210 Natural Plants likely containing mu agonists

[Hammilton]

This paper is available for download if anyone is interested in it- I thought of Jacky when I read it.

Plants with central analgesic activity.
Phytomedicine. 2001 Jul;8(4):310-22.

http://artigocientifico.uol.com.br/uploads/artc_1146349999_70.pdf

The paper was put together by searching for studies that looked at plants and concluded they had an opioidergic mechanism (I assume by naloxone test). The size of the list is impressive, but it's only useful for finding papers you might be interested in.

If you see any in there you're interested in, you can join blacklight.in, PM me and I can make that paper available for download (I or someone else at blacklight have access to just about every one of them). At wiki.blacklight.in we'll have all of these papers for download soon.

Here's a very partial list (chosen because I'm so interested in psychotria colorata):


Phyllanthus niruri Euphorbiaceae Dried entire plant Brazil i.g. 0,31/ 504 mg/kg Santos,1995a
i.p. 30 mg/kg Santos,1995a
Phyllanthus sellowianus Euphorbiaceae Dried entire plant Brazil i.p and i.g. 0,54 and 251 mg/kg Santos,1995b
Phyllanthus tenellus Euphorbiaceae Dried entire plant Brazil i.p and i.g. 0,54 and 50 mg/kg Santos,1995b
Phyllanthus urinaria Euphorbiaceae Dried entire plant Brazil i.p and i.g. 0,34 and 121 mg/kg Santos,1995b
i.p. 10 mg/kg Santos,1995b
Pimpinella anisum Apiaceae Dried seed Iraq i.p. 150 mg/kg Twaij,1987
Pinus koraiensis Pinaceae Leaf essential oil China i.p. 0,217 ml/kg Jiang,1988
Piper abutiloides Piperaceae Fresh leaf Brazil i.g. 1 mg/kg Costa,1989
Piper cincinnatoris Piperaceae Fresh leaf Brazil i.g. 1 mg/kg Costa,1989
Piper lindbergii Piperaceae Fresh leaf Brazil i.g. 1 mg/kg Costa,1989
Piper longum Piperaceae Unripe-dried fruit China i.p. 125 mg/kg Pei,1983
Piper methysticum Piperaceae Not specified Australia i.p. 150 and 250 mg/kg Jamieson,1990
Dried rhizome i.p. Jamieson,1989
Dried rhizome-root i.p. Jamieson,1990
Piper umbellatum Piperaceae Dried leaf Congo i.p. 5 ml/kg Bioka,1990
Piscidia erythrina Fabaceae Dried bark USA i.p. 600 mg/kg Aurousseau,1965
Platycodon grandiflorum Campanulaceae Dried root Roumania s.c 2 mg/kg Racz,1982
Polygala cyparissias Polygalaceae Dried leaf-root Brazil i.p and i.g. 3; 50 and 100 mg/kg De Campos,1997
Polypodium vulgare Polypodiaceae Dried root India i.p. 300 mg/kg Mannan,1989
Pongamia pinnata Fabaceae Dried root India i.p. 50 mg/kg Singh,1997
Portulaca grandiflora Portulacaceae Dried aerial parts United Arab Emirates i.p. 400 mg/kg Islam,1998
Portulaca oleracea Portulacaceae Dried aerial parts United Arab Emirates i.p. 400 mg/kg Islam,1998
Prunus spinosa Rosaceae Dried branches Spain i.g. 750 mg/kg Lasheras,1986
Psammosilene tunicoides Caryophyllaceae Dried root China s.c 5 mg/kg Song,1981b
Psidium pohlianum Myrtaceae Leaf essential oil Brazil i.g. 40 and 100 mg/kg Santos,1996
Psychotria brachypodia Rubiaceae Dried leaf Brazil i.p. 350 mg/kg Leal,1996
Psychotria colorata Rubiaceae Dried flowers Brazil i.p. 25 mg/kg Amador,1996
Dried leaf i.p. 15,6 and 20 mg/kg Amador,1996;
Elisabetsky,1995
Pterocarpus indicus Fabaceae Aerial parts India i.g. not stated Abraham,1986

[Narkotikon]

