Please

[Porcupine]

I am an addict. This I know. Since I was 14 i've been searching for the "ultimate high", every chance I got. I cannot stand sobriety, I can't even fathom sobriety. I have a Panic Disorder, and Depression, which I self-medicate with drugs of all variety. If i'm completly dry of anything worth-while i'll drop 4-5 benidryl. And you know what? I'm sick of it. It scares me, I want to start living free of addiction. Physical addiction is nothing. I can handle that, but the mental aspect is what gets me everytime. I just can't be sober, I don't know why, I think the thought of having to face my shit without a mask scares the living hell out of me, so I run to the opiates, or the booze, or the coke, benzo's...anything.

I need to quit for me, and my significant other. I'm going to start going to NA meetings here soon, and I really hope that helps. Because like I said...it's all mental for me. I crave euphoria. Life is too beautiful to waste fucked up, but i'm to frightened to face it with out a cheat sheet. Has anyone been in my situation? I mean I think being mentally addicted to something is far worse than being physically addicted-that's only temporary. I'm not even addicted to one drug in particular. I'm addicted to Euphoria. I can't live without it, yet I need too. I feel like i'm missing out on so much! I can't even remember what being sober for more than a day is like.

Sorry, i'm rambling. I'm just rock-bottom. My girlfriend of over 2 years has all but had it with me. Fuck, i've had it with me.

There are things I don't think i'll quit right away; Coffee, Cigarettes, and Ativan(Rx'd Medication).

I'm only 19 but I feel like i'm old as hell.

So here, right now, I look to more experienced folk willing to help someone out in dire need. I can offer no compensation but the satisfaction that you helped someone piece their life together. I know it's going to be tough, but I don't even know where to turn. No one I know personally is an addict...no one I know even understands addiction...

Thankyou.

[Raz]

Guess your in the right place.....

[Somanax]

Guess your in the right place.....



Yep

This is the place for people that refuse to give up coffee

not to mention that nasty old nicotine ...Roll me another one please

Whilst, I look for the lost lorazepam in the couch

Never you mind us though

The lorazepam,cigarette's and the coffee will alway's be there for you

J/k

Lighten up and take it as it fly's in your direction ....duck when you can

Take a direct hit when you cannot but alway's come on back

That's where you seperate the wheat from the chaff ............so I'm told;)

What the fuck do I know I'm just happy to have an avatar like mine to slide into

When the world seem's dry and there is no dope/hope

I can slide into something warm and wet within minute's???????

I know the other's around me are jealous as fuck of what I got

Her counselor at the clinic stared me down as if she had a chance with my girl

I mean the look's I get versus the look's she get's are at best completely opposite


BTW her counselor was/is an attractive young butch -ass foot-ball coach who run's marathon's

To ward off her evil wishe's ie her aversion to men ............Just accept the fact that you love

Gorgeous fucking women ......She would get lot's more respect for being who/what she is

She is surrounded by attractive young women strung out on ........get this ............VICODIN

Not kidding it seem's as if they want to change the Stat's from MMT to a recovery center

They got a better chance with 18/19 y/o vicodin client's

Than with 40 plus y/o mmt client's

[SHELLEY]

we all got shit to deal with
we all loooooove our drugs (well, i sure the fuck do!)
some people can keep going forever and they are ok with it
others, like you, get fed up with it rawther quickly
(i say quickly because you are 19 and therefore cant have been using THAT long-
i know folks been copping from the same crack dealer longer than you or me have existed)
and you get fed up- fucking stop!!
its easy to just complain about how bad it sucks on drugs and/or off drugs
but if you set a REAL goal, its easier to do

for example heres what i did:
i said i would stop allllll drugs except for cigs and mj
and would go to the methadone clinic daily but no "supplementing"
now, i dunno if you knew me for most of the time ive been on this msg board
but ^that^ is a MAJOR improvement for someone like me
i'm 23 and for 10 years have been sticking needles into myself
smoking meth, shooting meth + coke + more recently heroin, smoking crack
and all of that shit EVERY SINGLE DAY
so if i just said "im gonna stop getting high today"- yeah fuck right, aint gonna happen
thats the same thing you are saying, you just wanna stop
set a goal, start small and then set a new goal
then you'll be right where you want to be
and if the NA people dont like your choice (for example, you still drink or smoke pot)?
guess what? tell them to kiss your fat/skinny, black/white ass (pick appropriate size n color)

just my .02
because hell, if i can stop all that shit i was doing
(and i have- damn near 6 months clean now by my rules)
anybody can!!!

[rockbottom]

i am Rockbottom----imo na sucks its a pseudo religion where they try to brainwash u- that all that u have done in the past is(part of your addiction)---tough it out yourself---i know people will not like this as AA-NA has saved many people--but remember sobriety sucks--you'll never feel right again

[Opiyum]

I am an addict. This I know. Since I was 14 i've been searching for the "ultimate high", every chance I got. I cannot stand sobriety, I can't even fathom sobriety. I have a Panic Disorder, and Depression, which I self-medicate with drugs of all variety. If i'm completly dry of anything worth-while i'll drop 4-5 benidryl. And you know what? I'm sick of it. It scares me, I want to start living free of addiction. Physical addiction is nothing. I can handle that, but the mental aspect is what gets me everytime. I just can't be sober, I don't know why, I think the thought of having to face my shit without a mask scares the living hell out of me, so I run to the opiates, or the booze, or the coke, benzo's...anything.

I need to quit for me, and my significant other. I'm going to start going to NA meetings here soon, and I really hope that helps. Because like I said...it's all mental for me. I crave euphoria. Life is too beautiful to waste fucked up, but i'm to frightened to face it with out a cheat sheet. Has anyone been in my situation? I mean I think being mentally addicted to something is far worse than being physically addicted-that's only temporary. I'm not even addicted to one drug in particular. I'm addicted to Euphoria. I can't live without it, yet I need too. I feel like i'm missing out on so much! I can't even remember what being sober for more than a day is like.

Sorry, i'm rambling. I'm just rock-bottom. My girlfriend of over 2 years has all but had it with me. Fuck, i've had it with me.

There are things I don't think i'll quit right away; Coffee, Cigarettes, and Ativan(Rx'd Medication).

