Proglumide to Kick

[SuperJunky]

I've managed to pick my self up a pretty nasty dope habbit, again. Usually when I kick I switch to tramadol, use lots of benadryl and flexeral and within a couple weeks I'm clean. This habbit is diffferent though, 500 mgs of tramadol dosn't hold me. I think the problem is last time I had 100mg time released tramadol and this time I got the 50mg IR tramadol. Seeing as tramadol has to be metabolized into an opiate I find the IR tramadol to feel more like a high dose of an SSR than an opiate. Any ways I'm going to outline what I'm doing this time to try to kick, hopefully this information will help some one else in a similar sitiation or maybe some one could provide addtional info to help me.I ordered 30 400mg Milid, also known as proglumide. It's a drug once used to treat ulcers that is no longer in use because of advances in ulcer medication. The drug, from what I read in K. Trouts paper on erowid http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/opiates/opiates_info3.shtml , can reverse morphine tolerance or atleast stop you from building a tolerance that is higher than what I already have. I've decided to kick with my best friend. I know I can't quit unless she does as well, I can't sit by while my friend goes through severe WD.So this is what I'm doing. I bought 8 bags of dope, large $50 that are near a 1/2 gram of high quality each. I cooked all the dope up, 4 bags for me and 4 for my friend. Each morning we take a 1/2 proglumide tablet, 3 robotussin couhg gells as well as a large glass of grapefruit juice. An hour later we do our shots which get smaller each day. I used 200 units of water for the 4 bags. I also added a small amount of naltrexone to the dope, a 1/4 mg in each of our jars. We started at 25 and went down 2 units a day till we hit ten, then it goes down by one till we hit 5 at which time we'll either go cold turkey or go buprenorphine for a few days then quite. The thing is this plan didn't exactly pan out we got to 11 and eneded up in sever WD, So I got us 2 more bags each and were going at it one unit at a time. The thing is after 7 days of pruglumide you have to switch off of it for a week, so I have to attack the hardest part with out it. The stuff is amazing, in just a week I dropped my tolerance so much that the shots I was doing to maintain would probably kill me now.Does any one have any experience with proglumide, if so how much did you use for how long etc. I have quite using heroin to taper before, the trick is to have some one else hold on to it and give you only what you need each day so you don't just burn through it.

[Zoop]

I've managed to pick my self up a pretty nasty dope habbit, again. Usually when I kick I switch to tramadol, use lots of benadryl and flexeral and within a couple weeks I'm clean. This habbit is diffferent though, 500 mgs of tramadol dosn't hold me. I think the problem is last time I had 100mg time released tramadol and this time I got the 50mg IR tramadol. Seeing as tramadol has to be metabolized into an opiate I find the IR tramadol to feel more like a high dose of an SSR than an opiate. Any ways I'm going to outline what I'm doing this time to try to kick, hopefully this information will help some one else in a similar sitiation or maybe some one could provide addtional info to help me.I ordered 30 400mg Milid, also known as proglumide. It's a drug once used to treat ulcers that is no longer in use because of advances in ulcer medication. The drug, from what I read in K. Trouts paper on erowid http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/opiates/opiates_info3.shtml , can reverse morphine tolerance or atleast stop you from building a tolerance that is higher than what I already have. I've decided to kick with my best friend. I know I can't quit unless she does as well, I can't sit by while my friend goes through severe WD.So this is what I'm doing. I bought 8 bags of dope, large $50 that are near a 1/2 gram of high quality each. I cooked all the dope up, 4 bags for me and 4 for my friend. Each morning we take a 1/2 proglumide tablet, 3 robotussin couhg gells as well as a large glass of grapefruit juice. An hour later we do our shots which get smaller each day. I used 200 units of water for the 4 bags. I also added a small amount of naltrexone to the dope, a 1/4 mg in each of our jars. We started at 25 and went down 2 units a day till we hit ten, then it goes down by one till we hit 5 at which time we'll either go cold turkey or go buprenorphine for a few days then quite. The thing is this plan didn't exactly pan out we got to 11 and eneded up in sever WD, So I got us 2 more bags each and were going at it one unit at a time. The thing is after 7 days of pruglumide you have to switch off of it for a week, so I have to attack the hardest part with out it. The stuff is amazing, in just a week I dropped my tolerance so much that the shots I was doing to maintain would probably kill me now.Does any one have any experience with proglumide, if so how much did you use for how long etc. I have quite using heroin to taper before, the trick is to have some one else hold on to it and give you only what you need each day so you don't just burn through it.

sounds rough. been there. Have the t-shirt, except I didn't use proglumide. Bupe and clonidine together worked well. still on the clondidins. Small amt of phenobarbital and a (large) amount of Sonata (snorted) is helping. but I'm getting secdonary WD>

keep us posted. Nobody does this type of research except this group.

