I went to a Dead concert having forgotten my pain meds at home and it was outdoor concert on a cool if not cold, rainy night. I was getting some WD symptoms by the time the conert began and was thinking this would be the worst experience I would have at a Dead concert (and out of 56 concerts, there have been some really dicey times!). We ate a bunch of shrooms in the parking lot and by the time we got into the ampitheather, I was trippin' pretty hard and they were playing what turned out to be a 20 or so minute version of "Ramble on Rose." I kind of completely forgot about being in early WDs, started dancing a lot in that unpaired way folks do at a Dead concert, yet was kinda dancing with a cute girl next to me. Long story short, didn't do any opi's that night, had no significant pain or discomfort, and this lasted throughout the whole next day. No pain, no meds, no pasaran Charlie;). Second day after, I had pain upon awkening, but not as bad as I usually do.

I wonder what would have happened if I tried to plan a trip for the primary purpose of lowering my need for pain meds rather than just trippin' and having a good time?

I think there is much to be learned about psychedelics and addiction/dependence on opiates. I really need to find a good source for RCs and psychedelics!

Also, would love to know more about extracting DMT.........though I think the brevity of DMT trips limit their value in dealing with an opiate/pain problem.

Best,

M

hovadagod

09-06-2009, 12:20 PM

Good thread. I wish people would get some experience with ibogaine... Is it really more dangerous than DMT? Can't ibogaine be procured?

Oh...and opiyum....you don't HAVE to write sentences like "I will continue producing DMT". It's just not good to put that kind of stuff in writing. I know that you know this already but come on man....one day you may read this thread and be like...."I could have used SOME code words...?"

I really hope iobgaine works because getting clean is a bitch.
'

Opiyum

09-09-2009, 06:14 PM

I suppose your right about maybe being a little more careful. I'll work on that.
As far as danger goes DMT is probably the worlds safest drug. The brain seems to crave that shit and just taks it in and spits it out very quickly.
The only real danger involved would be for someone who is prone to having a heart attack or stroke due to stress. Same goes for Ibogaine bet I do believe there are other risks involved I just don't know them off hand.
When smoked I'm sure DMT does a fair amount of damage to one's lungs. Anything that tastes that horrible has to be bad for you. I mean one large hit will make your lungs feel like they do the morning after a night of drinking and too much smoking. The tightness in your chest goes away after a few hours but damn is it rough.
Also when taking it orally having to take an MAOI to make it work that can be a bit risky. I can't remember what is traditionally used....I think its....Rue seeeds....Perigrum something or other.
Ibogaine is just something that is far more risky to take by yourself unlike DMT. Ibogaine can be pretty emotionally intense from what I've read so I wouldn't want to be in such a fragile state all by lonesome for such a long period of time.
IT can be procured in it's root form which is how the bwiti take it traditionally but I would want the Ibogaine HCl which is much harder to come by. I did find one place but all it was was an email address.

underide

09-10-2009, 05:09 AM

IT can be procured in its' root form which is how the bwiti take it traditionally but I would want the Ibogaine HCl which is much harder to come by. I did find one place but all it was was an email address.

if i were you (or anyone else considering this), i would be wary of those e-mail adresses claiming to be selling ibogaine
In most cases the stuff is actually bunk
But people do seem to get lucky every once in a while, apparently and that comes from a VERY limited supply

And 'm sure i don't have to tell you this - but please think carefully about taking Ibogaine on your own, unless it's a small, 'tester' dose just to try its' effects

Even if it's someone you can trust that is not a doctor or a nurse or anything, that would be a lot better than doing it just by yourself, but i'm hoping that's not what you intending anyway - remember ibogaine, at therapeutic doses causes ataxia or partial muscle paralysis, and as far as i know in some people it can be much more pronounced than in others.
It can also cause convulsions in some people, that's why a doctor or a clinic providing ibogaine therapy is the best way to go, since if a convulsion/seizure is violent enough they can administer intravenous diazepam or lorazepam to stop it in its' tracks

The doctor i've talked to about it said that he had a patient who during his treatmentafter his fifth or sixth capsule of ibogaine hcl, started to convulse violently and aparently it took a substantial dose of intravenous valium for the convulsions to subside
That's why a doctor or even just a nurse on standby is always preferable to 'clandestine' therapists

But, whatever you decide though - I wish you luck with it, Opyum, even if you decide to go through with it on your own

And i'm still hoping to go for it too (i had a nice conversation with my Ibo doctor just last week)
I doubt my therapy will happen any time soon
And I'd hate to set a concrete date for it again, since obviously the initial date for my treatment fell through - but i'm hoping 5-6 months from now it will actually happen - and that is just a very rough estimate (the doc told me to take my time) but you never know -
I might actually be ready for it sooner than that

nodrover

09-10-2009, 06:38 AM

Good luck with your quest, Opyium, I hope it all works out for the best. As for my experience with recovery and psychedelics, I can say that I have had some positive experiences. Twice with DMT, and once with LSD. I have also had some horrible experiences with both, but I think that can be attributed to the fact that I was going through full blown withdrawal at the time. It was really stupid of me to take a powerful hallucinogen with my body was going through such hell.