I read somewhere a long long time ago (like in 2004 I think) that the herb / spice Saffron is supposed to do something like this. Somehow it involves the opiate receptors. But does anyone know how expensive Saffron is? It's the most expensive, or one of the most expensive, herbs / spices there is. It's basically the stigma of certain crocuses I think. It's used in paella for instance. It's very tasty, but damn, it's too expensive to do anything with it. Not that I think it would do much even if you did have a large amount. I think it's interesting to hear about these herbs and stuff that have effects on the opiate system, but in reality it's not like these are actual drugs, are they? I mean, aren't they more important for scientists to study and find out what chemical in there is causing the opiate-effect, and then maybe they could synthesize the chemical? I guess it would ulitmately depend on the concentration and potency of said chemicals. I don't know, I find this stuff interesting, but I wonder if it isn't more important for researchers / scientists than your average drug user. I can certainly say that when I read that stuff about Saffron, my junky brain got all excited thinking I could go to any store from now on and get high. I just don't think many of these are useful in the long run by themselves as is, unless maybe you have large amounts, and then you might get unwanted side effects. But I'm not an herbalist. I will say that you can't just buy Saffron anywhere. I think in the US it's a somewhat uncommon spice. Like, you're not going to be able to find it in your local Krogers in the spice aisle. It's more like a boutique kind of thing. For instance, I know Dean and Deluca sell it, but it's also something like 20 or 30 dollars for a gram of Spanish Saffron. I mean, you could buy 2-3 bags of dope for that.

But, overall, very interesting. Thanks for the info.

[bigNasty]

I For instance, I know Dean and Deluca sell it, but it's also something like 20 or 30 dollars for a gram of Spanish Saffron. I mean, you could buy 2-3 bags of dope for that.

I've been getting buns of Saffron for $150 and i thought i was getting ripped off....guess i was wrong

[Narkotikon]

I've been getting buns of Saffron for $150 and i thought i was getting ripped off....guess i was wrong

Is this a joke? If so, LOL. I'm assuming it is. What would you need with bundles of Saffron?

Edit: wait, you mean H instead of saffron. I'm so dense sometimes. My bad. This was a joke.

[bigNasty]

Is this a joke? If so, LOL. I'm assuming it is. What would you need with bundles of Saffron?
yeah i was kidding. Something about $20-30 per gram was funny. It better get you high for that kind of money

[Narkotikon]

yeah i was kidding. Something about $20-30 per gram was funny. It better get you high for that kind of money

I know! Saffron (as a spice) is just fucking ridiculously expensive. I can't imagine what you'd have to pay to get the opiate-effects from it. You might as well just buy heroin.

[alowishus]

It's the the dried stigma of a crocus.
All picked by hand.
That's why it's sooo much $$$

[Thebane]

It's the the dried stigma of a crocus.
All picked by hand.
That's why it's sooo much $$$

Who wants to eat the sexual organs of a flower anyway?? :confused:

[Indy]

Saffron is delicious. They keep it with all the other spices in grocery stores. I've always thought that it'd be incredibly easy to steal some and sell it on ebay for massive profit. Not that i would do something like that, but it'd be easy.

[Narkotikon]

Saffron is delicious. They keep it with all the other spices in grocery stores. I've always thought that it'd be incredibly easy to steal some and sell it on ebay for massive profit. Not that i would do something like that, but it'd be easy.

If you can find it in a grocery story. I've never seen it in an average run-of-the mill grocery store, like Krogers or Meijers or Wal-Mart. They do have it in specialty stores, like Dean and Deluca and probably Williams and Sonoma and places like that, but damn, not only is Saffron expensive, so are those stores.

But, yeah, Saffron is delicious. If you don't mind paying five dollars or more to have it in a dish you're cooking. I went on Dean and Deluca's site yesterday. Currently they're selling a gram of Spanish saffron for $26, and they're saying one of their most favorite ways of using it is simply sprinkling it on scrambled eggs. Those would be some damned expensive eggs. I mean, the saffron used would cost more than the eggs.

[jacky]

yeah, this is an interesting paper to say the least.

it sounds very similiar to another pdf that reviews some 70 plants with central analgesic activity, and at first I thought I had already seen this paper, and was about to correct the title with a post, but I looked into the PDF and realized that I had not seen this report yet.

looking it over of course, as basically a data cache by the authors, I notice many of the plants we have discussed before. there are a few that I have tried in various forms...most of which just are not that interesting from a opiate addicts point of veiw, but all interesting in a scientific outlook.