I'm only 19 but I feel like i'm old as hell.

So here, right now, I look to more experienced folk willing to help someone out in dire need. I can offer no compensation but the satisfaction that you helped someone piece their life together. I know it's going to be tough, but I don't even know where to turn. No one I know personally is an addict...no one I know even understands addiction...

Thankyou.

You are in the right place and will find that a lot of people here share similar struggles.
I wish you the best of luck and don't really feel good about giving you advice on how to go about treatment.
The best thing I can say is do your research and try different things. NA didn't and doesn't work for me but it may be something you love. It may just change your life.
Best of luck friend. I hope at the very least you have loved ones surrounding you that can help support you through these tough times.


Oh and while the mental addiction is the worst part when you are young like you are it won't be as bad as it will be in 5 years or ten years. It only gets worse as does the physical. Keep this in mind.

[HMMM...]

I am an addict. This I know. Since I was 14 i've been searching for the "ultimate high", every chance I got. I cannot stand sobriety, I can't even fathom sobriety. I have a Panic Disorder, and Depression, which I self-medicate with drugs of all variety. If i'm completly dry of anything worth-while i'll drop 4-5 benidryl. And you know what? I'm sick of it. It scares me, I want to start living free of addiction. Physical addiction is nothing. I can handle that, but the mental aspect is what gets me everytime. I just can't be sober, I don't know why, I think the thought of having to face my shit without a mask scares the living hell out of me, so I run to the opiates, or the booze, or the coke, benzo's...anything.

I need to quit for me, and my significant other. I'm going to start going to NA meetings here soon, and I really hope that helps. Because like I said...it's all mental for me. I crave euphoria. Life is too beautiful to waste fucked up, but i'm to frightened to face it with out a cheat sheet. Has anyone been in my situation? I mean I think being mentally addicted to something is far worse than being physically addicted-that's only temporary. I'm not even addicted to one drug in particular. I'm addicted to Euphoria. I can't live without it, yet I need too. I feel like i'm missing out on so much! I can't even remember what being sober for more than a day is like.

Sorry, i'm rambling. I'm just rock-bottom. My girlfriend of over 2 years has all but had it with me. Fuck, i've had it with me.

There are things I don't think i'll quit right away; Coffee, Cigarettes, and Ativan(Rx'd Medication).

I'm only 19 but I feel like i'm old as hell.

So here, right now, I look to more experienced folk willing to help someone out in dire need. I can offer no compensation but the satisfaction that you helped someone piece their life together. I know it's going to be tough, but I don't even know where to turn. No one I know personally is an addict...no one I know even understands addiction...

Thankyou.


Do you have a lot of past issues that you haven't dealt with yet?
Maybe you need some therapy to find out what it is that is driving you mentally.
Or try to find a hobby. Something that will keep you busy. If it's the rush you need then something like skydiving, scubadiving, any sort of hobby that will keep you busy while your not working.
It sounds like you really wan't to live a sober life. Turning to drugs will just fix you long enough until your not high. NA is not a bad idea. You can get a sponsor and have older people that know the ins and outs and will talk to you when ever you need it.

As for the panic disorder you should see a doctor for that and be properly prescribed. And stay away from H or oc, cuz if you not physically addicted yet you sure will not wan't to be in the future.

Im just a few years older then you so I don't have the life experience but I know the feeling of being this young and the discomfort of thinking the rest of your life can be the merry go round. Well, stay up. hope this helped a little

[nick]

1.Stability.Find a drug that works and stabilise on as a low a dose as possible.It's easier to maintain and eventually kick.

2.You're gonna have to address the underlying reasons for your drug use,if you want a long term happy,drug free life.

3.You are not alone.

4.Much luck.

[pharmboy]

I'm with Rockb on this one NA is a cult. NA is worse than the drugs. I know

people addicted to NA ! Be Careful you sound like you are in a voulnreble

condition at the moment. If the drugs were free and you didnt have any

hassles with supply or quality, there wouldn't be a problem would there.

Its not the drugs your fed up with, its all the other crap surrounding the drugs.

[JTDuffet]

Yes you are in the right place.. and i will agree with what everyone else has said so far, especially rockbottom.. I went to AA/NA at the beginning, but found that after a short amount of time clean, you are better off making new friends, having new activities to do rather than living the NA life. ie. being surrounded by addicts talking about using, or not using on a regular basis, and living to attend meetings, etc. that to me is counterproductive. once your clean, make new friends, and do new activities and things will get better...

As far as NA/AA is concerned, I find that NA can only help you so far, and only in the beginning.. i mean, when you have some clean time, the last thing you want to do is listen to people talking about relapsing, or wanting to use all the time. thats when its time to move on and start doing different things, and you will find that some sobriety isn't all that bad.

NOW. let me stress. , as far as complete sobriety is concerned or telling yourself you will never use again, i do not vouch for this method. i also think that when new addicts enter rehab, or AA/NA all they hear from everyone is that they can never use again or it's time to put the toys down.. and for most of us, this is a little hard to swallow and can be overwhelming and depressing and could lead someone to go right out and use again.. I would try as others have said, set a small goal, and accomplish it. then set another one,.. if you set your goals too high you will be dissapointed and feel like your not making any progress. start small, but know that anything is possible, just don't give up hope...

-jt

[Cherry's Jubilee]

I am an addict. This I know. Since I was 14 i've been searching for the "ultimate high", every chance I got. I cannot stand sobriety, I can't even fathom sobriety. I have a Panic Disorder, and Depression, which I self-medicate with drugs of all variety. If i'm completly dry of anything worth-while i'll drop 4-5 benidryl. And you know what? I'm sick of it. It scares me, I want to start living free of addiction. Physical addiction is nothing. I can handle that, but the mental aspect is what gets me everytime. I just can't be sober, I don't know why, I think the thought of having to face my shit without a mask scares the living hell out of me, so I run to the opiates, or the booze, or the coke, benzo's...anything.

