Dilemma

[KiloByte]

Rember me? I'm the guy who got his first patch a few weeks ago and experimented with it a little. I wasn't worried about getting addicted because I thought that was the only patch I'd be able to aquire. Well, I was wrong. Now the thing is one of these might come around every week or so. Is there any method at all that could some how help to keep a tolerance from building up too quickly? How about using a patch for a week then taking a week off? Thoughts?

[edhorfin]

I'm much better at teaching addiction than recreation. If you have a patch coming around every week or so your letting the camels nose under the tent. It will soon turn into "how can I get X patches a week?"

X=lots

Your monkey's showing. He's a cute baby, but oh my how fast he'll grow when you feed him fent. It's monkey kryptonite....

Ed

[HistoryofMadness]

you should read our debate in the thread "is chipping possible" started by our old beloved and dearly missed friend shaunclo...

search for it, its there.

the short answer is no... tolerance is a necessary evil of opiates, although it differs for everyone. but if you like high, you will most likely like higher better. thus the monkey grows.

[Dan Steely]

The best advice I've ever gotten from this site (but of course didn't listen to and really wish I had) was "keep it to the weekends or you'll wind up a j j j junkie". DV

Other than that there is tons of info on this site about tolerance.

[Inspektahdek]

Alright bruv' you're being very vague I have no idea what you're talking about or trying to achieve in your post. I gather you're worried about being addicted to the patches over time, right? What dose are you taking and how are you using it will help alot. GEL- no GEL, are you wearing it, etc.? What's up?

[KiloByte]

I'm smoking the 100 mcg/h patches. I used 2 already (over the course of a couple weeks) and all last week I was hoping another patch would come through on thursday-friday which it did. The thing is I get these through a guy who just sort of gives them to me for smoking up with him, so it's not like he's a dealer who I can call at any time to get more (a good thing IMO). What I'm really worried about is getting so into it that I start to get sick WDs. How long does that take?

[ZodiacKiller]

Yeah, dude, listen to what these guys are saying; especially the advice from HoM and Dan S. Find that thread "Is chipping possible?", and look up "withdrawal"----you'll find what ya need.

But it's pretty simple: use every day, and you're gonna get the monkey. Fact.



ZK

[ndoftaworld]

Your playin' fetch with a wolf there buddy, or giving a ball of yarn to a lion??

Anyway, just 'occasional' use, even over the weekends, will become habit for ya. You'll think, 'nah, I still ain't addicted, I just like em when I can get em', but once your friend takes a vacation, or can't get them for some reason, your gonna be climin' the walls wanting just 'one hit' from a patch, if ya can't get them prescribed I'd try my damnedest to stay away, the lesser opiates/opiods might not be as strong, but are usually hella easier to find.

Nd

[KiloByte]

Your playin' fetch with a wolf there buddy, or giving a ball of yarn to a lion??

Anyway, just 'occasional' use, even over the weekends, will become habit for ya. You'll think, 'nah, I still ain't addicted, I just like em when I can get em', but once your friend takes a vacation, or can't get them for some reason, your gonna be climin' the walls wanting just 'one hit' from a patch, if ya can't get them prescribed I'd try my damnedest to stay away, the lesser opiates/opiods might not be as strong, but are usually hella easier to find.

Nd

Hah nope, you have no idea how hard it is to find any painkillers here. Anyway the last thing I want is acess to pills. At least if it's hard to get this it wont be like I'll be getting more than 1 patch a week. And also, compared to pills, I'd rather have something which A.) Comes in a completely sealed packet and B.) Contains no other garbage (APAP). I also think the effects of Fentanyl are much less "draining" on the body and I can chose when and when I don't want to be high since smoking it doesn't have to be a whole day commitment.

[ndoftaworld]

If ya don't mind me askin', where ya from? And do u have CP or just like the buzz from fent?

Nd

[HistoryofMadness]

Hah nope, you have no idea how hard it is to find any painkillers here. Anyway the last thing I want is acess to pills. At least if it's hard to get this it wont be like I'll be getting more than 1 patch a week. And also, compared to pills, I'd rather have something which A.) Comes in a completely sealed packet and B.) Contains no other garbage (APAP). I also think the effects of Fentanyl are much less "draining" on the body and I can chose when and when I don't want to be high since smoking it doesn't have to be a whole day commitment.

man you are already in the junky mindset here.

first of all, pills are there. you will find them if you continue this path.

secondly, like i said, high is high. you will move forward if you like high, why not higher? plus what seems like high now will be piddly soon enough. and then higher is just high.

anyway asking a question then arguing with the answers tells me that you already have your mind made up and you're looking for a cosigner.

fuck it man. chase the rabbit. maybe you're different.