I wouldnt say that the 210 plants listed here are likely containing mu agonists, I mean, looking into some of the data that is out there on some of these plants, its obvious that there is contradictory evidence, for example sophora subprostata....
more likely I think you have a very complex situation, of indirect activity, cholinergic interaction, mixed agonist antagonist activity, mu agonist, delta agonist, kappa agonist.

I know that with picralima nitida the data is confusing...mu and kappa agonist and antagonist activity.

looking over this list is exciting for sure.
basically a few of us have been slowly compiling a list such as this for the last few years, and I know that this list contains certian species that are similiar to ones that I have researched recently/in the past that are not listed here...so this is exciting for me to see that some proffesionals have gone and at least tried to focus on the reports that apply to opioid activity possibly....and with good reason consider the opioid interaction paramount to this type of research with analgesic plants.

I think many of the drug companies want to steer clear of opioids, and focus on calcium ion channel blockers/interrupters or anti inflammitorys, or at least some of the american companies.

THANKS for reporting this paper!!
its so closely titled to the other paper that is similiar, that I think I have passed this up for at least 5 years of researching, thinking that it is the same old paper that I had noted.
the other paper goes into greater detail, but only focuses on a smaller number of plants, and out of those, only 15-20 purported opioids.

I think some of these might be nmda antagonist by their main activity as well, I notice piper nigrum and some of those VERY interesting psychotria species are reported to have nmda antagonist activity recently.

this is great.
my organization of notes on opioid interactive/possible/purported/traditional analgesics is all over the place.
I think to date I have noticed about 30-35 opioid active/purported active plants, or which probably 1/3 are commercially avialable.
trying some of them, thankfully at one point with the aid of a competent chemist, was some fun exploration.
most however, turn up very little activity, or even worse, dysphoric effects!
like with dalea purpurea.

of the most interesting I have tried.
chaste tree
myrrh
picralima nitida

and of course kratom.

yeah, this list is great.
I notice one group of similiar species is listed....the eleaocarpus, but I notice the specific species that I am studying (e. grandis) isnt listed, instead several others are.
with these plants, many are purported to contain grandisine type compounds, some of which are delta opioid agonists.
I found which particular one was thought to contain the strongest of the grandisine types, and was actually able to source plant material from a contact in Australia. sadly my old colleage in study, the chemist, is so busy now I dont think he has time to extract this one.
but at least I have a source for this otherwise, non commercially avialable leaf product.

yes, the potential is awesome.
and think about this...

if this list is possibly around 240-250 known possibly and proven opioid active plants, and this is published in 2001, and we know that there are MANY novel plant compounds and species yet to study, well, the odds figured in my head say that in 10 years time, we will probably have noticed another 210 plants, and eventually probably on the way to finding over a thousand opioid active species.
out of that thousand, even if only 5-6 species are really solid, interesting (fun) and applicable materials,
we are still that much further ahead.
its great.

the drug war CANNOT hope to put a cap on natures production of analgesic compounds in the end. they may try, but when you are starting to consider a decent portion of plants that are important in the eco-system # 1, and also important to trade, food, medicine and finally RECREATION, are a large part of our commoditys of natural products, then people en masse might start to think twice about prohibition.

especially when we are looming on the doorstep of the micro/nana technological revolution!!

I am glad I took the time to check my facts on this one.
tonight will be a long night of checking facts.
GREAT PAPER.
this one deserves some sort of opio award.
the golden herbs award.

[jacky]

who wants to eat the sexual organs of a flower anyway?

well,.....
what about poppy pods,
and cannabis flowers
to start with....then we can consider all the other plant parts that happen to be sexual organs that comprise this list of plants that may hold so much potential for opioid interests.

I for one, dont care what part of the plant contains the goods...
oral consumption of a poppy cock isnt beyond me.

[Narkotikon]

Hey, Jacky, do you know if the pod part of the poppy is a female or male sexual organ? I'm assuming it's female, because it produces the seeds. If so, that would be the only time in my life that I've ever (or ever will) eat a vagina. Hehe :D

[jacky]

the stamen is the male part of most flowers, that and the ducts that produce the pollen.....

the swollen, ripe, puffy pod, is like the womb.......

the juices that spill forth, the sweet seductive menses
,oooh to flip through the pages of the languid labia,
leaves rustle, petals quiver,....

anyway...
not to turn an otherwise scientific thread into just another tainted hedonistic opiophile post....
but you should really, really try one of these times, to taste the female organ of completion,
to drink from the glass of conception.
there is a reason that poppy seed tea and some womens vulva have a similiar scent....maybe.


anyway,
I noticed that on this paper, it states that a variety of different assays were used to test the plants analgesic activity, many were animal model tests, tail flick, hotplate, etc etc.
there were also the naloxone reversed tests as well....but not all plants here were put forward to the naloxone test.
that is the only reason otherwise that I make a small correction when considering the title...
I WISH that all the tests were confirming that there were 210 mu active opioid containing plants....but it was merely one of the assays that they collected data on.
almost half of the report was just the resource listings....so they did at least provide specific info for when one is looking up each herb to collect further data.