I need to quit for me, and my significant other. I'm going to start going to NA meetings here soon, and I really hope that helps. Because like I said...it's all mental for me. I crave euphoria. Life is too beautiful to waste fucked up, but i'm to frightened to face it with out a cheat sheet. Has anyone been in my situation? I mean I think being mentally addicted to something is far worse than being physically addicted-that's only temporary. I'm not even addicted to one drug in particular. I'm addicted to Euphoria. I can't live without it, yet I need too. I feel like i'm missing out on so much! I can't even remember what being sober for more than a day is like.

Sorry, i'm rambling. I'm just rock-bottom. My girlfriend of over 2 years has all but had it with me. Fuck, i've had it with me.

There are things I don't think i'll quit right away; Coffee, Cigarettes, and Ativan(Rx'd Medication).

I'm only 19 but I feel like i'm old as hell.

So here, right now, I look to more experienced folk willing to help someone out in dire need. I can offer no compensation but the satisfaction that you helped someone piece their life together. I know it's going to be tough, but I don't even know where to turn. No one I know personally is an addict...no one I know even understands addiction...

Thankyou.

You're lucky to come to this kind of realization so young. For a long time (before I committed myself to love, honor, and obey opiates til death do us part :rolleyes:) I was also just a general substance-aholic. I didn't care what it was as long as I wasn't fucking sober. What am I so scared of? I don't know. Maybe I don't want to know.

Anyway, treatment needs are different for everyone and I'd feel like a total hypocrite offering any advice about that but I just wanted to say that I understand the craving for reality and freedom from addiction and the simultaneous craving for euphoria and a "cheat-sheet" (like that btw). It's a difficult place to be.

I really do firmly believe that if you want something enough and you're willing to do whatever it takes to get there, you can and will do it. More than anything I want to believe that one day I will wake up with my boyfriend and we won't have to reach for a pill because sickness is starting and we'll start the day with no feelings of guilt, or fear, no secrets, no lies. I want it more than anything. I don't think he does though and it will be hard because I love him and I'll never leave him even if he never quits, even if he never even tries, even if it practically makes it impossible for me...sorry for the emotional word-vomit, the point of all that was that you're lucky too to have the support of a sober, loving SO.

Be strong. Don't hate yourself--it's counterproductive. There is no shame in feeling things so deeply and excruciatingly that you have to try to soften the blow somehow. Keep us updated k?

[nick]

Ummm guys,we're supposed to be offering this guy advice and encouragement not badmouthing NA.

[Somanax]

Ummm guys,we're supposed to be offering this guy advice and encouragement not badmouthing NA.


Aww C'mon Nick

To some of us N.A. is pronounced

NAAHHH ......

[HMMM...]

same thought here. I've been to N.A.(to support a friend) and I can see how some people don't respond all to positive to it. Theres two crowds that are usually at n.a. The old veterans that really respect and try to help other people out and the younger kids that have to go for court obligations. I say try it out and find a sponsor that you connect with. Then you'll have a person to call that won't discriminate and get mad at you(maybe something your girlfriend does).

As far as the 10 steps thing if it doesn't fit with you then it doesn't fit.

Also I've heard A.A is maybe a lot better place to go for support simply because they are an older crowd and will take you seriously.

Theres a lot of helpfull people on this forum as well but know that theres more users here then non-users.

And as far as relapsing goes, it's not the end of the world if you do. Some people count their days and chips n shit and when they relapse they think 'o shit i fucked it all up.'
I'd rather think, look I have 40 days clean and I used for one day... 40-1...thats pretty fuckin good. Don't beat yourself up over shit thats going to happen.

[nick]

same thought here. I've been to N.A.(to support a friend) and I can see how some people don't respond all to positive to it. Theres two crowds that are usually at n.a. The old veterans that really respect and try to help other people out and the younger kids that have to go for court obligations. I say try it out and find a sponsor that you connect with. Then you'll have a person to call that won't discriminate and get mad at you(maybe something your girlfriend does).

As far as the 10 steps thing if it doesn't fit with you then it doesn't fit.

Also I've heard A.A is maybe a lot better place to go for support simply because they are an older crowd and will take you seriously.

Theres a lot of helpfull people on this forum as well but know that theres more users here then non-users.

And as far as relapsing goes, it's not the end of the world if you do. Some people count their days and chips n shit and when they relapse they think 'o shit i fucked it all up.'
I'd rather think, look I have 40 days clean and I used for one day... 40-1...thats pretty fuckin good. Don't beat yourself up over shit thats going to happen.


I wish NA was 10 step.Sadly it's 12.

I have no great love of NA and it didn't work for me.Hell,it made me want to get high,but I suggest it to everyone in need and they can take it or leave it.

Oh,you get free biscuits at NA in the UK.So,it's not a complete waste of time.

[Chicago]

@OP, SORRY but if u hit rockbottom u will no.......You will run 4 help.
Just b/c ur lady leaves u, or you lose ur house & kids and job is not rockbottom.
We all have different bottoms.
Some may be livin under a bridge & beggen 4 change during the day & at night sucking cock for $5buks, w/the same clothes on ur back.I'm talking about a man here too.

Anyways you may hit bottom now then be clean & relaspe, then 5yrs later hit bottom but it is so much worse then the 1rst time u thought u hit bottom.

YOU WILL NOW WHEN BOTTOM IS HERE. YOU WILL RUN FOR HELP, U HAVE NO OTHER OPTION ON THIS ONE MY BRO, U WILL SEE, & PEOPLE WHO DID HIT THE REAL BOTTOM U WILL AGREE W/ME.
I BEEN USING HEROIN SINCE 15YRS OLD & 31YRS OLD NOW. I GET WORSE EACH TIME BUT EACH BOTTOM IS WORSE. BUT I NEVER WENT RUNNING FOR HELP, WHERE I DROPPED ALL MY FREINDS & FAMILY & SAID THE HELP IS GONNA BE IS IF I STAY IN THIS 90DAY PROGRAM, THERE MY ONLY HOPE, THEY WILL SAVE ME, AS LONG AS I'M W/THEM OR HERE, I WILL BE CLEAN & LIVE.

YOU WILL SEE.

[jonny-5]

ya chi speaks the truth. the bottom does get worse every time. but it sounds like you really do wanna stop, and youre definitely not alone in feeling like you cant do life without something. have you looked into bupe? my life gets pretty stable when im on it...