[Laudanum]

one quick search on yahoo and i can see some problems:
1) perscription required
2) 3 out of 3 had it listed but zero quantity and zero price (they ain't got any)

personally, i would love to give it a try myself because i'm cutting pills at the end of the month and it's doubtful my dr understands the meaning of the word tolerance. what the heck, it's only been 14 months since my last adjustment. can you spell "pill nazi." :jerkoff:

[earthenone]

I once brought up the word "Tolerance" to my work comp doctor, cuz my back pain was getting worse, her eyes got big, she left the room, consulted with the other doc, and came back and wanted the name of my family doc, as if to imply i was double dippin, which i was not, so i gave it to her, then she gave me this big speech about how important it was to get me off narcotic pain relievers, of course i argued to no avail, work comp sucks, they dont care about their patients at all, just the check from the insurance compainies.

[lyndl]

Wow I had no idea that you could do so much to lower your tolerance or even make a difference to the withdrawals that are suffered. Amazing!!! Then again I am sort of glad to only have come accross this sort of information now that I no longer use heroin or I would no doubt have ended up using for a hell of alot longer (even if it was fun at the time).

[lukilu]

Super J ------------ Thanks for posting your exsp with Proglumide . I just popped 200 mgs in the last 2 days and have been using it on and off for the last year . I really cant say weather it works for me because I never really have much of a habit but I take it whenever I pop a oxy or H or Vic or Poppy Tea as a prophylactic . I always wondered how it would work with somebody with high tolerance. Can you tell me how you were able to tell that the Prog was actually helping . I know you probably spelled it out in your post, but wonder what exactly did you feel about the Prog ? Were the WDs lessened or was it the tolerance drop from the Prog? Also I remember reading Trouts paper on Prog and thought I remember him saying he wasnt positive about the Tolerance to Prog and so my thinking is why not just keep taking the Prog except in maybe a higher Dosage say 400 mgs for like another week ? Any way just glad to hear of somebody else working with the Proglumide . Are you familiar with J. Ott ? He is also a proponet of Proglumide for tolerance . Keep us updated I am very interested in your results and hope you are well soon ! Lukilu

[jacky]

thanks for the proglumide reports.

I notice the herbal extract catuama allowed me to cut my doses of poppy seed tea and kratom every day when taking it daily.

catuama is reported to show cross tolerance with morphine.....

too bad the only stuff on the market is so expensive.

I know some people that are looking to market their own blend of herbs that are also found in catuama, under a different name of course.

so far the best toleranse aid I have found is naltrexone, but it starts gettting to be too much after 3-4 days, I would use the naltrexone for a couple days, in conjunction with dxm daily. havnt had naltrexone for a few years now though.

chamomille, rosemary, and a slew of other herbs are reported to help morphine withdrawl in animal models, I wonder if they will work on real super human models......................

[El Dave]

I've managed to pick my self up a pretty nasty dope habbit, again. Usually when I kick I switch to tramadol, use lots of benadryl and flexeral and within a couple weeks I'm clean. This habbit is diffferent though, 500 mgs of tramadol dosn't hold me. I think the problem is last time I had 100mg time released tramadol and this time I got the 50mg IR tramadol. Seeing as tramadol has to be metabolized into an opiate I find the IR tramadol to feel more like a high dose of an SSR than an opiate. Any ways I'm going to outline what I'm doing this time to try to kick, hopefully this information will help some one else in a similar sitiation or maybe some one could provide addtional info to help me.I ordered 30 400mg Milid, also known as proglumide. It's a drug once used to treat ulcers that is no longer in use because of advances in ulcer medication. The drug, from what I read in K. Trouts paper on erowid http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/opiates/opiates_info3.shtml , can reverse morphine tolerance or atleast stop you from building a tolerance that is higher than what I already have. I've decided to kick with my best friend. I know I can't quit unless she does as well, I can't sit by while my friend goes through severe WD.So this is what I'm doing. I bought 8 bags of dope, large $50 that are near a 1/2 gram of high quality each. I cooked all the dope up, 4 bags for me and 4 for my friend. Each morning we take a 1/2 proglumide tablet, 3 robotussin couhg gells as well as a large glass of grapefruit juice. An hour later we do our shots which get smaller each day. I used 200 units of water for the 4 bags. I also added a small amount of naltrexone to the dope, a 1/4 mg in each of our jars. We started at 25 and went down 2 units a day till we hit ten, then it goes down by one till we hit 5 at which time we'll either go cold turkey or go buprenorphine for a few days then quite. The thing is this plan didn't exactly pan out we got to 11 and eneded up in sever WD, So I got us 2 more bags each and were going at it one unit at a time. The thing is after 7 days of pruglumide you have to switch off of it for a week, so I have to attack the hardest part with out it. The stuff is amazing, in just a week I dropped my tolerance so much that the shots I was doing to maintain would probably kill me now.Does any one have any experience with proglumide, if so how much did you use for how long etc. I have quite using heroin to taper before, the trick is to have some one else hold on to it and give you only what you need each day so you don't just burn through it.