[jacky]

two plants on this list I will mention...

nigella sativa oil....they used 1 mg to 1 kilo for their assay!
this is one of the more active purported opioid substances that I have researched. the seed itself is so high in oil content, that I think one could just as easily work with the seed as the oil.
I even have a good supply of one of the purported active components of this plant, thymoquinone.
this material really helps kill pain, and if you are already using opiates/opioids, watch your dose, I have taken too much nigella products before, and gotten the typical "too much" feeling in conjunction with my regular regimine

the other is morinda citrifolia...a purported opioid interactive plant material.
the juice is very expensive, and is quite a "fad" item in the heatlh food stores.......the plants root and leaf and fruit material is sometimes avialable for considerably cheaper prices as a whole dried herb material....I have taken both....and I "seemed" to feel a potentiation of the regular opiate regimine I was one.
this one is like a tonic, and the juice itself isnt bad tasting.
only a small amount of juice is needed....but beware of the type of product you get, most juice companie sell watered down, ineffective materials. look for the most potent product by readin labels and try and find the company that uses a plain, old school herbalist type of marketing. sorry, I forget the name of the particular company that produces the best juice.

I have started the fact checking on this list.
I circle the name if I find positive purported opioid activity
I check it if I find none, and check and circle if I find other possible interesting activity possible related to the opioidergic system.

while I was looking up facts, I found a purported opioid active plant that is NOT on this list...
muntingia calabura a possible mu opioid, b adreneric, muscaranic active leaf material.

that is the other great thing about this list....just fact checking down the list we will probably find a few other opioid actives that are not listed.

it will probably take me a few months to get through this list entirely....

[Indy]

Hate to be a party pooper, but i'm cynical about all of these. I mean kratom really is a mu agonist, but most of these are just plants that HAPPEN to have a weeeeeettttle tiny bit of a chemical that was found to have some activation of the mu receptor. picralima nitidia(sp) is another one that sounds interesting as it's actually used as an opiate would be in africa. I keep planning on trying it some time but i don't have that much money to just "test" stuff right now.

basically, it's like when you hear about how milk has opioid peptides in it (also non-peptide opioids but thats kind of a touchy subject), you get all excited, then realize that peptides really only work in the brain....and it's in incredibly small amounts. I mean it's cool that it's like that, and it's REALLY interesting for RESEARCH purposes, but ultimately, i hate to say it, kinda useless for our purposes.

[alowishus]

If you can find it in a grocery story. I've never seen it in an average run-of-the mill grocery store, like Krogers or Meijers or Wal-Mart. They do have it in specialty stores, like Dean and Deluca and probably Williams and Sonoma and places like that, but damn, not only is Saffron expensive, so are those stores.

But, yeah, Saffron is delicious. If you don't mind paying five dollars or more to have it in a dish you're cooking. I went on Dean and Deluca's site yesterday. Currently they're selling a gram of Spanish saffron for $26, and they're saying one of their most favorite ways of using it is simply sprinkling it on scrambled eggs. Those would be some damned expensive eggs. I mean, the saffron used would cost more than the eggs.


Couldn't see not finding it at Krogers or Wal-Mart. But anything in a store and ib a plastic bag aint worth it. Buy online and buy from GOOD site. Saffron will lose much of it's taste quick.

[losangeleslifer]

Hey, Jacky, do you know if the pod part of the poppy is a female or male sexual organ? I'm assuming it's female, because it produces the seeds. If so, that would be the only time in my life that I've ever (or ever will) eat a vagina. Hehe :D

I was about to post "you dont know what your missing!", but then I remembered another post of yours, and you DO know what your missing.:D

[Narkotikon]

I was about to post "you dont know what your missing!", but then I remembered another post of yours, and you DO know what your missing.:D

LOL. Well, I've never experienced it (thank god), but yeah, I'm pretty sure I'm not missing much. Don't get me wrong, I'm cool with others liking it, it's just not for me. I'm definitely more of a tea drinker than a coffee drinker when it comes to that. Tea with cucumber sandwiches, scones, clotted cream and jam, with an improper outright pinkie finger if you get my drift. :D

[Narkotikon]

Couldn't see not finding it at Krogers or Wal-Mart. But anything in a store and ib a plastic bag aint worth it. Buy online and buy from GOOD site. Saffron will lose much of it's taste quick.