[Chicago]

lil more.
sometimes people NEVER quit till they really hit rockbottom, sometimes u gotta go to hell b4 u get a taste of hevan.....

[rockbottom]

the only good thing about NA-AA is that their lame stories made me realize how strong i really am. also some of the drug stories MADE me have to go to score---what they considered bad made me want to go out and try that sick shit they were talking about:)

[SHELLEY]

I'm with Rockb on this one NA is a cult. NA is worse than the drugs. I know

people addicted to NA ! Be Careful you sound like you are in a voulnreble

condition at the moment. If the drugs were free and you didnt have any

hassles with supply or quality, there wouldn't be a problem would there.

Its not the drugs your fed up with, its all the other crap surrounding the drugs.


NA loves to say that they are understanding and non-judgemental
"we are all the same, we've all been there before"
but like most cults, they are extremely non-judgemental
as long as you agree with everything they say

[nick]

NA is the only peer led,free group I know of and it works for some folks.Hell,there's very little help with trying to overcome addiction.So,cut NA a little slack.......you may need it one day.

[jonny-5]

NA is the only peer led,free group I know of and it works for some folks.Hell,there's very little help with trying to overcome addiction.So,cut NA a little slack.......you may need it one day.

i have to agree with nick, it does help some people, and since it does its alright in my book. the trick to succeeding in NA is doing EVERYTHING they say. thats why if you try to argue over certain points they are gonna tell you youre wrong.

dont get me wrong, ive had PLENTY of bad experiences there, enough to where i said "fuck this place" and never went back. theres something about going to meetings every day for life and getting a sponser that im just not willing to do. it seems kinda like a lifelong jail sentence. but so is addiction. but you have to do everything they tell you, and do it honestly for it to work. thats why most people fail there, they just arent willing to do ANYTHING to get sober. the people who are are people who have been through some really fucked up shit in their lives and life has truely kicked them in the balls and thrown them in the gutter. so those types are willing to do whatever it takes.

[Porcupine]

Thankyou guys.

If I had to construct a list of my favorite things about my "Existential Life" it would be Drugs, Music, Literature, Family, and Nature. I need to kick the drugs. Maybe in a perfect world I could continue to use and use and use. But in the here and now, I can't. I don't believe drugs are bad, but for my situation they are. Considering I steal most my oxys from family. I avoid outtings to get high, and i'm always pissed if i'm not high. It's not right to put the people I love through that for my personal gratifaction. That is the reason I want to stop. That and I want to be free of something that will hold me back if I don't have it(drugs). I was seriously considering going to NA, but if you guys' are saying it's so bad I might check out a meeting and make my own opinion....but I can't say I didn't expect such a negative response regaurding NA. I didn't have too high of expectations after reading the AA book(that was a fucking joke).

I will keep you updated. Here's my update for today:

I admitted to my family that I had been stealing from them. I admitted this yesterday. They were nothing but helpful, and supportive. This morning I woke up fully prepared to start my withdrawals. And I did so until about 2 hours ago. I folded. I fucking folded, already. 1 day in.

Tomorrow I hope to do much better.

[SynthMorph]

You should make plans to be self sufficient with your habit there instead of stealing from family just in case things don't work out which I can pretty much guarantee. Oh ya, that and you're no where damn near rock bottom. Sorry bro, being a bit of a drama queen? Rock bottom is on the street with no teeth, AIDS, HEP C infected, brain damaged and wearing the same clothes for the last 4 years, existing between WD and well, prison and the street and prostituting yourself for a fix.

[Consumed.]

youre too young to be having horrible life effects from drugs. Quit while you ahead, (or behind) however you look at it.

[jonny-5]

You should make plans to be self sufficient with your habit there instead of stealing from family just in case things don't work out which I can pretty much guarantee.


damn dude, even if its true you dont gotta say it! one of the reasons that i never stayed sober the first couple times i tried was because people kept telling me i wasnt done, i was gonna relapse over and over and that its a part of recovery. i thought i was done? but people told me that, and so i would relapse, thinking "hey, im recovering!"

[SynthMorph]

I'm the guy that knows what everyone is thinking but doesn't have the balls to say and says it himself. You gotta get that shit out there. This is real life, not a fairy tale. I'm not gonna say shit I don't mean, "oh good luck, you'll do great," because that's not reality. The truth of the matter is once opiate addiction has a grasp on you, the deal is pretty much sealed for life. It changes you forever. There are freak occurences out there with extremely strong willed individuals determined to make a change, this is guy isn't that. Even if you shake it you have that psychological addiction you have to fend off for the rest of your time on this earth.

[Dan Steely]

A good friend of mine used to suffer from severe anxiety for no apparent reason. Finally he went to a doctor who put him on paxil or wellbutrin, I forget but anyways he said it completely changed his life for the better. Opiates would probably work for him as well but a life of chasing opies and spending all your money is just too much of a pain in the ass compared to just taking a legally prescribed pill once a day. You might want to give the doctor and legally prescribed drugs a chance. Worth a try.

[antigonemuse]

NA is the only peer led,free group I know of and it works for some folks.Hell,there's very little help with trying to overcome addiction.So,cut NA a little slack.......you may need it one day.


thanks nick, i do love you for your ability to be non biased when its needed

NA is a great place to go in you situtation, when you do not know where to start. Because it give you a outline of basic tools you need to get clean. They are common sense after you get to know them, but it may help to have them given to you in this enviorment. And it is not a cult or set to any religion. Just the higher power you choose. While I have some pros and cons to NA, I understand how important they are in early recovery. And dont let anyone here put you off the idea. In your case, since you seem so desperate to reach out and feel so alone, this will be great for you to meet some folks going through what you are. the fiest three steps are very important to getting clean.

