8 Days Clean...When Does Good Sleep Come?

[OpiatedVegas]

Hi guys, long time lurker but I have started posting a bit lately. I love the sites vast amount of info along with you guys and gals who truly seem to care about each other. I do have a question that I hope some of you with experience can help me out with some answers.

For the past 2.5 years I have been an Oxycodone addict on and off....but mostly on as most of us are. This last run was only 2-3 months but I was using 10+ 30mg Roxis a day insuffulated. It is time to try and kick opiates for good, so I am now on day 8 of no oxy (last used 8/21/08) and happened to quit smoking pot (daily user) on that same day. For the first 5 days I just used loperamide to keep my innards from spilling out, and in the evening I would take 1-1.5mg of xanax to enable sleep, which I was surprisingly able to get 10-11hrs the first 3 nights. The next two nights I was able to fall asleep with the same amount of xanax but slept 7-8 hours which I was grateful for still.

Physically I started feeling human again around days 4-5 with literally no pain at all using 800mg ibuprofen once daily, and minor chills and hot flashes. On day 6 I had no more xanax and got maybe 3 hours of what I wouldnt even call sleep; just tossing and turning and never even dreamng...basically just laying in bed and getting up after a while since sleep was not coming. Same thing last night, no xanax and experienced the same non restorative, toss and turning shut eye. So here I am on day 8 and feel as though I havent slept at all in 48 hrs, my muscles ache from lack of sleep, my back muscles are killing me even with 800mg of ibuprofen. The past 2 times I have quit opiates, I have used xanax for a couple days (not 5 days like this time) and just smoked pot to get back into a regualr sleeping routine, but with no pot this time and no xanax Ido not even get drowsy at night after a long day of work. As I previously I have gotten maybe 5 hours of worthless sleep in 2 nights and its dragging me down because I ache again and feel like something is wrong since I have lacked sleep yet never feel drowsy come night time.

I know insomnia during/after withdrawal is common, but usually by day 8 Im back to sleeping ok so something tells me not smoking pot has something to do with this as well. Ill admit I have used pot and oxy as a crutch for sleeping since I have had minor troubles with sleeping regularly since starting oxy...but I now have this anxiety building as each passing nigh comes and I am stuck tosing and turning for 5-6 hours BEFORE even falling asleep for those few nasty hours that I now call sleep, and this anxiety in turn prevents me from sleeping better. I go crazy not being able to sleep and being up all night for days on end and do not want to see this progress into chronic insomnia. In your guys' experiences, how long does it usually take to get to the point where u actaully feel tired and can sleep 7-8 hours instead of feeling 100% alert 24/7? As much as I know xanax is just a crutch, I am thinking of picking up a couple bars today after work and taking half of one so I can get some shuteye tonight and hopefully get rid of all the musle soreness from lack of sleep.

Any tips on how to get some good shuteye besides the ususall CBT, relaxation and breathing techniques? I can sit there and listen to myself breath for hours not thinking about a thing and still do not sleep, I merely feel as though I am holding my eyes closed and now my eyeballs are hurting from trying to keep them closed for so long. I appreciate any input you all have and thank you for your responses.

[SeVeN]

After being clean for a while things like doxlymine succinate and benadryl can help. The thing is you feel hungover and groggy the next day. Man I still don't sleep for shit. I hate it. And eight days might seem like a long time but it really aint shit. Good luck. Ambien RX and temazaoam can help if your doc will script you.

[Consumed.]

good sleep never comes again.... kidding im being pessimistic

[upstate_007]

I am on day 12 (except for a little dab today....I'm of weak resolve today) and my sleep has been fitful at best all along. I have been taking Nyquil every night which helps a little bit. Other than that, I have been exercising in the evening and avoiding caffeine after noon. It will get better though. Sometimes it took me a few months to get back to normal sleep again.

Don't worry about it. It will happen eventually. And in reality, even getting those few hours you are getting now is a lot better than some people on here are doing in regards to sleep. Maybe keep up the weed smoking until you are a few months out of the Opi woods? I am not sure of your reasons for stopping smoking, but if it is just an effort to get off of everything it may be worth considering quitting that in a few months once the opi withdrawal and PAWS are more under control.

That's just my little bit of advice. Either way I hope you get some sort of relief in the near future. Congrats on the 8 days too!