I've never actually bought saffron. I've had it in food that other people have made before, and I like to cook, but not so much that I'd spend $30 on a single herb. I guess it could be found in groceries, but I know the major ones around here don't sell it. I just can't see a place like Wal-Mart selling a gourmet spice / herb. I mean, it's not that common in cooking (at least in the States) and the only people who seem to use it are foodies, chefs, and gourmands, so maybe that's why. I do know specialty stores sell it, but again, I don't have that kind of money. I suppose if I were to buy it, I'd order it from Dean and Deluca. Their stuff is always good, if only pricey.

Yeah, I've heard of "lesser" quality brands of saffron actually being adulterated by strands of fibers. Like threads. It's funny to me that they'd adulterate a spice to make it weigh more, like they would with a drug, but that's how expensive this stuff is.

[poonwhalla]

It is funny that they add cheaper shit to food but not that uncommon. I have put extra breadcrumbs in common foods like tuna salad to add more volume at places that sell them for way too much

[Indy]

Saffron is more popular than you'd think, i don't think i've ever been to a franchise grocery store that didn't have it, including wal-mart.

[Narkotikon]

Saffron is more popular than you'd think, i don't think i've ever been to a franchise grocery store that didn't have it, including wal-mart.

Maybe it's different where you are. Around here they don't.

[jacky]

I think the potential of a plant having a recreational value compared to street opiates/opioids/ pharmies is going to be low, I wouldnt say I am cynical about the potential, but I have tried enough reported opioid active herbs to know that many times we are either missing the mark, or there really isnt that much potential for something to cause euphoria...

but on the other hand, as agents that might augment tolerance, I would say the potential is ENORMOUSE...
as agents that might boost the potential for those who are suffering with real pain, I would say the potential lies in the fact that people with knowledge could use these plants to circumvent the control that the authorities have over our access to pain meds.

even the now common knowledge that poppy seeds could have appreciable amounts of opiates in them is old hat for most learned "online" junkies.
but the reality is still there, if you work at it, there is OTC morphine for those who can afford to invest and actually end up paying far less for morphine and codeine than anyone else does besides the drug cartels or the drug companies.

the potential in red clover lies in its possible analog compounds that might actually have some potent mu activity.
the potential lies in the future I would say with this issue.

still, I have found that chamomille, kratom, chocolate, whole organic milk, bacopa, ashwaghanda, a certian type of klamath algea, all can radically help a person withdrawing from morphine.
with the aid of these foods, and herbs, and some vitamins, I was able to sleep, eat, work, deal with emtional issues like packing up my grandmas trailer and moving her into a care facility, not to mention the traveling that I had to do....all done while going through morphine withdrawl. I remember I had some myrrh, salvia divinorum, and some loperamide as well...
it was amazing how much different it felt from the old days.

but in the old days, I was always unhealthy, didnt eat right, didnt have money for vitamins, didnt drink enough water, etc etc.
all that left me with a withdrawl that was impossible to deal with.

this time I around I realized that no amount of kratom would cover all the withdrawls.
but its still something I treasure over the old days, of being ignorant of the greater possibilitys.

I think with alot of these plants, there are so many variables.
some of them might have more activity, but we deal with some variation in natural potency.

and many of them I think will only be effective when combined with other substances and actions.

look into the herb concoction "Heantos"....a blend of herbs that suspends addiction in some people.
amazing stuff.

we are just in the infancy of the whole of opiate/opioid research anyway really, at least from a pharmacological standpoint.
we have had a few thousand years of cultural study in comparison!

the list will grow I guarantee, to include some euphoric compounds/herb materials, it may take a few more decades, it might take the right dose, or cleaning out certian compounds that are antagonistic.

if someone would clean the damn opioid antagonist compounds out of coffee I could drink the stuff, but unless I am on methadone, coffee tears my stomach and guts to shreds.....