1. We admitted that we were powerless over our addiction, that our lives had become unmanageable.
summary - that you are an addict, that drugs run you life, and your life is a mess - admit it


2. We came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.
summary - that through treatment, and appling ourself fully to our higher power (wither that be our fmailies, our treatment, ourselves, our spirituality, or our will alone) that we will be open to recovery and clearing our minds, and gaining a better life again. - open your self to new ideas and trust in the treatment
3. We made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of a higher power as we understand it
summary - once you have open ourself to the new ideas, and know why or whom your higher power comes from focus your enegeries on that... put it this way, if you put as much into getting clean and sober as you did into getting high, you'll be on the right track. Give it your all, and let this be your new high - finding life again



then you get to the tough part, step four, which is one of the the last step i worked on in rehab... i ended on five (but have not followed the steps since, i plan to go back to NA, as it does help me... Cause i weed out what i dont agree with, and take out what helps. And for me being around other folks, listening and sharing, does wonders to remind me of where i dont want to be. it can back fire at times, and make me want to use.... but you gotta keep strong and remember how hard you work)
4. We made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.
Summary - i will attach some links for you, this is not the easiest step, its quit difficult and very emotional.... its takes time, and alot of real effort to get through it. I found some decent sites that explain it, and some with inventoies that are okay. Some are overly excessive, mine was not as invasive. but it does the job of self searching, and youll begin to understand some of why you are and addict, and how you can beging to understand the roots to your addiction and how to overcome them
http://www.cyberrecovery.net/4thStepInventoryGuide.html

http://www.na.org/pdf/litfiles/us_english/IP/EN3110.pdf

http://www.na-history.org/index.php?module=pagemaster&PAGE_user_op=view_page&PAGE_id=97&MMN_position=289:289

http://www.earthgroupna.org/literature/ip10.htm


I hope these hel, let me know if you need anymore info

and folks, it be nice to be supportative, i understand people not liking NA, but the fact is that more addicts have gotten clean with it, then any other method of recovery. and dat just be the truth. and for this youngin', it just may be what helps. And also consider, there are some groups that do suck, and some that are wonderful, i think its the crowd, and the speakers that make it. I find AA to be a bit more religious then NA. And when it comes down to it, if you havent surrendered yourself to get clean, you wont be open to everything out there. I fully admitted im powerless to my drug, and opened myself up for anything and everything. NA scared the fuck out of me for all the reasons on here and more. but I went, and i listened, and eventually became a speaker at one. (just the once and i was way nervous)

it is all in what you make it. if you dont want to stop using then it wnt work.

It will work if you work it! (NA jargon)

[Synack]

OP: It really sounds like you don't have it that bad - this isn't the site to encourage yourself to get and stay clean. Hell, just the pictures at the top make me use...

well, that and the nerve damage...

[antigonemuse]

I'm the guy that knows what everyone is thinking but doesn't have the balls to say and says it himself. You gotta get that shit out there. This is real life, not a fairy tale. I'm not gonna say shit I don't mean, "oh good luck, you'll do great," because that's not reality. The truth of the matter is once opiate addiction has a grasp on you, the deal is pretty much sealed for life. It changes you forever. There are freak occurences out there with extremely strong willed individuals determined to make a change, this is guy isn't that. Even if you shake it you have that psychological addiction you have to fend off for the rest of your time on this earth.


your an boob, and dont speak for everyone. cause i assure you some of have a bit more faith in someone so young. its not like he has had years of heroin to shake off. a couple years of dabbling with some opies aint shit, he can indeed assert himself, and get away from that grasping hand

your so cynical

[antigonemuse]

Ps this all comes from a caring heart! hope it helps

thanks nick, i do love you for your ability to be non biased when its needed

NA is a great place to go in you situtation, when you do not know where to start. Because it give you a outline of basic tools you need to get clean. They are common sense after you get to know them, but it may help to have them given to you in this enviorment. And it is not a cult or set to any religion. Just the higher power you choose. While I have some pros and cons to NA, I understand how important they are in early recovery. And dont let anyone here put you off the idea. In your case, since you seem so desperate to reach out and feel so alone, this will be great for you to meet some folks going through what you are. the fiest three steps are very important to getting clean.

1. We admitted that we were powerless over our addiction, that our lives had become unmanageable.
summary - that you are an addict, that drugs run you life, and your life is a mess - admit it


2. We came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.
summary - that through treatment, and appling ourself fully to our higher power (wither that be our fmailies, our treatment, ourselves, our spirituality, or our will alone) that we will be open to recovery and clearing our minds, and gaining a better life again. - open your self to new ideas and trust in the treatment
3. We made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of a higher power as we understand it
summary - once you have open ourself to the new ideas, and know why or whom your higher power comes from focus your enegeries on that... put it this way, if you put as much into getting clean and sober as you did into getting high, you'll be on the right track. Give it your all, and let this be your new high - finding life again



then you get to the tough part, step four, which is one of the the last step i worked on in rehab... i ended on five (but have not followed the steps since, i plan to go back to NA, as it does help me... Cause i weed out what i dont agree with, and take out what helps. And for me being around other folks, listening and sharing, does wonders to remind me of where i dont want to be. it can back fire at times, and make me want to use.... but you gotta keep strong and remember how hard you work)
4. We made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.
Summary - i will attach some links for you, this is not the easiest step, its quit difficult and very emotional.... its takes time, and alot of real effort to get through it. I found some decent sites that explain it, and some with inventoies that are okay. Some are overly excessive, mine was not as invasive. but it does the job of self searching, and youll begin to understand some of why you are and addict, and how you can beging to understand the roots to your addiction and how to overcome them
http://www.cyberrecovery.net/4thStepInventoryGuide.html

http://www.na.org/pdf/litfiles/us_english/IP/EN3110.pdf

http://www.na-history.org/index.php?module=pagemaster&PAGE_user_op=view_page&PAGE_id=97&MMN_position=289:289

http://www.earthgroupna.org/literature/ip10.htm


I hope these hel, let me know if you need anymore info

and folks, it be nice to be supportative, i understand people not liking NA, but the fact is that more addicts have gotten clean with it, then any other method of recovery. and dat just be the truth. and for this youngin', it just may be what helps. And also consider, there are some groups that do suck, and some that are wonderful, i think its the crowd, and the speakers that make it. I find AA to be a bit more religious then NA. And when it comes down to it, if you havent surrendered yourself to get clean, you wont be open to everything out there. I fully admitted im powerless to my drug, and opened myself up for anything and everything. NA scared the fuck out of me for all the reasons on here and more. but I went, and i listened, and eventually became a speaker at one. (just the once and i was way nervous)

it is all in what you make it. if you dont want to stop using then it wnt work.