[roxi*stardust]

man you are already in the junky mindset here.

first of all, pills are there. you will find them if you continue this path.

secondly, like i said, high is high. you will move forward if you like high, why not higher? plus what seems like high now will be piddly soon enough. and then higher is just high.

anyway asking a question then arguing with the answers tells me that you already have your mind made up and you're looking for a cosigner.

fuck it man. chase the rabbit. maybe you're different.


Exactly, I remember a time when I never thought I could get OxyContin. Now it's harder for me to find a Vicodin. Think you can just do it once a week and you'll be fine? That's what we all think. Do you think that all of us just started off using every single day. Hell no we didn't, it started as "oh I'll just take these this one day since I got them" then after a little time passes you will be bored or stressed or hell just feel like getting high or getting "that feeling" and you will start to look for them. You will start asking people or running into people who like the same thing you do; after all they do say "birds of a feather flock together". Then you will use when you can score and soon you will look for or search out the shit; next thing you know you REALLY WANT some; then you REALLY NEED some. It doesn't matter who you are; you WILL get addicted or at least physically dependent. It's not you. It's the drug, it's the nature of the drug. No one's mind is stronger than the ACTUAL PHYSICAL dependence opiates cause, that's just the way they work, you can't escape that fact no matter who you are or how strong you think you are. You can't change or will it away. As a matter of fact, you are here now. You are looking up Fentanyl on the internet. It's already got you in it's grasp, you are thinking about it when you don't have it. And it's not just Fentanyl I am talking about, it's opiates in general. It's the nature of the drug. Keep messing with fire and you will get burned, COUNT ON IT!!!

[SurfRat]

I don't use very much at all, but I think about this stuff all the time. And I think ultimately it is psychological addiction that you have to deal with. Because many addicts have gone through withdrawal one way or another. But we go back to it for other reasons.

So I guess it's kind of like, how can you have the mindset of an addict which makes you want to use and not be an addict?

Most non-addict mindset type people either don't like being high or don't miss it when it's gone for example say in a temporary medical/pain treatment setting or even if such a person was to experiment.

The way I see it the only way an addict can use at all is with VERY small amounts or VERY infrequently, in other words so little, that an most addicts would not even consider it worth mentioning.


In the end maybe you have to ask yourself, would you rather be high for the rest of your life like until you die, I mean even if drugs are legal, it won't solve the problem. You still have to deal with tolerance, you still have to deal with life, no matter how good a supply you might have. You still have to decide how much is enough and what else you want to do with your life. Or would you decide, even with the emptiness it might bring, you would rather not take anything. I mean if you had to decide, physical pain issues aside, say that is not an issue. Well I am not sure it is that obvious or easy of a decision, at least for someone who has done it for a while.

[ndoftaworld]

I really think about that. If I didn't have cp, would I still WANT to use? I know kicking would cause w/d pain and that would suck totally, but if I didn't have a reason to take pain meds in the first place, I really don't know if I would go to all the trouble.

Like I use to smoke pot, a lot, but have had many times when I simply couldn't, like while in the Army, or my current situation (living w/ someone who is avidly against it), and it hasn't bothered me. But once I have access to it, and am in a comfortable place to do it, I always take that hit. So I don't know, surfrat, I think I do have the 'mindset' of an addict, but having a reason to take opiates rationalizes it in my mind, so I don't feel guilty spending $$ on scripts like I did when I would score a bag of weed.

Nd

[God_Albino]

get out while you still can, the 'once a week' thing isnt going to mean anything in short while.

[Dan Steely]

It really already is too late. He likes it. Cats out of the bag. He's not gonna stop just cause a bunch of junkies tell him to. So what if he's rationalizing, who didn't, doesn't? This isn't NA.

I give the guy credit for trying to be informed about what he's gettin into.

[ndoftaworld]

We're not telling him to stop, I'm not @ least, I'm just saying the quicker he admits addiction, the easier it is to cope. I remember that one day I woke up, w/d setting in and no pills left and doc appt. not for a few days, and realized it was more than just needing pain relief, it was needing sobriety relief. Life sux, I need drugs to get through the day, I haven't admitted to anyone but myself and this forum, but it's still true.

Good luck, hope your 1 patch a week holds out, I wish I had access to patches @ all, but I'll get there, eventually.

Nd

[Dan Steely]

I know what you're saying and of course you're right but it just doesn't work that way. He is going to come into that knowledge through his own experience. I don't see how kneeling on the guy until he admits he's an addict accomplishes anything. IMO

[Mallinckrodt]

I see that you've been here at opiophile for 2 years now. Is this really your first experience with using or is this just your first time with something as strong as fent? I mean if you've been an 'opiophile' for some time it's likely you already have the right mindset for addiction.