I think the same could apply to this picralima nitida plant. some of the compounds alone seem to have potential....but in the whole plant material is almost inactive in research.
I have consumed the seeds in ground, whole form, which I will never be able to stomach again, and in extract form. the mental effects were small. the nausea was prominant, but no purging happened. alltogether not worth it.
I think that the reason people use them in Africa, is because they have little other options maybe, too poor to afford better medicines.
I cant imagine how much of that seed you would have to shovel down to really do anything for major pain.
I hear reports that they just grind and gel cap them (if your lucky). having swallowed some 20 grams of seed material, and having little activity, I wonder how much is an effective dose for the common user?
it cant be as much as I took.....udderly the most bitter and impossible substance I have ever consumed.

from a junky standpoint, this type of research is pointless sure.
that is the problem.

I imagine that I have spent over 6000$ researching plants in the last 8 years....most junkys cant even keep up with a habit, much less spend 6000$ to find out something doent work. its a labor of love I guess.

I think some of the psychotria species that are now becoming avialable for purchase might hold some real potential.

my main interests are to find plants that suspend tolerance, reduce tolerance, and potentiate the opiates in our bodys, and the ones we take as exogenouse opiates/opioids.
I think morphine and codeine, at least for me, are the perfect opiates...when you are able to consume other substances to augment the effects of these compounds, addiction and tolerance are changed. it opens up other avenues...
or at least it allows one to get ahold of their addiction.

if you want some possibly interesting opioid effects, check out salvia divinorum, or consume 500 milligrams of menthol, huff myrrh powder, or insuffilate the 5x extract of myrhh.....chaste tree extracts can have some serious psychoative effects( a tribe in brazil worships the chaste tree as a type of jurema)....I am sure this list will grow and grow....but we still may be chasing novel effects only...
the truly euphoric opioid in nature is probably a rare gem for sure.

recently I have been looking at these sticks I have smeared with natural frog peptides, a stick about 4 inches long and a half an inch wide...that has about 30-40 doses on it.
dermorphin and other opioids are in this frog venom and plant extract slime, that dries to a nice non stick sheen....
I dont think anyone has looked into the possibility that these opioid peptide containing venoms could arrest possibly, a persons opiate habit.
science has proven that pure dermorphin can hold off morphine withdrawl. but pure dermorphin is destroyed in the body so quick....what is interesting, is that these frog venoms can have effects lasting for days and days. is there some major enzyme inhibitor in this material that allows the opioid peptides to run free?

the potential out there blows me over.
the problem is that drug companies are never going to give a shit about us, except that we drive their profits in part with a drug war, and that the common man is cut off as much as possible from nature.

so some of this type of research has to be done by clutzes like me and the other amauteurs. it true that proffesionals and scientists that work for places that dont keep their findings secret end up doing the most important work that applies to what we can learn.
I just hope that we can help foster a greater interest in the novel opioids....

kratom used to not be avialable on a commercial level.
now it is....
it wasnt the corporations that did this.
it was a subversive underground of herb researchers.
and now its a multi million dollar a year commodity, making some people rich.
all it took was a few years from me reading about it, and wishing I could get some....to having a garage with some decent kratom plants growing.
I was also able to suspend dependence on pharmaceuticals at times using kratom.
it got me through some tough crisis type situations. where I had no access to my substances of choice.

I would say at this point, there are about 30 seriously interested people researching the novel opioids found in nature, besides all the scientists that do most of the real work.
what this small amount of people do that are the laymen of the research , is try and categorize that potential and its relevance to the junkies, pain patients, and recreational users out there.

recreational use is about the lowest on the totem of importance in my opinion. kratom could have so much more relevance as a dietary supplement than what has happened with it. its sad, cause the people making millions off of it couldve have guided it into use as a dietary supplment....they still could now, but seem to either not have the knowledge of how to do this, or they just dont give a shit.
really though ought to, because the future of their commodity market could depend on it.