It will work if you work it! (NA jargon)

[SynthMorph]

your an boob, and dont speak for everyone. cause i assure you some of have a bit more faith in someone so young. its not like he has had years of heroin to shake off. a couple years of dabbling with some opies aint shit, he can indeed assert himself, and get away from that grasping hand

your so cynical

True, if he is not physically addicted, his odds of success go up. The young age helps as well. Opiate addiction has very low levels of people quitting them for good. The numbers are in the 2-4% range. The life once addicted, even when trying your hardest, is months of clean interspersed with runs of various lengths of time. Its just the nature of the beast. Now, it sounds like this guy has a heavy pyschological component related to escaping reality with drugs. That makes it hard as that is a pretty heavy train of thought to break. The best advice out there was getting on wellbutrin as he may have underlying depression issues, or mood problems and wellbutrin has been proven to help people quit all sorts of addictions along with its anti-depressant action.

[Cherry's Jubilee]

You should make plans to be self sufficient with your habit there instead of stealing from family just in case things don't work out which I can pretty much guarantee. Oh ya, that and you're no where damn near rock bottom. Sorry bro, being a bit of a drama queen? Rock bottom is on the street with no teeth, AIDS, HEP C infected, brain damaged and wearing the same clothes for the last 4 years, existing between WD and well, prison and the street and prostituting yourself for a fix.

Just because other people may be worse off in some ways (and somebody ALWAYS is) does not remotely make invalid what an individual personally experiences, or give anyone the right to dismiss or minimize what someone else is feeling. Suffering is relative, it's personal, and it's a matter of perspective.

If what you are saying were true, no one on here should bitch and moan or vent about being dopesick or having an accident or being betrayed by a friend because it isn't the WORST thing that could happen. To that person, maybe it IS, and you have no right to question it. It's like saying you shouldn't be upset about breaking your leg because there are amputees. You shouldn't complain about your chronic pain because there are people fully paralyzed or there are babies being raped in war-torn countries. It doesn't make any sense. Pain and suffering are pain and suffering PERIOD. And unless you stand in someone else's shoes, you stand in no position to judge.

Everyone is fighting some kind of battle.

[SynthMorph]

Just because other people may be worse off in some ways (and somebody ALWAYS is) does not remotely make invalid what an individual personally experiences, or give anyone the right to dismiss or minimize what someone else is feeling. Suffering is relative, it's personal, and it's a matter of perspective.

If what you are saying were true, no one on here should bitch and moan or vent about being dopesick or having an accident or being betrayed by a friend because it isn't the WORST thing that could happen. To that person, maybe it IS, and you have no right to question it. It's like saying you shouldn't be upset about breaking your leg because there are amputees. You shouldn't complain about your chronic pain because there are people fully paralyzed or there are babies being raped in war-torn countries. It doesn't make any sense. Pain and suffering are pain and suffering PERIOD. And unless you stand in someone else's shoes, you stand in no position to judge.

Everyone is fighting some kind of battle.

True as well. I was more making a point that he isn't rock bottom. It might seem like it to him, but things can get much worse and he should be thankful he has family, GF etc. That terms entails the ultimate low a human being can hit, and he seems far from that point. I wasn't trying to belittle or dismiss his suffering in any way. If it came off like that my apologies.

[antigonemuse]

True, if he is not physically addicted, his odds of success go up. The young age helps as well. Opiate addiction has very low levels of people quitting them for good. The numbers are in the 2-4% range. The life once addicted, even when trying your hardest, is months of clean interspersed with runs of various lengths of time. Its just the nature of the beast. Now, it sounds like this guy has a heavy pyschological component related to escaping reality with drugs. That makes it hard as that is a pretty heavy train of thought to break. The best advice out there was getting on wellbutrin as he may have underlying depression issues, or mood problems and wellbutrin has been proven to help people quit all sorts of addictions along with its anti-depressant action.


lets have the psych scribe the meds.... as every one is different, and his diagnosis may not be that same as what you are referring. He could be bi polar, or major depressive, or anxiety with depressive traits... there alot of DSM's out there, and meds for that matter... we cant fgure it out online, now do we have the m.d. ph.d. to advise him. he needs professional mental health treatment. I would suggest a MICA program (with is mental health and addiction groups) good stuff

[HMMM...]

Dude.....to the op... I say stay away from this site and do what you got to do to stay clean. Family is really important and you made a very mature decision in letting them know. It might not seem like it now or in the near future but it's the best.

Don't listen to people telling you that you can't stay clean n shit. You can do what you wan't.

[SynthMorph]

lets have the psych scribe the meds.... as every one is different, and his diagnosis may not be that same as what you are referring. He could be bi polar, or major depressive, or anxiety with depressive traits... there alot of DSM's out there, and meds for that matter... we cant fgure it out online, now do we have the m.d. ph.d. to advise him. he needs professional mental health treatment. I would suggest a MICA program (with is mental health and addiction groups) good stuff

I wasn't prescribing anything, just a suggestion. From personal experience I've gone the longest clean and had a few friends also that did it while on wellbutrin. The Op admitted he had depression as well.

[LorTabitha]

Good luck with your recovery. Tomorrow is another day and another chance. Don't beat yourself up about today or you'll never move forward. You can't change the past.

I agree that you might check into whether antidepressants might help you. At least in the beginning?

Also, a quick note about the "cult" mentions. Narcanon is sponsored by Scientology and encompasses a lot of their beliefs. NA (Narcotics Anonymous) is something completely different, a 12-step program similar to AA. A lot of times they get confused.

[SeVeN]

Don't listen to people telling you that you can't stay clean n shit. You can do what you wan't.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^

[Raisin]

I believe it was socrates who said that if we were to all throw our troubles
into a pile ,amongst which we could take our pick,most would gladly take theirs and leave. You and you alone can figure out what works for you. Most importantly, don't give up. It's not a death sentence. The choices are your's alone to make. If you want anything bad enough you'll find a way. Good luck.