I don't know, I just don't understand, you've been coming here for 2 years and now you post a question like you just discovered narcotics.

Edit:

I just checked some of your old posts:

"So what do you guys think? Does everyone become addicted eventually or is it actually possible to control yourself?

Ive used a few pills over the years but have recently found a source to get a lot more then I used to. I honestly can't say how this is going to turn out for me."

Looks like you've been playing with fire for a while. This is from 2006. You know the answer already, none of us have been able to do it and keep from getting addicted, maybe you are different but the consensus from this experienced community is inevitable addiction. Don't kid yourself, be careful.

[Dan Steely]

No shit. The guy's been here longer than me and he's asking about tolerance? I assumed just from the question that the guy was a noob.

Don't meen to bust your balls kilo but that is kinda odd.

Anyways have fun with the fent just be careful as you know.

[Tbird921]

Either try to chip and avoid w/d's or just say fuck it and binge and w/d.

[Poppylvr]

I can chose when and when I don't want to be high .

KiloByte, I thought for a very long time that because I'm a nurse and know a lot about pharmaceuticals, I would NEVER get a habit. (I ended up with an IV morphine habit altho my addiction began with oxycodone)
Do you know the first step of Narcotics Anonymous? "We admitted we were powerless over drugs and our lives had become unmanageable". Fentanyl is already more powerful than you are, bud. And it won't get any less powerful over time.
I was clean & sober for 7 years this time last summer when out of the blue, I began craving opiates again. Over several months the craving got stronger and stronger, and it was harder and harder to resist. Finally, on the advice of my long time psychiatrist, I started Suboxone, because fucking opiates are stonger than I am. In the past I traded my children, my house, my job, my nursing degree and my soul for morphine. If I were to start again now, I'd lose all that plus a new wonderful marriage and a powerful position working with nurses in my state. BUT I STILL WANTED TO USE ANYWAY.
That's how powerful opiates are.
Good Luck with your choices and your life KiloByte. I do not envy you.

[pippin]

nothing anything any of us say is gonna make a difference. Kilo already has his mind made up that he's gonna get the patches from his friend whether it's 1 a week or 100 a week. Just please be careful cause fent is the most dangerous opi out there in my opinion if you aren't as careful with it as you'd be a gun.

[JonnyMohawk]

Do you know the first step of Narcotics Anonymous? "We admitted we were powerless over drugs and our lives had become unmanageable". Fentanyl is already more powerful than you are, bud. And it won't get any less powerful over time.

I don't think bringing up na and the bullshit things it tries to preach is a good argument.

Just because we are addicted doesn't mean we are pieces of shit who have no control over our lives.

Essentially that is what they want you to say/feel.

"Admit you are a junkie piece of shit that cant do anything in life, and surrender to god because your much to worthless to stop doing drugs on your own."

</rant>

[HistoryofMadness]

i don't think anyone is preaching NA or prohibition stuff here. this is a risk-reduction site. i just think its important for OP to understand that this is a full circle and we've all been where he is.

we are all in various stages of our 'thing' - whatever you wanna call it. if one of us recognizes something that we think should be brought to light, there's no harm in that. i'm the last person you'll catch spouting NA babble.

but steely is of course right, we all do (did) the same thing. roll the dice bro, have fun, and for fuck's sake, be careful and stick around.

[Russellmeboy]

Personaly i enjoy NA meetings (a very little bit) i have to go to 3 a week for my outpatient therp. i mean yes its a cult lol and yes theres alot of miserable ppl in those rooms but its nice to hear other adicts stories that dont end in death. I know that im not ready to stop partying yet.( at least me and my rig(s) arent) but i stoped chilling with alot of useless people who just used me and shit. i know that NA will be there when im ready to stop getting high. this is just my opinion take it for what its worth, im not preaching it AT ALLL !!! ill take a bag over a meeting anyday of the week :confused-. but its nice to know, plus, if i didnt hear all those na horror sorries id think i was MORE of a peice of shit, at least i can kinda maintain, dont have kids that i sold for crack, havent been in the slammer etc etc.

[JonnyMohawk]

I don't think bringing up na and the bullshit things it tries to preach is a good argument.

Just because we are addicted doesn't mean we are pieces of shit who have no control over our lives.

Essentially that is what they want you to say/feel.

"Admit you are a junkie piece of shit that cant do anything in life, and surrender to god because your much to worthless to stop doing drugs on your own."

</rant>

I know Im going off the deep here but sometimes na ust pisses me off. Anyways I dont want to hijack this thread. Back to tolerance and chipping :]

[KiloByte]

man you are already in the junky mindset here.

first of all, pills are there. you will find them if you continue this path.

secondly, like i said, high is high. you will move forward if you like high, why not higher? plus what seems like high now will be piddly soon enough. and then higher is just high.

anyway asking a question then arguing with the answers tells me that you already have your mind made up and you're looking for a cosigner.

fuck it man. chase the rabbit. maybe you're different.