I hope the cynics out there can still keep an eye on the research. things change quickly. the chance that there is a euphoric opioid compound sitting in some herb that has been used for hundreds of years in western herbal medicine is still quite good.
I actually know of at least a few amazing psychoactives found in nature that were sitting on the spice shelf....but most people have even passed those over....certian groups of people even somewhat chastised me for thinking that some common herbs had any potential, and when the scientific info was already available....even after isolation, and some positive bioassays with the herbs components were reported, little interest was received. the only really interested people were those that wanted to keep the findings to themselves, for monetary gain.
its just a self defeating world out there really...

the potential gets stymied by breakfast lunch and dinner, the potential gets left in the dust by the same old candidates....people would rather buy a latte than do any real research in any direction.

recently i have been offered some research material..
psychotria brachypoda...
a purported opioid containing leaf material from south america.
I have been offered a buy in on an amount that to my knowledge, is the first major amount to be brought into the USA for research purposes.
since I am so broke in my personal life, I thought it would be OK to spend one months rent here at opiophile on the aquisition of an amount of this leaf for research.
since it is a relevant issue concerning the reason I created opiophile.
a voucher specimen of the materal recieved will go into opiophiles herb library, which is rather small, but still a nice little collection of interesting plant materials.

so I have to thank even the cynics of this type of research here at opiophile...you may be helping just by donation alone.

it does get a little old sometimes. alot of the plants that sound interesting out there are just not commercially available. there are ones that are.....even ones that are commercially avialable and havnt been sufficiently looked into......but a person only has so much time, energy and money.

I say take a corner and start eating away....maybe we can meet somewhere in the middle.
the novel action of eating a plant that has never been tasted before needs to go on if we are ever going to get ahead...
good science has its place, but good taste is always a step in the right direction.

[simfromstoke]

antagonists never have done a thing for me. if ive only got half a bag left i know that all it'l do is postpone my rattle for mybe 4-5 hours
the only way i get a decent hit is decent gear and at-least 2 bags on the spoon
if it floats your boat and you get a better hit using an antagonist, pre opiately im ded chuffed for y'all.
personally id get the same hit if i was sucking on a tic-tac an hour before
-jus my two cents...

[jacky]

hhmmm..

well, still then...

the potential of all the antagonist opioids out there in nature that exist, and have yet to exist, may very well potentiate a couple of bags of heroin...

have you tried any antagonists for tolerance reduction/potentiation?

or how about nmda antagonists?
dxm?
ketamine?

have you tried grapefruit juice aided enzyme augmentation?

there are herbs out there that probably do effect heroin tolerance...and possibly isolated compounds already research'd that could have favorable interactions...
most people using heroin are not researching with herbs and such...
they are just trying to stay ahead of the game...
and readin the same page of the same book theyv been reading for the last 3 months..

no offense...
I see your point about certian antagonists.

but I am a bit confused...
are you saying the buprenorphine does nothing for you?
or naltrexone?

microgram regimines of naltrexone really did potentiate some of the opiates I was using some 8 years ago like oxy's, poppy tea...etc....but the effect got too strong, started making me sick and giving me tinnitus...

the point is to keep searching for the next avialable purported opioid compound, especially the ones found in nature...
the point is ,despite it is a desperate hope that something good comes of it, to keep researching .
without that nothing happens.
and the people that plants can benefit will be the better off, even if they are a relatively small group of people....20-30 years down the way and you will have a whole industry just focused on the natural opioids...
I mean more than one vendor online researching and shipping 90% opioid analgesic type of materials.

I am not hoping that we get something better than heroin...god no...
what we need is as many different opioid compounds found in nature as possible, researched and catalog'd if only for the express purpose of trying the bog down the ideology that making it illegal will make it all go away...
bury the laws in active compounds...
sourced from nature.
active as common as something like the kappa opioid compound menthol...
which by the way could have more potential as a synthetic opioid analog for all we know...

that is what this thread is about..
jacky running the rant and trying to downplay dilly dally alley type of energy levels concerning plants and their potential as future opioids..

anyway, must be nice living in the UK....great place for opiate/opioid research.
thanks for your 2 cents.

its all relevant since it seems that so many people can have variable reactions to the same single/poly drug combinations...e

[Papa Verine]

I am with you on all this Jacky. I've always been interested in psychoactive plants, herbs, foods, all that stuff... I'm glad you're out there doing the work you do and especially glad I get to read about it.

I agree with everything you just said up there. I've doubted for a long time now that there was a plant producing powerful opioids suitable for recreational use. But there is still HUGE potential for the studies.

And I certainly have not ruled out the possibility of some ocean-dwelling creature to contain very interesting compounds. Even insects we haven't discovered yet... who knows? Or the possibility that some very poisonous plants also might contain some good psychoatives. Who would've known really?

I love to try things myself. Bioassay as you say... I'll keep doing it whenever I can and share my perceived effects with everybody here.