[SurfRat]

You are a young person and you still have many options.:)


The term *rockbottom* is relative and over-rated. It's a shortcut response to a complex question and also to some extent designed to release involved friends and family from responsibility. ie. you must cut him/her off until he/she hits *rockbottom* then said person will be *ready* and start floating upwards to the nearest NA facility and all will be better and you can welcome said person back into your loving family/friend unit and everyone lives happily ever after and acoustic guitar strums optimistically in the background...


I think whatever works is whatever works. There are directions, patterns, etc. of paths that tend to work for some people. Moving, treating underlying causes, falling in love, tragedy, NA... there's too many possibilities to even think. Try some. See what works.


I think it is good for the OP to be here.

Yeh there is a lot of talk about being high but there is also a lot of hard won truth if a person is paying attention. There is something to be learned from *some* of the posters here.

[Princess]

Great post, SurfRat! I agree with you. Whatever works is whatever works. You just need to find what it is that works for you. :)

You are a young person and you still have many options.:)


The term *rockbottom* is relative and over-rated. It's a shortcut response to a complex question and also to some extent designed to release involved friends and family from responsibility. ie. you must cut him/her off until he/she hits *rockbottom* then said person will be *ready* and start floating upwards to the nearest NA facility and all will be better and you can welcome said person back into your loving family/friend unit and everyone lives happily ever after and acoustic guitar strums optimistically in the background...


I think whatever works is whatever works. There are directions, patterns, etc. of paths that tend to work for some people. Moving, treating underlying causes, falling in love, tragedy, NA... there's too many possibilities to even think. Try some. See what works.


I think it is good for the OP to be here.

Yeh there is a lot of talk about being high but there is also a lot of hard won truth if a person is paying attention. There is something to be learned from *some* of the posters here.

[Dan Steely]

I wasn't prescribing anything, just a suggestion. From personal experience I've gone the longest clean and had a few friends also that did it while on wellbutrin. The Op admitted he had depression as well.

Just because you and a few of your friends had some luck w/wb doesn't mean shit. How dare you even suggest it! I'm reporting this post. We'll see what the mods have to say about your recklessness!:rolleyes:

Fuckin lighten up folks. I didn't agree with everything he said either. It's fairly common for us all to have differing opinions on things. It'd be nice if we could express them without having to fear being piled on for them. Try to look for the motivation behind the specifics of the post. I believe in most cases people are just trying to be helpful. Feel free to let some shit go on occasion.

"No soup for you!!!"

[antigonemuse]

Just because you and a few of your friends had some luck w/wb doesn't mean shit. How dare you even suggest it! I'm reporting this post. We'll see what the mods have to say about your recklessness!:rolleyes:

Fuckin lighten up folks. I didn't agree with everything he said either. It's fairly common for us all to have differing opinions on things. It'd be nice if we could express them without having to fear being piled on for them. Try to look for the motivation behind the specifics of the post. I believe in most cases people are just trying to be helpful. Feel free to let some shit go on occasion.

"No soup for you!!!"

if you were directing that at me, please back off a bit. I assure you that i was not trying to come off with brute force. I would hope that youd know my charater a bit better by now. I just didnt want OP to think that was THE answer. As he seems confused and seeking asnwers. As YOU said, we all have differing opinions and mine was not to limit his choices to a specific med or diagnosis, but to consider that there are many DSM's and many different meds out there.... therefore suggesting the same exact point you are...

really sweety, you are saying the same thing i did... but its all semantics in this case, ain't it?

And MICA groups are targeted towards mental and addiction.... Which is the only specific i did suggest.

So i am sorry if me suggeting the same thing as you wasnt to your liking cause it was worded differently. But my intensions were good, and were directed to the OP, and not someone replying him. Im not a mean person, nor am i one to put on a "thou is hoiler then you" atittude.

peace friend, sorry if i miunderstood you post - i am a bit off today

[Dan Steely]

Anti dear don't be silly. My Comment wasn't directed at anyone in particular. It was a generalized plea for tolerance of different opinions and to give each other the benefit of the doubt as to our motivations. A concept that I am sure you agree with. So step off girl.:D That and an opportunity to slip in a Seinfeld quote.

[antigonemuse]

Anti dear don't be silly. My Comment wasn't directed at anyone in particular. It was a generalized plea for tolerance of different opinions and to give each other the benefit of the doubt as to our motivations. A concept that I am sure you agree with. So step off girl.:D That and an opportunity to slip in a Seinfeld quote.


gotcha.... im very sensitive today... i think its PMS time

[rockbottom]

You are a young person and you still have many options.:) i AM rockbottom--i wouldn't trade my experiences for anything as for NA it sux thats my opinion--its a pseudo religion and and a brainwashing tool


The term *rockbottom* is relative and over-rated. It's a shortcut response to a complex question and also to some extent designed to release involved friends and family from responsibility. ie. you must cut him/her off until he/she hits *rockbottom* then said person will be *ready* and start floating upwards to the nearest NA facility and all will be better and you can welcome said person back into your loving family/friend unit and everyone lives happily ever after and acoustic guitar strums optimistically in the background...


I think whatever works is whatever works. There are directions, patterns, etc. of paths that tend to work for some people. Moving, treating underlying causes, falling in love, tragedy, NA... there's too many possibilities to even think. Try some. See what works.


I think it is good for the OP to be here.

Yeh there is a lot of talk about being high but there is also a lot of hard won truth if a person is paying attention. There is something to be learned from *some* of the posters here.

[Badly Drawn Girl]

Thankyou guys.

I don't believe drugs are bad, but for my situation they are. Considering I steal most my oxys from family. I avoid outtings to get high, and i'm always pissed if i'm not high. It's not right to put the people I love through that for my personal gratifaction. That is the reason I want to stop.

I totally know what you are going through. I have reached the same point in my life. I realized that drugs, either doing them, thinking about them, trying to purchase them, or withdrawing from them, were taking up damn near my whole day to day life. I had to plan everything according to how I felt. I couldn't make plans in advance because I wouldn't know if I would be sick or well that day. I started isolating myself from everyone. I literally had no life of consequence any more.

I started at a methadone clinic a month ago and I am finally getting my life back. I still wake up every morning in a panic until I realize that I don't have to score any pills... I just need to drive to the clinic. My whole way of thinking is slowly changing. I'm able to make plans for the future and follow through. My kids no longer have a depressed lump for a mom.