[OpiatedVegas]

I am on day 12 (except for a little dab today....I'm of weak resolve today) and my sleep has been fitful at best all along. I have been taking Nyquil every night which helps a little bit. Other than that, I have been exercising in the evening and avoiding caffeine after noon. It will get better though. Sometimes it took me a few months to get back to normal sleep again.

Don't worry about it. It will happen eventually. And in reality, even getting those few hours you are getting now is a lot better than some people on here are doing in regards to sleep. Maybe keep up the weed smoking until you are a few months out of the Opi woods? I am not sure of your reasons for stopping smoking, but if it is just an effort to get off of everything it may be worth considering quitting that in a few months once the opi withdrawal and PAWS are more under control.

That's just my little bit of advice. Either way I hope you get some sort of relief in the near future. Congrats on the 8 days too!

My reason for quitting the herb is I have a hair test in a couple months and I know it stays in your system longer than opis. Thanks for the responses guys...I'm not stressing it as bad as my post made it sound, but I was just wondering because in the past I was able to sleep within a week and both times were longer abuse stints than this last one of two months although maybe half the oxy. doc is out of the question with no insurance, but I'm scooping up a few bars when I get out of work in a couple hours. I know 8 days is just a start but I'm hoping to never touch the shit again. :crosses fingers:

[OriginalSinuality]

good sleep never comes again.... kidding im being pessimistic

But kinda true. After I detoxed, no matter what substance I tried (weed, alcohol, lorazepam, valerian, gravol, the list goes on . . . ) it took about 5 months for me to go back to sleeping somewhat normal (falling asleep at a decent hour, staying asleep all night, not waking up at a god awful early time).

[Raisin]

First of all congrats on the 8 days. It's not easy as many of us know. I don't know your history of use with the xanax but if I use it for more than 4 or 5 days, and I usually only use it to detox as it holds little recreational value for me (anything over .5mg just makes me sleepy), I end up with minor withdrawals: minor insomnia being the major symptom.

I've had issues with sleep forever and whenever it becomes an issue the anxiety of knowing that I'm going to have trouble getting there starts me on a vicious cycle of sleep anxiety. I think it had a had a lot to do with my becoming a pretty bad drunk. I drank myself to sleep for quite a while and lately since I got laid off and can't find a job it's becoming part of my nightly ritual again.

You said you were getting more xannies so hopefully that'll help but maybe you should try to get enough so that you can taper off of them until you find something else that'll help. the longer I stay in this game the more it seems that wd's effect me differently, especially after switching to pharms from dope a while back. Good luck with the kick and congrats on being clean for 8 days.

[SeVeN]

good sleep never comes again.... kidding im being pessimistic

OH I wish you were kidding.

[Badly Drawn Girl]

Well I have no advice since I've had sleep issues my whole life. But I did want to say congrats on the week+ clean. That is wonderful. I hope you can get a handle on the sleep problem. Hang in there!

[l4l5]

when SWIM started oxy a few years ago, it got out of hand a bit, they was on 100mg per dose, 3-4 times a day.
and they ran out, so they went thru some pretty nasty WD, they never had strong opies b4, just T3's
and they was hurting badly. they had a lot of t3 scripts so they got them and it helped needed 90mg's to just take the edge off

the first 3 days =TERRIBLE everything is at its worst by day 2, and day 3 is the same.
day 4 they started feeling better, they wanted to eat again, still quite sweaty and grumpy. Ohh and the headaches in the morning when they woke up were fucked up shit, i never had headaches like that ever, they couldnt even move their eyes they were telling me it just hurt so much, photophobia as well to the max.
but day 4 is when they feel better besides the headaches.
day 5 another headache, takes 8 hours to go away, they have my T3's , then 4 hours later another dose of T3's and then it goes away. sleeping thos from day 5 is pretty good, but you have to be tired, so some exercise is the best. at day 4 get diarhea till day 6 then goes away

day 6, they can pretty much spread their T3 doses out to 6-7 hourly instead of 4 hrly(day 1,2,3,4)
sleeping is good, still small small headache when they wake up, but at this time they feeling like they can go out and do shopping etc, appetite is very good

day 7 wake up no headaches, starting to feel normal now., day 8 is pretty much the day can take just 1 T3 for morning and lunch, then at night have 90mg's, and they said they actually get faded off that then.

day 8 is completly normal for em and sleep decently from day 7 onwards, as long as your comfy, no matter what day you will sleep.