The most helpful experience I had came about a week after I had overcome all physical withdrawal symptoms, but had been suffering from constant cravings. It was like all I could think about was dope.....I kept reminiscing about all things dope. I procured a few small oragne globs of DMT, and used them as a means to straighten out my mind and possibly "overcome" the powerful hold opiates had on my psyche. You know how it goes with DMT..really, really, intense experiences, out of body, etc. To summarize without actually making a diary of my thought process during/after this "trip", I can say that DMT gave my mind a break from it's opio-obsession. Very powerful, helpful substance if used in the right way... anyways, thats just my two cents

trainwrecker

09-10-2009, 11:58 AM

It's funny this thread has been revived at this time, very synchronistic.

Last night I took what I hesitate to call a 'heroic' dose of fresh cubensis, about 90 grams. Lately I have been very concerned with quitting suboxone and have been wanting to do iboga. As most people who have looked into iboga know it is very hard to find, and very expensive to go to a 'professional' treatment facility. I have a special relationship with the mushroom spirit and I thought in lieu of iboga perhaps he could help me.

It was pretty far and away the most intense trip I have ever taken. There were many revelations over the course of the night, but the during the 'peak' I was able to communicate with the spirit and I heard/felt very good things. Basically he told me if I gave myself to the mushroom spirit, I would be accepted. I was told this somewhat verbally, but most of all in the intense good feelings in my body.

Let me put some context in here. I have recently become of the opinion that all plants have spirits possesing different natures. The nature of the poppy is dualistic; it makes you feel very good, but it insists that you serve only it. It is very possisive.

I can't speak from experience on Iboga, but from what I have read it is a 'cleaning' spirit. It is a root, earth-bound and mysterious. And it has the power to free you from a spirit that you may not be able to free yourself from: poppy, coca, alcohol.

The mushroom spirit is very mysterious as well, and I can't bullshit and tell you I know more about him than I do. All I know is last night the mushroom mimiced and even far exceeded the pleasure I get from opiates, and this morning I still haven't taken any suboxone. We will see how long it lasts.

If you read all that, congatulations.

hovadagod

09-10-2009, 12:43 PM

It's funny this thread has been revived at this time, very synchronistic.

...

If you read all that, congatulations.

Keep us posted/

underide

09-10-2009, 02:05 PM

I can't speak from experience on Iboga, but from what I have read it is a 'cleaning' spirit. It is a root, earth-bound and mysterious. And it has the power to free you from a spirit that you may not be able to free yourself from: poppy, coca, alcohol.

The mushroom spirit is very mysterious as well, and I can't bullshit and tell you I know more about him than I do. All I know is last night the mushroom mimiced and even far exceeded the pleasure I get from opiates, and this morning I still haven't taken any suboxone. We will see how long it lasts.

It's also worth noting that Ibogaine isn't just 'any other' Psychedelic, in a way that mushrooms, LSD, DMT, etc. are

Ibogaine can (supposedly) precipitate a complete 'rewiring' of your addictive physiology within your brain on both physical and psychological levels
It is still not clear just how Ibogaine is able to do that and obviously a lot more research still needs to be done, but as far as i understand there are two main components that make this substance work - the physical one - i.e the actual physical change that Ibogaine seems to catalyse within the brain - as evident in both animals and humans with the cessation of opiate/oid withdrawal symptoms and cravings within literally an hour after administering the ibogaine
and there's also the psychedelic/introspective element which is somehow also very significant towards addiction cessation/reversal
Both of these elements is what seems to make Ibogaine (again- supposedly) work

I find it absolutely fascinating what Ibogaine seems to have been able to do for a good number of long-term addicts, and the people i have spoken to who actually went through the treatment seem to have been changed on some very fundamental levels - one of those people i've met, had over 20 years of heroin and methadone addiction, which ended abruptly over a course of just a few days, all thanks to Ibogaine, apparently..Even if it seems too good to be true - I sincerely believe the guy and not just because i *want* to believe him

And still, I do agree that I might be a little biased here, since i haven't actually spoken to anybody for whom Ibogaine hasn't worked that great - I only spoke with those 2 people for whom it has, but maybe that is because i simply have a lot of hope for it and at least for me i think it is definitely worth a try...
There's also a lot to be said about expectations and preparations - if you have been shooting up gear and smoking crack just hours before the treatment it usually seems to fail..
In my understanding, and in my Ibo doctors' words - you have to abstain for a certain period (for methadone it's usually 3-6 days you have to abstain before the therapy, dependent on the dosage you're at - at least according to "my" therapist)

After all said and done, Ibogaine has been an incredibly useful substance for a good few folks, and there does indeed seem to be enough concrete evidence that at the very least, Ibogaine is a very quick way to detoxify oneself without going through weeks-months of painful withdrawal, and that is what i find absolutely fascinating, even if i do end up relapsing after being off it.