Good luck with your plan and feel free to vent, scream or share your success. This is an amazingly supportive board, whether you are clean or using.

[Porcupine]

Six days sober now.

I started to do the NA thing for a while, and I tried to believe...I did. But i'll get to that later. After NA not really working out I decided to try a pretty expensive outpatient program. Not once, but twice did I ask if it was a 12 step. Never really got a straight answer. Until I went.

Never have I felt so worthless, ostrisized, confused, and helpless as this little gem of a "Confrontational" 12 step. So I ditched it. Instead I read "Heavy Drinking-The Myth Of Alcoholism As A Disease". This Book saved my life.

When I decided to quit I was in a horrible spot and the only solution I was presented with was NA. So I went. I read the lit. and I even believed I suffered the disease of addiction. I tried to fight it but I was faced with "Continue down my path and die" or "Admit i'm powerless and abstain completely" but I never thought I was powerless. I guess that was part of my addiction. The denial. After my first few meetings I was an emotional wreck. I was very close to ending my life. I truly believed that I had only two options(see above).

See I wasn't presented with much else. I heard a bunch of NA horror stories but no one offered me any other solution. I was desperate, and they fed on that.

I am not a fucking addict. Yes, I was addicted, but I had control and I chose NOT to use it. I don't have a disease, I have a lack of impulse control and lack of patience.

Never had I felt so ostrisized as when I soaked in the 12 steps. I felt like a sick, devouring, soul-less fucking machine. Always to be watched, always to be in check else I slip and fall into this self fulfilling prophecy. I am to be told my life as an addict is already planned? Relapse is inevitable? Taking one drink(drug) will lead me right down my addictive path? IF YOU BRAINWASH SOMEONE TO BELIEVE THIS THAN IT WILL HAPPEN.

There is no universal model. There is no disease. That's a load of shit. I mean the whole thing is completly contridictory and paradoxical. This person has no control yet he is able to get off of drugs? The best thing for someone to admit is that he/she is powerless AND THEN HE/SHE MUST GIVE UP MORE CONTROL? It makes no sense. It's designed for you to fail.

Sorry, i'm ranting. NA is a cult. A sick cult. I know some people would say it's a useful lie or "If it helps them stay sober let them do it" Nope. Wrong. NA is NOT useful in any way. It's destructive, and dangerous. It's just so hard to point the finger because it's not for profit, and anonymous, peer run yadayada. I understand that, but to swallow this shit you have to give up everything you are. Everything.

You have to believe that your life has been planned. You are an addict; a human devourer always to be watched.

[SHELLEY]

You should make plans to be self sufficient with your habit there instead of stealing from family just in case things don't work out which I can pretty much guarantee. Oh ya, that and you're no where damn near rock bottom. Sorry bro, being a bit of a drama queen? Rock bottom is on the street with no teeth, AIDS, HEP C infected, brain damaged and wearing the same clothes for the last 4 years, existing between WD and well, prison and the street and prostituting yourself for a fix.

why is everyone saying hooking and sucking dick is rock bottom???
i loved doing that shit, its a high all on its own
i was working the clubs and the street before i got hooked on heroin
just because it's so much goddamn fun

rock bottom for me would be hitting the streets and no one will LET me suck their dick for my dope

[SHELLEY]

Six days sober now.

I started to do the NA thing for a while, and I tried to believe...I did. But i'll get to that later. After NA not really working out I decided to try a pretty expensive outpatient program. Not once, but twice did I ask if it was a 12 step. Never really got a straight answer. Until I went.

Never have I felt so worthless, ostrisized, confused, and helpless as this little gem of a "Confrontational" 12 step. So I ditched it. Instead I read "Heavy Drinking-The Myth Of Alcoholism As A Disease". This Book saved my life.

When I decided to quit I was in a horrible spot and the only solution I was presented with was NA. So I went. I read the lit. and I even believed I suffered the disease of addiction. I tried to fight it but I was faced with "Continue down my path and die" or "Admit i'm powerless and abstain completely" but I never thought I was powerless. I guess that was part of my addiction. The denial. After my first few meetings I was an emotional wreck. I was very close to ending my life. I truly believed that I had only two options(see above).

See I wasn't presented with much else. I heard a bunch of NA horror stories but no one offered me any other solution. I was desperate, and they fed on that.

I am not a fucking addict. Yes, I was addicted, but I had control and I chose NOT to use it. I don't have a disease, I have a lack of impulse control and lack of patience.

Never had I felt so ostrisized as when I soaked in the 12 steps. I felt like a sick, devouring, soul-less fucking machine. Always to be watched, always to be in check else I slip and fall into this self fulfilling prophecy. I am to be told my life as an addict is already planned? Relapse is inevitable? Taking one drink(drug) will lead me right down my addictive path? IF YOU BRAINWASH SOMEONE TO BELIEVE THIS THAN IT WILL HAPPEN.

There is no universal model. There is no disease. That's a load of shit. I mean the whole thing is completly contridictory and paradoxical. This person has no control yet he is able to get off of drugs? The best thing for someone to admit is that he/she is powerless AND THEN HE/SHE MUST GIVE UP MORE CONTROL? It makes no sense. It's designed for you to fail.

Sorry, i'm ranting. NA is a cult. A sick cult. I know some people would say it's a useful lie or "If it helps them stay sober let them do it" Nope. Wrong. NA is NOT useful in any way. It's destructive, and dangerous. It's just so hard to point the finger because it's not for profit, and anonymous, peer run yadayada. I understand that, but to swallow this shit you have to give up everything you are. Everything.

You have to believe that your life has been planned. You are an addict; a human devourer always to be watched.


YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
a convert to the Church of Fuckin Reality!!! you kick ass

[Dan Steely]

I don't think I could buy into the 12 step deals. I am way too arrogant and private.

Check out this site about addiction. It is for quitting smoking but the principles are directly applicable to any addiction especially opiates in my opinion. Whyquit.com It's simple and effective in my experience.

Good luck too ya man.

Did you try the anti anxiety/depression drug dr's yet? Lotta people have found them to be very helpful. Just sayin, worth lookin into.