[Duckfeet]

Tomorrow!
;-)

[Raisin]

I just got a hilarious visual of DF in a half suit (I always picture you this way for some reason) on stage singing that song from the musical "Annie".

[OpiatedVegas]

I actually ended up buying 5 bars last night, and took a whole one stupidly while drinking heavily with soem boys at the bar. Then someone had some good yay and I was adumbass and did some, so I ended up taking 2 bars last night (the most Ihave EVER taken) and gave 1 and a quarter bar away. Stupid I know, but we all know how benzos go. I have 1 and a haf bars left now and will just try Aand take a quarter of one from here on out.

But in all honesty I might have been able to sleep last night without the benzos and alcohol. Kinda how everyone thinks "what ifs" that are always negative, turn the "what ifs" into positive thoughts such as "what if I get too good of sleep tonight." It most definitely eases the tension/anxiety associated with sleeping.

Once again I thank everyone who has taken the time to post in this thread. Now its time to goto work and I feel like a fvcking zombie becasue of the 4mg of xanax last night. I have never taken more than 2mg in a night, and now I just feel retarded. Makes me wonder how people use it recreationally :confused:

[Poppylvr]

slept 7-8 hours which I was grateful for still.
Any tips on how to get some good shuteye besides the ususall CBT, relaxation and breathing techniques? I can sit there and listen to myself breath for hours not thinking about a thing and still do not sleep, I merely feel as though I am holding my eyes closed and now my eyeballs are hurting from trying to keep them closed for so long. I appreciate any input you all have and thank you for your responses.
arrgghh OpiatedVegas, insomnia has been my biggest bugaboo.
The God's honest truth is that it took about 4 weeks for me to get natural sleep again when I kicked from an IV morphine habit several years ago.
I now use Suboxone anywhere from 2-16 mg given the night, and I sleep well, even on 2 mg, Thank God.
What I did was get a bunch of books that were mostly picture books - on architecture & stuff to look at during the non sleep hours. I used my bedroom for sleeping only, & would get up if I were in bed for 1 hour & couldn't fall asleep.
That said, I also would force myself to lie down & physically rest for several hours even if I couldn't sleep. So I'd go to bed around 10, get up at 11, look at my picture books (:)!!) until 1 and then go back to bed & stay there until 5:30 - 6am. I would get up & start my day no matter how little sleep I had in order to keep to some kind of schedule. I was working an 8-5 job then.
Remember the no caffeine ater 6 pm thing, and the get some exercise but not in the last part of the day thing.
I sure hope it gets better for you soon.

[Poppylvr]

I am on day 12 (except for a little dab today....I'm of weak resolve today) and my sleep has been fitful at best all along. I have been taking Nyquil every night which helps a little bit. Other than that, I have been exercising in the evening and avoiding caffeine after noon. It will get better though. Sometimes it took me a few months to get back to normal sleep again.

Don't worry about it. It will happen eventually. And in reality, even getting those few hours you are getting now is a lot better than some people on here are doing in regards to sleep. Maybe keep up the weed smoking until you are a few months out of the Opi woods? I am not sure of your reasons for stopping smoking, but if it is just an effort to get off of everything it may be worth considering quitting that in a few months once the opi withdrawal and PAWS are more under control.

That's just my little bit of advice. Either way I hope you get some sort of relief in the near future. Congrats on the 8 days too!
Grats to YOU upstate!:D:D
Couple things I learned: the alcohol in the Nyquil will fuck up your sleep pattern. Try plain doxylamine or diphenhydramine, but not for too long. They do not promote REAL sleep.
Exercise at night often makes it harder for peeps to sleep - if it's at all possible try to do the exercise at least 6 hours before sleep so that the activation from the exercise has faded by the time you try to hit the sack.

[Hacker]

God, I wish I had the answer to that one. I tried to detox four years ago to save my job, but having used heroin for the better part of thirty years and then H and methadone the last four years before busting a UA I was still unable to sleep soundly after 6 weeks, relapsed and lost my job anyway. Here I am another 4 years later and still on that run. I personally wonder if a chronic user can ever recover enough to have "normal" sleep patterns. The insomnia has always been my downfall when trying to kick but then I've never had much will power. I hope all goes well in your case though, and pray you prove me wrong. Good luck.