Guys look at my register date, I've been experimenting with pills for 5 years and I have less sources now then when I was a noob. You have no idea how many people I've asked. Right now I'm just hoping that nomatter what I do the guy won't give me more than 1 a week or he'll run out completely. So we'll see.

Oh and I'm not really big on pills anymore either, I have 37.5 mgs of Percocet and 3 mgs of Xanax that have been sitting in my drawer for months. Sure it's not a lot of drugs by any means but I have absolutely no interest in getting high off it. The only stuff I really like (oxy/morph) is really hard. Even if you find a dealer there's such a great chance of the pills turning out to be bullshit I gave up looking due to the hassle of trying to identify the god damn things being sold by shady people who stored them or handled them god knows where. I don't know it's just really bad luck on my end but hey at least I'm not addicted to those eh?

Answer me this guys: I've noticed that I tend to prefer to just "stay" high rather than get wasted and use a wasteful amount. How many of you feel naturally inclined to use drugs in this manner?

[JonnyMohawk]

Answer me this guys: I've noticed that I tend to prefer to just "stay" high rather than get wasted and use a wasteful amount. How many of you feel naturally inclined to use drugs in this manner?

I think probably everyone of us do that at one point. While we like to get high those who are dependent also like to wake up the next morning and be able to enjoy the day without getting sick.

I think it is more a sign of addiction to conserve so you have some the next day then it is to get fucking sloshed for a night.

[Poppylvr]

Answer me this guys: I've noticed that I tend to prefer to just "stay" high rather than get wasted and use a wasteful amount. How many of you feel naturally inclined to use drugs in this manner?
MY favorite thing is the first strong rush from injecting - that lean back & smile dose. then I like to stay mellow for an evening & start all over again the next evening. I found chasing that first "aaahhhhh" wasted dope, so I tried to conserve to play again the next day....does this even make sense:D?

[ZodiacKiller]

MY favorite thing is the first strong rush from injecting - that lean back & smile dose. then I like to stay mellow for an evening & start all over again the next evening. I found chasing that first "aaahhhhh" wasted dope, so I tried to conserve to play again the next day....does this even make sense:D?

Of course it makes sense---it's whether or not you have the willpower to follow through with it that trips most of us up. We've got that special junky-logic......



ZK

[roxi*stardust]

KiloByte, I thought for a very long time that because I'm a nurse and know a lot about pharmaceuticals, I would NEVER get a habit. (I ended up with an IV morphine habit altho my addiction began with oxycodone)
Do you know the first step of Narcotics Anonymous? "We admitted we were powerless over drugs and our lives had become unmanageable". Fentanyl is already more powerful than you are, bud. And it won't get any less powerful over time.
I was clean & sober for 7 years this time last summer when out of the blue, I began craving opiates again. Over several months the craving got stronger and stronger, and it was harder and harder to resist. Finally, on the advice of my long time psychiatrist, I started Suboxone, because fucking opiates are stonger than I am. In the past I traded my children, my house, my job, my nursing degree and my soul for morphine. If I were to start again now, I'd lose all that plus a new wonderful marriage and a powerful position working with nurses in my state. BUT I STILL WANTED TO USE ANYWAY.
That's how powerful opiates are.
Good Luck with your choices and your life KiloByte. I do not envy you.


Exactly, everyone thinks it won't happen to them. But it will, and it has nothing to do with how much will power you have. Opiates create a STRONG PHYSICAL DEPNDENCE, no way to avoid that it's the nature of the drug. You use often and don't have it, you will be in w/d. That's the point of the thread after all isn't it. Some people will only have a physical dependence but most of us here have not only the physical dependence but an addiction as well. The addiction is what rules your life. The OP admits he likes opiates and has actively seeked them out so that automatically puts him in the addiction category. But no matter who you are, if you take opiates enough, you will become physically dependent. Whether that dependence turns to addiction, that's one the person.

[Nate]

Best of luck, nothing is painless, when there is pleasure, there is pain, no matter what.

Obviously the longer the more painful, not everything comes with a price....

[KiloByte]

I don't know guys, uncertain times lie ahead.

[ndoftaworld]

Only three things in life are certain (for us junkies anyway): Death, Taxes, and W/D's. Let's hope none are brought on too early.

Nd

[resorcinol]

I don't know guys, uncertain times lie ahead.


You bet.

Before I had a steady supply, I couldn't get physically dependent.... but the seeds of psychological dependence were being planted. I loved opiates more and more

When I ran into a steady supply, that was it, one way road to junkyville.

Just be careful