I was very happily taking hydrocodone prescribed by one of those wonderful internet doctors who was actually helping people instead of only filling his coffers. Of course, the government discovered that citizens who couldn't afford lawyers were living free of pain, and couldn't have that, so now I can no longer get it. I still had some left when they pulled the plug, and in reality had noticed that it was taking more and more of the hydrocodone to control the pain. I was up 50 mg a day (please.. this is not an entry into the 'who's the biggest junkie' contest I see going on.. I am only telling my admittedly limited experience and some background info) in order to have the desired pain reduction. I obtained proglumide, and began with 250 mg day for eight days on/eight days off. After only a couple of cycles I could now use 10 mg/day with complete success and substantial results with as little as 5 mg. Since the legal source for hydrocodone has been completely eliminated by the iron boot of those angels of mercy in the government/medical establishment I'm especially grateful that the proglumide reduced the amount of hydrocodone my system has been accustomed to. For whatever it's worth, proglumide has been excellent. I believe the word you used was 'amazing' and in my experience that is an entirely appropriate description.

[Euphoricgirl]

I was very happily taking hydrocodone prescribed by one of those wonderful internet doctors who was actually helping people instead of only filling his coffers. Of course, the government discovered that citizens who couldn't afford lawyers were living free of pain, and couldn't have that, so now I can no longer get it. I still had some left when they pulled the plug, and in reality had noticed that it was taking more and more of the hydrocodone to control the pain. I was up 50 mg a day (please.. this is not an entry into the 'who's the biggest junkie' contest I see going on.. I am only telling my admittedly limited experience and some background info) in order to have the desired pain reduction. I obtained proglumide, and began with 250 mg day for eight days on/eight days off. After only a couple of cycles I could now use 10 mg/day with complete success and substantial results with as little as 5 mg. Since the legal source for hydrocodone has been completely eliminated by the iron boot of those angels of mercy in the government/medical establishment I'm especially grateful that the proglumide reduced the amount of hydrocodone my system has been accustomed to. For whatever it's worth, proglumide has been excellent. I believe the word you used was 'amazing' and in my experience that is an entirely appropriate description.

Can't you find another legal ROP online, there are plenty of them.

[euphoria2002]

Helping one get through WDs is one thing, but proglumide is more than that. It actually works by removing one of the main factors involved in the buildup of tolerance.... the CCK protein.

Basically CCK works by "getting in the way" of opiates. Let's say you need 200 mg of oxy or whatever to get a good high. Get rid of the excess CCK and you might only need 80 or 100 mg to do the same job. Nice!

I wish I could get some of that, but my pharmacist friend says it's no-go here in Canada. Shit.... er shucks!

[flipside]

I was very happily taking hydrocodone prescribed by one of those wonderful internet doctors who was actually helping people instead of only filling his coffers. Of course, the government discovered that citizens who couldn't afford lawyers were living free of pain, and couldn't have that, so now I can no longer get it. I still had some left when they pulled the plug, and in reality had noticed that it was taking more and more of the hydrocodone to control the pain. I was up 50 mg a day (please.. this is not an entry into the 'who's the biggest junkie' contest I see going on.. I am only telling my admittedly limited experience and some background info) in order to have the desired pain reduction. I obtained proglumide, and began with 250 mg day for eight days on/eight days off. After only a couple of cycles I could now use 10 mg/day with complete success and substantial results with as little as 5 mg. Since the legal source for hydrocodone has been completely eliminated by the iron boot of those angels of mercy in the government/medical establishment I'm especially grateful that the proglumide reduced the amount of hydrocodone my system has been accustomed to. For whatever it's worth, proglumide has been excellent. I believe the word you used was 'amazing' and in my experience that is an entirely appropriate description.


Did you actually find a Dr to RX it for you? Or did it come from another source ( no need to name it here) Just curious since it's so difficult to get as general rule. Quite a few here would love to be able to get some. I know of one who would be willing to travel to see the right Doctor for a prescription..

[El Dave]

Can't you find another legal ROP online, there are plenty of them.

I have been unable to locate one that has hydro. I suppose I could hit the streets, having been a crack addict's best friend some years ago I know the look but have no interest in going back to "the life" or anywhere near it. The local doctor (my "primary physician" on the health plan) is a sweet child, but I'm afraid that she has definitely "drank the Kool-Aid" when it comes to pain management.. "if you don't want surgery, then you suffer". It seems to me "the authorities" have made it such that you either hit the streets or you suffer. There may be plenty of them, but darned if I can find 'em. It may just be me, I'm not as bright as many of the folks here, I can see by perusing these threads. Won't give up, though!

[El Dave]

Did you actually find a Dr to RX it for you? Or did it come from another source ( no need to name it here) Just curious since it's so difficult to get as general rule. Quite a few here would love to be able to get some. I know of one who would be willing to travel to see the right Doctor for a prescription..

It came in a prescription bottle and had a Doctor's name on it (I capitalize Doctor there because the folks seemed to care about easing my hurt.. you know.. what naive old school chumps like me believed the medical profession was about and what it may have actually been about before big business took the reins) and they made a really big fuss about how much they sold me. They had to have a bunch of medical records from a physician I had seen. I had to provide a lot of guarantees about tolerance and addiction, and they backed it up with very careful prescribing. If I were going to become a raging addict it would have had to be in short bursts. But of course that outfit folded up and disappeared under some new regulation or another. I, also, would gladly ride as far as it took to get to a real physician who respects his or her patients. I've been thinking about faxxing my circumstances to every MD in the yellow pages just for grins. Probably a stupid waste of time, but the only time there is truly no hope is when one quits trying.

[zenpunk]

I was prescribed hydro for 3 years after a serious car wreck 8 years ago. Unfortunately they cut me off and have refused to prescribe any more. Meanwhile someone at work gets a script for 120 10mgs with 10 refills at a shot and she doesn't have a single injury, she just complains of aches and pains whenever she walks in - crazy the difference between dr's.

[flipside]

Don't give up Dave..there are many ROP's that RX hydro and are legit. We even have a whole forum devoted to it;)

[El Dave]

Don't give up Dave..there are many ROP's that RX hydro and are legit. We even have a whole forum devoted to it;)

Really? REALLY? Jeepers, if you like making folks happy, that is a successful post. I had gotten closer than I ever do to giving up. I have an unfortunate problem in that I've found that the hydro not only relieves the aches in my joints but it also makes it easier to deal with crud events in life. That second part makes me a drug addict in the eyes of the people that could help me. Say, why is it that if a fellow or lady) is laying in the street in pain from a broken leg everyone runs to help, everyone wishes him or her well, the religious drop to their knees and pray, the 'authorities' muster all available resources to his or her aid... but if that fellow or lady is laying in the street drunk or stoned with their soul ripped out of them by an event or events of life, hurting so badly inside, then everyone turns away, everyone despises him or her, the religious spit on him or her and the 'authorities' muster all available resources to get them behind one form of bars or another? Sorry.. I'm sorry, I shouldn't ask that. But one thing's for sure, because of where I (have to) live, an ROP is my only hope, and I do appreciate your encouragement. Incidentally, my request for a private audience has nothing to do with my obtaining any substance. I just need some advice and the subject matter could be misinterpreted, and you know Murphy's Law.

Incidentally, perhaps it's only my imagination, but I could swear proglumide makes tramadol more effective.

[okie dokie]

"An interesting side effect of proglumide is that it enhances the analgesia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Analgesia) produced by opioid (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opioid) drugs,[/URL] and can prevent or even reverse the development of [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_tolerance"]tolerance (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proglumide#cite_note-4) to opioid drugs"

[nhop]

This sounds interesting. Years ago there was a web journal called dilaudid.net which described the experiences of a New Zealand doctor who would inject himself with both dilaudid & something called ultra low dose naltrexone. (ULD) THis combination not only allowed this fellow to get good results using less dilaudid, but actually seemed to reverse! tolerance as well. If I remember right, this fellow was down to using less than a quarter amt of d compared to his starting doses, and was experiencing all the same positive effects as 4x as much d without the ULD enhancement!

There are now companies testing this idea with other opiates & doing the clinical trials necessary to bring this product to market. If interested, check out these articles: (warning, heavy duty science in one of these...)

http://www.opioids.com/tolerance/oxytrex.htm

http://www.paintrials.com/publications/lb2005.pdf

Im curious to try this sometime, but atm Im on suboxone & I doubt this would work well. I've actually wondered if the naloxone in sub may have a similar effect. I doubt this is the case, as naloxone is a weak, short lasting antagonist while we all know what suboxone is like....

[Restharrow]

It is interesting and a little unsettling to see that there was a different group of posters here when this thread started. I did not realize it was an old thread and thought, "wow, registration must be open again -- these are new people". Then I saw it was an old thread.

Sorry to be off topic, but this is a good thread to illustrate my point. I always wonder what happened to the people who used to post at a group.

Will