[OpiatedVegas]

arrgghh OpiatedVegas, insomnia has been my biggest bugaboo.
The God's honest truth is that it took about 4 weeks for me to get natural sleep again when I kicked from an IV morphine habit several years ago.
I now use Suboxone anywhere from 2-16 mg given the night, and I sleep well, even on 2 mg, Thank God.
What I did was get a bunch of books that were mostly picture books - on architecture & stuff to look at during the non sleep hours. I used my bedroom for sleeping only, & would get up if I were in bed for 1 hour & couldn't fall asleep.
That said, I also would force myself to lie down & physically rest for several hours even if I couldn't sleep. So I'd go to bed around 10, get up at 11, look at my picture books (:)!!) until 1 and then go back to bed & stay there until 5:30 - 6am. I would get up & start my day no matter how little sleep I had in order to keep to some kind of schedule. I was working an 8-5 job then.
Remember the no caffeine ater 6 pm thing, and the get some exercise but not in the last part of the day thing.
I sure hope it gets better for you soon.

WHen on oxy I absiolutely LOVE coffee....but I havent touched it since the first day I quit because it made me too damn jittery.

FWIW, I am using no suboxone or opis of anykind. This is now day 10 and I have yet to have a solid bowel movement (although its not nearly as bad as the first couple days). Fvck it though, Im just gonna have to deal with it since it was stupid on my part to be using such high (I know not nearly as high as some) amount of oxy with no legitimate pain. I guess ya gotta pay to play ;)

[SHELLEY]

But kinda true. After I detoxed, no matter what substance I tried (weed, alcohol, lorazepam, valerian, gravol, the list goes on . . . ) it took about 5 months for me to go back to sleeping somewhat normal (falling asleep at a decent hour, staying asleep all night, not waking up at a god awful early time).

i sleep gooooood
i could never sleep for shit on heroin, i'd wake up sick and that always sucks
or i'd wake up at 2am and if ya live in a motel in the hood
what the fuck is there to do at 2am? you go out, all you see is blue lights...
i sleep way better on my mmt where i never get high

[OpiatedVegas]

Well hopefully I am onto something here, but I got a full 8 hours of sleep and dreamed all night although they were soem crazy fvckin dreams! This was without any xanax, benadryl or anything! So that was day/night 11 for me. Im up earlier than I would like to be (8:45) but I also was tired as hell last night and was in bed by midnight.


One thing I have noticed though is when I would use oxy my dreams were never about drugs, but now it seems every dream has some influence from drugs. Like last night one dream was full of ecstacy pills everywhere which I dont really do and another involved some crazy acid wafer looking things that cost $20 a piece. Fvckin wierd I know, but I just feel damn good after a good nights sleep and thought I would share. I sure hope it is smooth sailing from here on out :cool:

[OpiatedVegas]

Just thought I would update....the night of my previous post was the only night of good sleep I got until a few days ago. Shit was rough; anxiety like none other but I attribute that to the fact I was taking xanax daily for a two week period or so which left me in mild discomfort when I discontinued use. I also started getting depressed due to lack of sleep; my whole body ached since my muscles never got any rest and in general I didnt feel like doing anything, but not doing anything had me thinking about my lack of sleep...what a vicious cycle. Now its been 25 or 26 days free of opies and ganj and things are getting much better. Getting to sleep is now becoming easier and easier, its just the staying asleep part thats a bitch to deal with. No matter what time I goto bed I seem to wake up in the night and spend an hour or so falling back asleep before I am wide awake at 8am. Like last night I got trashed and didnt goto bed until 3am yet come 8:30 this morning I was awake and could not fall back asleep. I am definitely fortunate to be sleeping again in general, but I have noticed that since I dropped two vices I picked up drinking with a fury.

While I still dont feel truly happy like I was during the opi binge (fake pleaseure i know), things are looking up and im not a depressed lump of shit anymore. I did make an appt. with a good friend of my mothers who is a psychologist for next week just so I can get some stuff of my chest and mind. Wierd how I never felt off in the past after quitting opiates but this time has definitely been an eye opening experience and only reinforces my will to stay away from them in the future.

Poppylvr, I took your advice and picked up some non fiction books from the library and started reading for an hour or so before bed and noticed that it helps alot with the falling alseep part. :cool: